This do in remembrance of me Luke 22:19

I notice the other thread about the Holy Communion was ended shortly before.

We may have some more need to clarify some of the issues which were raised at the end of the threads, and some other aspects of it.


One issue is the nature of the Lord Supper, either Transubstantiation, or Consubstantiation, or Memorial, which was discussed already.

The other issue that I would discuss on this thread is whether the Lord Supper should be hosted or administered only by so-called Clergy like Priest or Pastor or not.


The final argument in the previous thread was whether what Jesus said " the Flesh profits nothing" is correct or not. If anyone wants to teach Jesus Christ, let him or her feel free to teach Him on this thread, by saying Jesus was wrong in saying John 6:63.

The Title is simpler than before, and therefore I hope many can gain a certain good understanding on this issue.

 

If I need to define the issues more, I would add as follows:

1) Are the Believers eating the flesh of Jesus and drinking the Blood of Jesus at the Lord's Supper?


2) Is the Blood shed by Jesus for the people to eat? Did Jesus shed His Blood for eating?

3) Or did Jesus offer His Blood as Sin Offering to God?

4) When we read John 6, Jesus said " Eat my flesh and drink my blood". Does this mean that we should eat the physical flesh and blood of Jesus?
This was said before the Crucifixion, during OT times when the people had do keep the Commandments of God that one should not eat Blood.
Did Jesus say to the people that they should eat and drink His Blood despite the Commandments of the Law in Leviticus 17:10-14 and Genesis 9:4?


5) When Jesus instituted the Lord Supper, the time was before the Crucifixion, and therefore it was still during the OT times. Then did the Disciples eat Blood of Jesus at the Last Supper? Did they eat Human Flesh and Human Blood?

6) Jesus said this word:
John 6:
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Didn't Jesus mean His Words by Flesh and Blood by His Words ?

7) Some say that the Flesh of Jesus is not applied to " Flesh profits nothing"
But IMO, they see the Words of Jesus by flesh:

2 Cor 5:
16 Wherefore henceforth know we no man after the flesh: yea, though we have known Christ after the flesh, yet now henceforth know we him no more.


These are the main issues.

 

One of the biggest deception in the Christendom is that Bread and Wine at the Lord's Supper are turned into Flesh and Blood.

If it is true indeed, there is no reason to refuse the test of them at a medical laboratory or any chemical laboratory.

These days, Catholics claim that the statues of Mary is weeping and shedding the tears, but later on it turns out to be vegie oil.
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Sometimes it was said that the statue of Mary was shedding the blood from its eyes. Then someone tested it, then found it was the blood of a pig. It was a deception, but many people like to follow such pattern. Why? Because people are sinners from their birth and like to find out to worship as idol and they like to be deceived.

No one can prove that the Bread and Wine are changed to Flesh and Blood. I am so convinced about it.

The people who claim or believe such magic transformation are believing the pagan Cannibalism and are confessing that their religion is the modernized succession of the ancient pagan Cannibalism, not the True Christian Faith.

 

I believe that Jesus appeared to Paul at another occasion than the first appearance near Damascus, to teach him about the importance of the Lord's Supper because it is so important in the worship service at the assemblies.

So Paul said this:

1 Cor 11:
23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, That the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: 24 And when he had given thanks, he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body, which is broken for you: this do in remembrance of me. 25 After the same manner also he took the cup, when he had supped, saying, This cup is the new testament in my blood: this do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me. ( www.crosswalk.com)

You can see " This do in remembrance of me" twice in this passage.


But many people could not understand the passage correctly as the Jewish unbelievers at the time of Jesus could not understand John 6.
So, they thought about biting the flesh of Jesus and drinking the blood of Jesus physically.

John 6
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.


1 Cor 11
26 For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do shew the Lord's death till he come.

Doesn't Paul say EAT THIS BREAD yet? not the flesh?

 

Quoting John 6:35 is interesting, which I thought about before too.

"Bible explains Bible" is not new to me. The best interpretation of the Bible comes from the Bible itself, and I think the following verse support this:

Isaiah 34
16 Seek ye out of the book of the LORD, and read: no one of these shall fail, none shall want her mate: for my mouth it hath commanded, and his spirit it hath gathered them.


Have any Apologetics by Catholics cover those issues before?

OK, as for Medical Lab Test of the substances, it is understandable even though there was no explanation on it as the science didn't reach there.

As for the contradiction with the Leviticus 17, Deut 12, Genesis 9:4 prohibiting the eating of Blood, and the fact that the Blood was not offered for Eating, but for Offering to God must have been explained before.

Agnus,

Could you find anyone who made the exegeses explaining the relationship between Lev 17 and Transubstantiation before?

 

Agnus,

You may be confused with other thread. I think I quoted only Bible on the issue of the Holy Communion. You can still check on that thread that I never quoted other than the Bible. (http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=38874&page=31)
If you believe that the Bible is Anti-Catholic, you may be right because Bible contradicts Catholic Doctrines in many issues. The followings are the Bible verses which I quoted on the issue of Holy Communion:


Genesis 9
. 4 But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.

Leviticus 7:
26 Moreover ye shall eat no manner of blood, whether it be of fowl or of beast, in any of your dwellings. 27 Whatsoever soul it be that eateth any manner of blood, even that soul shall be cut off from his people.


Leviticus 17:
10 And whatsoever man there be of the house of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, that eateth any manner of blood; I will even set my face against that soul that eateth blood, and will cut him off from among his people. 11 For the life of the flesh is in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it is the blood that maketh an atonement for the soul. 12 Therefore I said unto the children of Israel, No soul of you shall eat blood, neither shall any stranger that sojourneth among you eat blood. 13 And whatsoever man there be of the children of Israel, or of the strangers that sojourn among you, which hunteth and catcheth any beast or fowl that may be eaten; he shall even pour out the blood thereof, and cover it with dust. 14 For it is the life of all flesh; the blood of it is for the life thereof: therefore I said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall eat the blood of no manner of flesh: for the life of all flesh is the blood thereof: whosoever eateth it shall be cut off.


Deuteronomy 12

16 Only ye shall not eat the blood; ye shall pour it upon the earth as water.

23 Only be sure that thou eat not the blood: for the blood is the life; and thou mayest not eat the life with the flesh.

24 Thou shalt not eat it; thou shalt pour it upon the earth as water. 25 Thou shalt not eat it; that it may go well with thee, and with thy children after thee, when thou shalt do that which is right in the sight of the LORD.

Deuteronomy 15:
23 Only thou shalt not eat the blood thereof; thou shalt pour it upon the ground as water.


Ezekiel 33:25 Wherefore say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Ye eat with the blood, and lift up your eyes toward your idols, and shed blood: and shall ye possess the land?

Mt 26:
27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins

Romans 3:
. 25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;1 Pet 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.


Does Peter confess Eating the Blood ? or Sprinkling the Blood?


Heb 12:24
And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel




Do you think these Bible verses are Anti-Catholic sources?


http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=38874&page=31

 

I have never quoted any other site than the Bible verses and therefore your saying that I quoted the Anti-Catholic Sites are wrong, unless you believe that Bible Scriptures are Anti-Catholic, which may be true though.

What you mentioned in the last post was that Jesus flesh doesn't profit nothing, despite His Words in John 6:63, about which I already mentioned and explained.

What you have to confirm is whether Jesus let His disciples drink Blood despite the Law given by God.

Jesus said
Matt 5:
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.


Now you have to explain how Jesus could fulfil the Law by commanding His discioples to drink Human Blood despite the Law prohibiting the Drink of Blood as in Lev 17:10-14.


You never answered if the Disciples ate the human meat cooked or uncooked. If you say they ate the uncooked, human meat, they might have some difficulties in biting and digesting, right?