1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Wat's the logical end of Passion advocacy?

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by Forever settled in heaven, Feb 21, 2004.

  1. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    It is in the Book of John:

    [33] Then Pilate entered into the judgment hall again, and called Jesus, and said unto him, Art thou the King of the Jews?
    [34] Jesus answered him, Sayest thou this thing of thyself, or did others tell it thee of me?
    [35] Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Thine own nation and the chief priests have delivered thee unto me: what hast thou done?
    [36] Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
    [37] Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
    [38] Pilate saith unto him, What is truth?

    I agree with Diane that it was a dislocation. I never thought of it being a broken bone.

    The reference to Mother (Mary) I took as a sign of respect that she was the Mother of Jesus. My mother is called "Grandmother" by her grandchildren. Moms used to be called "Mother" back in the olden days. I see nothing wrong with them calling her "Mother" as a sign of respect as opposed to calling her by her first name.

    Also, the part about sensing "danger" when Jesus was arrested...I see nothing supernatural about that. Mother's have a bond and can sense when their child is in danger (no matter how old they are).

    I also saw nothing out of place with Mary being at the foot of the cross and being there when the Body of Jesus was taken down and holding His body. Any mother would have. Someone argued that it was against Jewish Law. My response to that as a mother would be "hang Jewish law - look what they've done to my Son." Besides, Mary would probably be the very First Christian since she was the first to know she was pregnant by the Holy Spirit and carrying the Son of God. I do believe they had a special bond, Mary & Jesus - probably more so than the average mother & son & find nothing out of the ordinary or anti-Scriptural with that.

    Murph, you won't be sorry you saw it if you go.
     
  2. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia Guest

    Exactly LadyEagle.

    To answer the other remark:
    About Mary being called mother... Haven't you ever had nursery duty in churh? I call the mother's Mom and the daddy's Dad. I had an older 2nd cousin that we called 'sister'. Mary Magdelene spent her Christian life traveling with Mary and the others. I would think this remark was a term of affection and respect.

    Diane
     
  3. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    Two points: I don't remember them showing plucking out of Jesus' beard. Maybe they did; I looked away a couple of times.

    They also didn't show Jesus naked on the cross. In Roman crucifixions people were completely stripped and hung naked.
     
  4. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2002
    Messages:
    5,316
    Likes Received:
    0
    My wife and I just saw the movie. We have just a few thoughts on the issue:

    1. It seems to be very accurate historically and biblically.
    2. I could have told you a catholic directed/wrote the movie without knowing it was Mel Gibson.
    3. The violence may or may not have been as extreme for Christ.
    4. The satanic element is one that is missing from alot of theology.
    5. A few lines in there were probably more because Mel was a catholic than any other reason.
    6. Pilate was portrayed well.
    7. I was not moved, stirred, or grossed out. I did not cry or get emotional.
    8. I am sick of seeing KJVO people on here who haven't seen the movie saying we need to give doctrine priority. That isn't the pot calling the kettle black.
     
  5. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Funny , everyone thought it was a broken bone. After all we did hear it break.

    Got any scripture on this.
    I could accept this if I were into things like ESP.

    I never said there was anythong worng with Mary being there when he died or was taken down. Nothing less then any mother would do.


    As when Mary runs to Jesus after fall down carrying the cross and he tells her, see mother I make all things new. I checked my bible and it's not in the crucifixion scene, as according to the movie,and it was not a flashback.
    I very much think Murphy should see it. Examine it himself.


    David, I am certainly not KJVO. Never have been, never will be. I just don't like scripture messed with as if it means nothing and is up for grabs.
     
  6. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Forever settled in heaven, posted this link, and I was shocked to see a big portion of the movie came straight from this womans writtings(or rather she seems to have spoken it someone wrote it, not uncommon) of her 'vision'. Even the name of the Roman guard and the two thieves came from her. All in all, as much of the movie came from this catholic nun's 'vision' as it did from the scripture.
    I think if some people would go and read this they'd be as sickened as I was.


    http://www.emmerich1.com/THE_PASSION3.htm
     
  7. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    No, just life experience. There is no Scripture that I know of telling the exact details of Roman uniforms, either. Technically, what is not scriptural is the fact the movie wasn't filmed in Israel.


    I am feeling faint to think that DD & I actually agree on this!

    [/quote]

    I am KJV and have seen the movie and found nothing wrong with it, nothing out of line with Scripture, certainly nothing anti-Scripture.

    I was not grossed out, either, DD. Saddened and heart broken about what Jesus suffered (but I already knew that), but not grossed out. I've worked in an emergency room of a trauma center so not too much grosses me out.

    BTW, for Donna, pulling an arm out of the socket rips and tears the ligaments and can make a popping/crunching sound. No one in the theater gasped and said "they broke his arm."


    I thought the scene in the Garden - Genesis 3:15 was a great touch, showing prophecy was being fulfilled. And (grossly) the buzzard pecking out the eye of the thief was a realistic touch as well. Even though that wasn't in the Bible - but that happened frequently to those being crucified according to historians.
     
  8. michelle

    michelle New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    3,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Peace and love to you all in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!


    paidagogos quoted:

    You misunderstand the difference between portrayal of events and doctrinal teaching (i.e. content) in the film. What’s the harm? It is deadly and wicked if it leads poor, ignorant folks into the arms of Roman Catholicism where they will be deluded into a false security and go straight to a Devil’s Hell. If this movie is acceptable for Bible-believing Christians, then the Reformation was much ado about nothing. The poor martyrs, who died in the Inquisition at the stake, died for no reason. Then, it doesn’t matter what you believe. I beg to differ. This movie is diabolical stratagem to mislead poor, ignorant, undiscerning people to their own destruction. Yes sir, there’s much harm here!
    --------------------------------------------------

    To this I say - AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!You speak the truth paidagogos, vaspors, and Forever Settled in Heaven and I praise God for you all!

    May the Lord our God shower upon you/us all many blessings.

    P.S. Forever Settled in Heaven: thanks so much for leading me to this thread from the post in the other thread. I have been called a "polite, self-righteous pharisee", for claiming what is dangerous about this movie. I am not surprised as Jesus Christ was also accused as being beezlebub, so be prepared for the labels, and don't let them affect you. You are doing that which God would expect us to do.
    Warn the flock.

    love in Jesus Christ our Faithful Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  9. michelle

    michelle New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    3,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Peace and love to you all Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

    Caretaker,

    That is an appropriate title you have, for this is exactly what you are doing in warning of this film to the flock. Thank you for the truth you are sharing with all of us, and may the Lord richly bless you and all who read your posts.

    love in Jesus Christ our Faithful Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  10. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    I hope those who warn flocks warn about Harry Potter.
     
  11. michelle

    michelle New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    3,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Peace and love to you in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

    Karen,

    You posted:

    Now paidagogos,
    How could you miss my posts? I'll repeat myself. Among other doctrinal points in the movie, Jesus was portrayed saying, "I AM!" Also in the movie, He said, "I AM the Way, the Truth, and the Life, no one comes to the Father except through Me."
    He identified Himself as God and as the only means of salvation. That's two major doctrinal points. There were many others.
    --------------------------------------------------

    what is also important to realize, is that the Roman Catholic church teaches a false doctrine, and a false Jesus -mixed in with the truth.
    The scriptures say, that a little bit of leaven, will leaveneth the whole lump of dough.

    May the Lord richly bless you all.

    love in Jesus Christ our Faithful Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  12. michelle

    michelle New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    3,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Peace and love to you in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!

    LadyEagle,

    --------------------------------------------------
    LadyEagle quoted:

    I hope those who warn flocks warn about Harry Potter.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I would imagine that they do, and would hope also that they do. However, Harry Potter is quite obvious with the fact that it is witchcraft. This movie seems to be and claims to be about the crucifiction of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ with biblical accuracy - but produced and influenced by the Roman Catholic teachings/beliefs. Satan works in subtile ways in order to decieve. Take for instance:

    Genisis 3:1

    1 Now the serpent was more subtile than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree in the garden?

    He works in a sly and not so obvious way to decieve. In order to decieve another, one must make it appear as the truth, giving the truth, but slip into the truth a mixture of error/untruth, which corrupts the whole truth, and therefore deceives. This is what is done with rat poisoning. 98% of rat poison is unharmful, to the 2% harmful poison. Would you trust putting this into your morning cup of coffee, or glass of orange juice? Would you trust it to your children, or others? Why then should we not hold spiritual things and the truth of God in this same regard, or above it for that matter?

    Can a corrupt tree bringeth forth good fruit?

    Love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  13. michelle

    michelle New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2003
    Messages:
    3,217
    Likes Received:
    0
    Peace and love to you all in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour!


    quoted:
    --------------------------------------------------
    Murph, you won't be sorry you saw it if you go.
    --------------------------------------------------

    As the drug addict said to his friend: just try it, you'll love it.

    Why does one need to see this movie to understand it better? I know enouph information concerning the people who have produced this movie, their beliefs, their comments, their inspirations, and their actions, enouph to warn me of the dangers that will be presented in this film. My Lord instructs me to be as wise as a serpent, but as harmless as a dove. We are to watch and be sober. WE are not to be unequally yoked with those who are walking disorderly. We are to hold fast to that which is true. Those who teach a false gospel are accursed of God, so why then should I even contemplate seeing a fruit of those that believe in a false gospel? God's blessing cannot be upon this movie. Plain and simple. Will he bless some that see it? Only God knows, and I hope and pray that he will. Should we condone it, and support it, and encourage others to see it? I think not.

    love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
    michelle
     
  14. GrannyGumbo

    GrannyGumbo <img src ="/Granny.gif">

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2002
    Messages:
    11,414
    Likes Received:
    0
    It's called movie-house religion. In this modern world of lite foods, lite this, lite that, and lite preaching so-called Christianity has fallen for a lite gospel. Less filling, but hey, it sure tastes great!

    Nothing is different with this new movie about 'jesus'. It is just another gimmick designed to stir the emotions and distract one away from the truth. God has not ordained entertainment to be a means of putting out the gospel. 1Corinthians 1:21(KJB) says that PREACHING is God’s method.

    But preaching is foolishness to the world. They need games and parties. They need to feel the spirit and get in touch with their emotions. No time to be rebuked of their sin, and exhorted to be obedient to the commandments of God.

    Emotionalism is the tool of satan designed to be a substitute for the conviction of sin. No one can trust feelings; satan would replace fact with experience.

    And “Christians” will flock to satan’s playhouse (the same movie theatre that shows nakedness and perversion) to be drawn closer to Christ. A generation has been raised who cannot worship without being made to feel good about themselves.

    Wonder how many of these same folks were stirred yesterday in church by the PREACHING of the cross? Wonder how many even went to church...
     
  15. LadyEagle

    LadyEagle <b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2002
    Messages:
    22,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    Well, there you go, Murph. Some of us who have seen the movie were giving you our comments but like every other thread on the board about the Passion, the naysayers have taken it over too. We have what now? 50 threads about the Passion with negative comments by those who haven't seen the Passion and now we can't even have one thread to ourselves for those of us who have seen it - even to comply with your courteous request?

    Oh, that figures. Well - how about all of us who have seen the movie and think highly of it just leave the Board and let you naysayers go at it completely? After all, the rest of us are now doomed to hell flames, the churches we attend who support the movie must all be Laodicean, and we have been led astray by the wiles of Satan! :rolleyes:

    Please, give us a break!

    All this flak just shows me that good old Mel must've done something right for soooo many people to be soooo upset over Christ's Crucifixion on film. The demons of hell are jumping up and down with glee over all the division this has caused in the Body of Christ. And what if millions are brought to the saving knowledge of Christ through seeing this movie? Then what? Will their salvation be counterfeit?
     
  16. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    The roman uniforms would be a historical fact, Mary's esp isn't historical or biblical. This is mysticism, and an addition to scriptural truth.

    Nothing out of line with scripture????????
    I assume(maybe wrongfully) that you have read it and are familiar with it.
    Tell me in scripture where did Jesus fall off a bridge?
    Where did Mary know something was wrong with Jesus, in scripture?
    Where in scripture did Mary seem to know the exact spot Jesus was held in the prison?
    Where in scripture did Mary and Mary wipe up Jesus' blood?
    Where in scripture did Jesus during the walk to the site of Crucifixion say to Mary I make all things new?
    Where is scripture is this Veronica with the cloth with the bloody face of Jesus?
    If there is nothing out of line with scripture then please give the verses where he got these from?

    As we see in the garden when Eve was deceived, satan always uses truth mixed with error. Truth to attract us and make us think it is all right, then the error because lie about God's word is what he does. Just as Eve believed him then , now many are believing him again, especially when they can not recognize error. Or perhaps like Eve, knew the error was there but wanted it anyway thinking a little error was alright.
     
  17. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Edify, even with error?
    No.
    If you look at the top of the BB it says 'the truth shall set you free' This board is for biblical truth, not blatant error.
     
  18. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia Guest

    LadyEagle, one of our lady members wrote me and said she went to a conservative site and a non-denomination Christian site and the movie is being discussed on both of those pages but without all the harsh words and ugliness here on our board! Isn't that sad that WE are more like the world than those we consider the world!

    By the way, the member who shared that with me doesn't care to see the movie but hasn't ever condemned those who think the movie was great so I'm not reporting something that came from 'my side'.

    Diane
     
  19. dianetavegia

    dianetavegia Guest

    Donna, IT WAS A MOVIE produced by a mere man! None of us EVER said it was straight from the Bible and I can't imagine why anyone expected it to be!

    Diane
     
  20. donnA

    donnA Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2000
    Messages:
    23,354
    Likes Received:
    0
    Diane, then if it is only a movie, coming from a mere man, why not admit it isn't perfect and does conatian some biblical errors,and some additions to the biblical account? Seems if it is only a movie that would be ok to admit it isn't from God, but a man. But there are some defending it as if it is scripture, without error, who refuse to admit there are biblical errors in it. If those errors aren't there, as has been claimed, then they put it on the same level with scripture, as scripture is they only thing without error.
     
Loading...