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The purpose of King James

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by Walls, Jan 1, 2004.

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  1. Walls

    Walls New Member

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    Coming to the end of my research, I would like to summarized what I have learned.

    In the early 1500's England broke away from Rome and the Catholic church thus creating the Church of England. Now instead of being a Pope run church, there was a King (monarch) run church. There were people, namely the Puritans who were taught out of the Geneva and believed, that the Church was not government controlled.

    Because of this, the King set out to create a Bible that would satisfy the Puritans, yet would maintain Monarch control. The end result, the Authorized (state issued) King James Bible!

    Is this not correct?
     
    #1 Walls, Jan 1, 2004
  2. timothy 1769

    timothy 1769 New Member

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    I'd just add that it was the Geneva notes that were the problem, not the Geneva translation per se. Of course was working behind and through all of this in his providence.
     
    #2 timothy 1769, Jan 1, 2004
  3. Walls

    Walls New Member

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    I would agree with that, Timothy. But if it was in fact the notes, then why didn't the King just order the Geneva to be printed without the notes?
     
    #3 Walls, Jan 1, 2004
  4. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven New Member

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    maybe it was the association, what the Geneva itself stood for. expunging the notes wld have taken out the direct sting, but EVERYBODY still knew what the Geneva Bible stood for, which wasn't exactly the divine right of the kings! :)

    u've gotta remember that James I wasn't no Indep Fundy Babtist. ;)
     
    #4 Forever settled in heaven, Jan 1, 2004
  5. Pastor KevinR

    Pastor KevinR New Member

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    Some Puritans rejected the King's Bible, because it was associated with the name of a "Wicked King"
     
    #5 Pastor KevinR, Jan 1, 2004
  6. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Great, both were the Word of God.
    Meant by God to satisfy several needs.
    At the time.

    HankD
     
    #6 HankD, Jan 1, 2004
  7. Walls

    Walls New Member

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    Who was the "Wicked King"? Surely not King James?
     
    #7 Walls, Jan 1, 2004
  8. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

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    If the Geneva Bible had been published in England, James could have tried doing just that. But because of persecution, the Geneva Bible was published in Geneva - thus the name.

    Yes, my friend, it was none other than King James.
     
    #8 Keith M, Jan 1, 2004
  9. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob Administrator
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    And then force every church to use the AV1611 and outlaw importation of the Geneva. IT would only take a generation (1644) before there was not market for the Geneva and it was no longer in print.

    When you're the king, you can get bibles printed that support YOUR position. And make the translators NOT be faithful in word choice, but follow your guildelines so your beliefs will not be infringed.

    How many of you think that the Word of God (Hebrew) actually says God save the king?

    Hmmmm. Wonder WHY it was added?
     
    #9 Dr. Bob, Jan 2, 2004
  10. skanwmatos

    skanwmatos New Member

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    Dr. Bob, I wonder if you are aware of the fact that James I died in 1625, 19 years before the Geneva was supplanted by the AV? Do you really think that James was so powerful he was able to reach out from the grave and affect bible publication?
     
    #10 skanwmatos, Jan 2, 2004
  11. Jesus is Lord

    Jesus is Lord New Member

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    Sure! Remember: he is the Most High and Mighty Prince James.
     
    #11 Jesus is Lord, Jan 2, 2004
  12. Walls

    Walls New Member

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    Hey Dr. Bob, the Geneva says God save the King while the ASV and RSV says Long live the King. Does that mean the Geneva is translated from something other than ASV and RSV?
     
    #12 Walls, Jan 2, 2004
  13. timothy 1769

    timothy 1769 New Member

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    RE: 1Samuel, 10:24

    As Walls pointed, the Geneva and the King James share the same translation, and both have a footnote with a literal rendering.
     
    #13 timothy 1769, Jan 2, 2004
  14. Ransom

    Ransom Active Member

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    Walls said:

    Who was the "Wicked King"? Surely not King James?

    Yes, it was King James. He hated the Puritans and never pretended otherwise, even at the 1604 Hampton Court conference which he supposedly convened to give them an opportunity to air their suggestions for reform.

    It was James' persecution that the Pilgrims were fleeing on the Mayflower.
     
    #14 Ransom, Jan 2, 2004
  15. timothy 1769

    timothy 1769 New Member

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    The KJV's preface, The Translators to the Reader, quotes the Geneva Bible.
     
    #15 timothy 1769, Jan 2, 2004
  16. Keith M

    Keith M New Member

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    Sure...but he didn't have to "reach out from the grave" to do it. Seems people down through the thousands of years since creation have sought to "keep up with the Joneses" (sorry, anyone out there named Jones!) in most areas of their lives. Remember how everyone jumped on the SUV bandwagon? I'm sure it was the same with the KJV - it was new and everybody wanted to be "up to date!" So it would not have been unusual for the KJV to grow in popularity. Also remember that the Geneva Bible did not have 400 years to gain popularity...
     
    #16 Keith M, Jan 2, 2004
  17. timothy 1769

    timothy 1769 New Member

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    from In the Beginning, by Alistair McGrath:

    As a result of pressure from authorities, after 1616 the printing of the Geneva Bible ceased in England. The work now had to be imported from the Netherlands. This, however, did nothing to stem its sales. James I seems to have been relatively unconcerned over this matter, and did not consider the suppression of the importation of this rival to his own translation to be a matter of pressing importance. He cordially disliked the Geneva Bible, but believed that his own new translation would eventually displace it without any need for special action on his part.

    However, the death of James I and the accession of this son, Charles I, in 1625 saw a change of the religious climate with England.

    ...

    Charles appointed high churchman Willam Laud as archbishop of Canterbury in 1633.

    ...

    All that was needed was an order banning the Geneva Bible from England. But what reason could be given? In the end Laud his on an ingenious solution. To support the Geneva Bible, he argued, was unpatriotic.

    ...

    The final known edition of the Geneva Bible was published in 1644.
     
    #17 timothy 1769, Jan 2, 2004
  18. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    John Bunyan (1628-1688), author of Pilgrim's Progress was imprisoned for 12 years for the horrid offense of preaching the Word of God in a manner not in conformity with the rules of the Church of England. He was the father of 6 children, one of them blind.

    He was imprisoned at least 4 times and suffered persecution by the Church of England all of his life as a preacher.

    http://www.museums.bedfordshire.gov.uk/education/Bunyan/Bbiog.html
     
    #18 HankD, Jan 2, 2004
  19. Ransom

    Ransom Active Member

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    timothy 1769 said:

    The KJV's preface, The Translators to the Reader, quotes the Geneva Bible.

    I had thought it was the Bishop's, the KJV's predecessor.

    Well, if it was the Geneva, then Miles Smith and the translators were giving a real left-handed compliment to ol' High and Mighty James.
     
    #19 Ransom, Jan 2, 2004
  20. Walls

    Walls New Member

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    I read through the letter to the readers and the translaters kept referring to the sixtus and the Communion book, what are those?
     
    #20 Walls, Jan 2, 2004
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