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Featured Understanding the NT re: eternal security

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Samuels, Apr 4, 2021.

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  1. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You certainly have a simple view that ignores context and the fullness of scripture. This instigates you to place yourself as the cause of both your salvation and your loss of salvation. God is merely a passive observer of your actions.

    You become the neo-pharisee who attempts to gain heaven by works. I have a very important thing to tell you. You will fail to gain heaven and you will die in your sins as you attempt salvation by works.
     
  2. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    That would be the mindset of a salvation by works proponent, which you clearly propose.

    The elect, redeemed child of God cannot continue in a life of sin for the Father disciplines his children, but not those who are illegitimate children. The child of God will receive the rod of grace that works to sanctify him to eternity.

    Why do you glory in humans and disregard the glorious work of God on his children's behalf? It's as if you are a self-centered, prideful person who is all about me, me, me. Do you not realize that it's all about God, God, God?
     
  3. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    What an awful view of God and his grace. No wonder you are clueless. You have no concept of grace and only a concept of salvation by the law.
     
  4. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    As I read this thread, I am shocked by the pharisees who still preach salvation by works with no understanding of grace at all.

    Such wolves are prowling among the sheep.
     
  5. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    Well of course.
     
  6. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    Hebrews 3, 6, 10; James 2; Revelation 12, 17; etc.
    Ask any guy that mistakenly thinks we can lose our salvation and he will be more than glad to show you dozens of verses.
    And he will be right, and yet dispensationally wrong.
     
  7. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    To preach salvation by faith and works during this church age is indeed a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.

    To preach salvation by grace through faith without the works of law during the tribulation will be a grievous heresy to be condemned and contented against.
     
  8. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
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    These verses do not support your conclusion, only your speculation.
     
  9. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    If you can lose that kind of 'salvation', then the best course of action would be to lose it, as soon as possible.

    You Must Be Born Again.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  10. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    If you could lose YOUR Salvation, could Jesus Christ have said this... "IT IS FINISHED!"... If it wasn't finished, would God have raised him from the dead?... I NEVER boast about my eternal security because of what I did but because of what he did for me, that I did not deserve!... Brother Glen:)

    Just an added thought... You didn't birth yourself naturally and you didn't birth yourself spiritually either!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Samuels

    Samuels Member
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    You don't understand that the new covenant is about salvation by grace,
    but that grace may be rejected by continuing in a lifestyle of habitual sinning
    (i.e. without repentance).

    Obeying the Lord's commandments is NOT salvation by works,
    but it is simply obedience!

    John 14 ... Those who love Jesus will obey His commandments.
    John 15 ... Those who are Jesus' friends will obey His commandments.


    Does a person get to heaven who does NOT love Jesus?
    Does a person get to heaven who is NOT His friend?
    Ergo, does a person get to heaven who does NOT obey His commandments?
    IMO, the answer is "NO" to all 3 questions.

    For example, please check:
    “… you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether
    (slaves) of sin leading to (eternal) death, OR
    (slaves) of obedience leading to righteousness” (Romans 6:16, NKJV)

    To go to heaven, you must be considered to be righteous in God's eyes (not yours).
    To be righteous in God's eyes, one must practice righteousness.
    “Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:10, NKJV)
     
    #51 Samuels, Apr 6, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
  12. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    Thankfully God is not a dispensationalist. God is a covenant making God who always keeps his covenant.

    Since Adam, all person's have been saved by grace. Faith has always been a gift given to those God has graciously saved.

    You struggle with this because you have bought in to a modern day interpretation of the Bible that misses the forest because of the trees.
     
  13. Samuels

    Samuels Member
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    Jesus was saying that God's plan (and His purpose) for coming to earth was finished.
    BTW, the above is Kindergarden talk ...
    Jesus didn't come to earth; the Word came to earth (and became flesh).
    Prior to the Incarnation ... the Triune Godhead was the Father, the Word, and Holy Spirit.
     
  14. George Antonios

    George Antonios Well-Known Member

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    Of course.

    You've got to run through the trunks of a bunch of trees (verses) to get that.

    Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

    Romans 3:26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

    Gal 3:12 And the law is NOT of faith: but, The man that DOETH them shall live in them.

    Gal 3:23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.



     
    #54 George Antonios, Apr 6, 2021
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
  15. Alan Gross

    Alan Gross Well-Known Member

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    I would like to point out, "sinning", is mentioned in this post.

    Otherwise, "sin" is not addressed.
     
  16. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    You realize you just butchered Romans 3 and Galatians 3 like a toddler butchers a play-doh set.

    Understand the Abrahamic Covenant in relation to the Sinai Covenant and you will realize what Paul is teaching. Unlike you, Paul actually understands God's covenants and teaches us how they apply. But you, you are stuck in a far fetched 19th Century story of dispensationalism that Paul would not recognize in the least.
     
  17. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    And so Jesus was asked what must one do to be saved, SO he walked up the mount and said "CAN'T,......Either God will pick you if he likes you OR he will damn you since he hated you since before the foundation, So Jesus stretched his arms forth among the crowd, smokem if you gottem and buckle up!"

    :Speechless
     
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  18. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    As are we all, since what you wrote is coming from your own imagination, not from any Reformed doctrine of salvation. Your presentation is your own lie you have created as a means of serving your self. Would that you had eyes to see and ears to hear.
     
  19. 1689Dave

    1689Dave Well-Known Member

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    You cannot have saving faith if you think you can be lost.
     
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  20. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    What part did I get wrong? Forget the ad hominem.

    Tell us exactly what is wrong with the content.
     
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