Featured What is first? Life or Faith?

Just wanted to throw this in for consideration:



2 Peter 2

King James Version (KJV)

1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.




Deuteronomy 32:5-7

King James Version (KJV)

5 They have corrupted themselves, their spot is not the spot of his children: they are a perverse and crooked generation.

6 Do ye thus requite the Lord, O foolish people and unwise? is not he thy father that hath bought thee? hath he not made thee, and established thee?

7 Remember the days of old, consider the years of many generations: ask thy father, and he will shew thee; thy elders, and they will tell thee.


For both the false prophet and the false teacher, I would suggest that in view is the opportunity afforded by God, rather than a salvific experience that brings a context of born again believers losing their salvation. We do not ascribe eternal salvation to those in the Wilderness, specifically stated by the writer of Hebrews even as Peter describes false teachers here...rejecting the truth they have been provided by God.

In both passages is, I believe, a context of sinners in need of repentance. They know the truth but have rejected it.


God bless.

 

Hence the title "false teachers." Good to note they are contrasted with false prophets, I think, distinguishing the difference in title between the two.

Possibly, but we cannot forget that they mingle with Christians which suggests their doctrine sounds plausible in large part.


2 Peter 2

King James Version (KJV)

1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.


The damnable heresies are directly linked to their view of Christ, which we can see in certain groups such as Mormons, JWs, and other groups that take a non-biblical view of Christ.

It is also linked to their lifestyles, it seems, which causes others, presumably other non-believers, to cat aspersion on Christ and Christianity. As you say here...

It was dealt with partly, but the statement "...the Lord that bought them" is often used by those advocating loss of salvation as meaning they were born again believers.

That is the aspect I hoped to focus on. The quote from Deuteronomy links the false teacher with the false prophet of old, or at least the Old Covenant Economy. Among the Hebrews were those that had. like these false teachers, received the truth in full understanding (at least in the capacity they had to understand) yet turned from it. They too were considered "bought," so the thing to consider in this passage would be what we determine this to mean.

This again, I believe, indicates the universality of the provision of God regardless of the actual condition of those in view. Or in other words, that salvation has been made available to everyone yet it is the response to the provision which determines the fate of the one in view.

These false teachers are considered bought yet Peter makes the parallel to the Wilderness rejecter, which does not ascribe a connotation of salvation on the part of the false teacher as many loss of salvation advocates credit them with.


God bless.

 

The work of the holy spirit is to enable lost sinners to be able to receive jesus thru faith that He grants thjem, and they will respond by receiving jesus thru faith...

I see this as happening at the same time in how we would tend to see it, as a sinner would be under the power of the Spirit to be quickened and convicted to tuen to jesus, and will indeed complete that by receing him thru the faith God granted unto them!

 

I would agree for the most part but clarify, for my own position, that it is not just a matter of the Holy Spirit providing faith to an individual, but through enlightenment of the truth bringing that individual to an understanding by which he/she can understand, believe, with the prospective result of faith itself.

There are many who are quite willing to acknowledge Christ for Who He is, yet refuse to turn to Him. An example might be that someone might understand fully a 30' extension ladder is designed to hold the weight of the person who has set it up and attempts to climb it, however, that does not mean the person on the ladder has very much faith in the ladder. There is an initial faith which is strengthened by reason of use. A man having climbed ladders for 20 years as opposed to the person first climbing it stand in stark contrast one with the other. So too with those who respond favorably to the "wooing" of the Comforter there is that initial faith, however, the one thing we have to remember is that no man can exert faith in something they do not understand, and more importantly...believe.

The Comforter is the source of belief through His ministry to the world, specifically the unbelieving. He enlightens men by which they come to believe, at which point the response is either positive (believing to the saving of the soul (person)) or negative (kicking against the goads).

To be quickened is the result of saving faith, not a part of the process of coming to a saving faith. One is not made alive except they turn to Christ in faith, which is the result of the Comforter's Ministry. I see it in this order:

1. Enlightenment (being brought by the Comforter to a point where we understand our condition and God's righteousness, and the great gulf betwixt the two);

2. Belief (believing that Christ's death was specifically due to man's inability to save himself and that His death was for the purpose of taking our sin, and the penalty, upon Himself);

3. Repentance (the heart-felt desire to escape our current condition and turn from sin to Christ);

4. Faith (acknowledging that the Word of God means what it says in regards to the Gospel of Christ; that Christ did what He is said to have done, and embracing that acknowledging Christ as the Savior, the only means by which man can be saved).

All of these responses are completely lacking in the natural man. It is just as necessary for the Comforter to enlighten men to this knowledge as it is for school children to be enlightened to the alphabet.


God bless.