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The worst 1st amendment violation to date

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by rbell, Mar 10, 2009.

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  1. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    This is scary. Very scary. Seems that because a priest stole some money from a CN catholic church...the government essentially wants to take over oversight of the church statewide.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29595611/

    http://www.theday.com/re.aspx?re=c5eec2d6-e198-4891-8930-8168516afbd2



    This bill would take control of the Catholic Church's finances AWAY from their leaders, and put it in the hands of a government-appointed (and supervised) board of laypersons.



    Oh, my gosh. I guess we're finally there, huh?

    If this passes, then your church might be next. If you are in Connecticut, you better start calling...now.

    I've seen some bad bills...but this is the most egregious legislation that violates freedom of religion I've ever seen. This looks like "legislation" out of North Korea, Albania, or Pakistan.

    I know sometimes we're given to hyperbole on the BB...but this is seriously scary.
     
    #1 rbell, Mar 10, 2009
  2. donnA

    donnA Active Member

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    wow, the governement taking control of churches, that is scary.
     
    #2 donnA, Mar 10, 2009
  3. abcgrad94

    abcgrad94 Active Member

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    What? Where are all those who scream about the "separation of church and state?" Good grief!
     
    #3 abcgrad94, Mar 10, 2009
  4. Martin Luther

    Martin Luther New Member

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    One more reason to not incorporate.
     
    #4 Martin Luther, Mar 10, 2009
  5. BigBossman

    BigBossman Active Member

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    If that happens, how long will it be before they start trying to take control of our Protestant churches?

    When that happens, Goodbye freedom; Hello communism.
     
    #5 BigBossman, Mar 10, 2009
  6. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    What does incorporation have to do with this?
     
    #6 Salty, Mar 10, 2009
  7. LeBuick

    LeBuick New Member

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    The first link never said what the change was, the closest it came was "The archdiocese fears it would remove pastors and bishops from overseeing those responsibilities "

    Fears it would is not the same as would... It means he thinks it might. I will read you second link.
     
    #7 LeBuick, Mar 10, 2009
  8. LeBuick

    LeBuick New Member

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    The second link was just more thoughts about what the bill might do but nothing from the actual bill. I would like to see the wording that is scaring them. I guess I'm funny like that, I like to see it for myself.
     
    #8 LeBuick, Mar 10, 2009
  9. LeBuick

    LeBuick New Member

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    If you don't incorporate then you are technically not a non-profit organization protected from taxes etc... It also means your members contributions are not tax deductible.
     
    #9 LeBuick, Mar 10, 2009
  10. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    Watch THIS (today show video) and that should answer your questions.

    I am assuming that the state moving in and taking control of a church's finances away from them bothers you...right?
     
    #10 rbell, Mar 11, 2009
  11. Berean

    Berean Member
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    ==========================================================
    This is the nose of the Camel under the tent.
     
    #11 Berean, Mar 11, 2009
  12. Martin Luther

    Martin Luther New Member

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    Incorporation binds the church as a legal entity to the government. I have heard all the benefits to incorporation and am not persuaded. If churches were just groups of people meeting for the sake of meeting then the state would have nothing to say with what they do with their finances.
     
    #12 Martin Luther, Mar 11, 2009
  13. The Shark

    The Shark New Member

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    Not to worry

    Why is everyone getting excited about a nutty poltician proposing a nutty law? The separation of church and state says churches cannot get involved in politics or begin teling the state what to do.

    It also says that the state cannot get involved in church affairs If the state does try doing this--you ignore it, as the law is unconstituutional. If the state insists, or levies a fine against you--you sue them. This is a no-lose situation.

    This is just one area of many where the state (and federal government) should be told to mind it's own business. Only in a dictatorship can the government run everything.
     
    #13 The Shark, Mar 11, 2009
  14. rbell

    rbell Active Member

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    Perhaps people "get excited" because of this fact: there are at least a few politicians that think this is a good idea. Without due diligence on the part of some of us...this bill could become law. It wouldn't take that large a number of people having this viewpoint for this bill to become law...and to withstand the legal challenges it would face.

    Just because something works in theory doesn't mean we shouldn't keep our eye on it. I'm sure that in years past, there were some that thought, "Oh, there's no way that government would pay for people to have abortions. That would be murder." And yet, here we are.

    So...due diligence is critical.
     
    #14 rbell, Mar 11, 2009
  15. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Public Outcry Quickly Kills Connecticut Bill to Strip Catholic Bishops of Control of

    The formal public hearing for a proposed Connecticut law that would take control of Catholic Church governance out of the hands of Catholic clergy has been cancelled, in effect ending any further formal consideration of the bill. Some Republican Connecticut lawmakers, however, intend to hold an informal hearing on the proposal on Wednesday, and expect thousands to show up.


    More Here
     
    #15 Revmitchell, Mar 11, 2009
  16. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Sounds like you have a problem with INC.
    I don't want to get off the OP, so I started another thread
    But I would like to make two comments. First, the local ordinance may require you to have certain fire safety actions ie fire extinguishes, exit signs ect. These items certainly fall under "state would have say as with what they do with their finances"

    Second, INC may provide individual members from a lawsuit of which they could personally held liable.

    I know this was a big issue in WV, when I lived there.

    Oh, well if your church members would mind having their homes sized by the govt to satisfy a church debt...
     
    #16 Salty, Mar 11, 2009
  17. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Incorrect. Churches have a special tax exemption in the IRS code.


    http://www.pastormarkmitchell.org/?s=tax+exemption
     
    #17 Revmitchell, Mar 11, 2009
  18. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    This is the important part of this issue.
     
    #18 Revmitchell, Mar 11, 2009
  19. tinytim

    tinytim <img src =/tim2.jpg>

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    Also, lawmakers have a history of NOT listening to people back home.. .
    Think of last fall's bailout bill...
    The stimulus package..
    Adn now the pork bill that is being passed through...

    They just don't listen to US...
    They think they are the experts and we are peons...

    So.. sometimes it takes US standing up.. making waves to get attention.
    It's time we take back our country by holding politician's feet to the fire.
     
    #19 tinytim, Mar 11, 2009
  20. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    ..or hello Jesus! Maranatha!
     
    #20 webdog, Mar 11, 2009
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