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Featured What the Great Tribulation of the Second Coming Will Be Like

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by piziqof, Nov 18, 2018.

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  1. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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  2. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    I find his study to contain both truth and error.
    To get into specifics would take pages, but simply reading the Bible over and over should clear things up, at least eventually.
    That has been my experience.

    Overall, he presents quite a bit of Scripture, which is good.
    He's setting dates in other articles, which is bad.


    I also think that anyone who uses, without specific permission, screen shots of video games to portray the end of the world, should probably get permission before using them.
    He has a picture that I believe came from the game, "Crysis 3" in there toward the end...

    Don't ask how I know, I just do. ;)


    I wasn't always an obedient child.:Frown
     
  3. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    I bought rights to the picture from Shutterstock. Any other intelligent objections to the study?
     
  4. Dave Gilbert

    Dave Gilbert Active Member

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    None that I can think of that would make any difference, it seems.

    Go right ahead and believe everything he writes.
    But I wouldn't.
     
    #4 Dave Gilbert, Nov 18, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
  5. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    If one could find 1000 books describing the Great Tribulation of the Second Coming one would find 1000 different descriptions.
     
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  6. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    It was 'great tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the world nor ever shall be'.

    21 for then shall be great tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever shall be.
    34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all these things be accomplished. Mt 24
     
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  7. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    Clearly "this generation" is speaking of the generation that will experience the second coming, the sun darkening, and the moon not giving its light, which will not pass away because all those things will happen against the same generation, within a few weeks beginning with the second coming, which will thus be the beginning of the "great tribulation".
     
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  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    28 so Christ also, having been once offered to bear the sins of many, shall appear a second time, apart from sin, to them that wait for him, unto salvation. Heb 9
    37 For yet a very little while, He that cometh shall come, and shall not tarry. Heb 10

    Does "a very little while and shall not tarry" mean thousands of years and still waiting? Or does it actually mean "a very little while and shall not tarry"?

    Ever hear of hyperbole?

    FYI, if the sun were to literally stop shining and the stars were to literally fall to the earth all life would all be instantaneously snuffed out, i.e., no survivors.

    I like Mauro on this. Drawn from 'The Seventy Weeks and the Great Tribulation' by Phillip Mauro:

    “SELF-INFLICTED SUFFERINGS

    In the light, therefore, of this comparison of scripture with scripture, we think it plain that the "great tribulation" of Matthew 24:14 was that unparalleled calamity, with its unspeakable sufferings, which befell the city and people in A.D. 70.

    In the history of "The Wars of the Jews" by Josephus we have a detailed account, written by an eye witness, of the almost unbelievable sufferings of the Jews during the siege of Jerusalem. To this account we will refer later on; but we wish to state at this point that the distresses of those who were hemmed in by the sudden appearance of the Roman armies were peculiar in this respect, namely, that what they endured was mainly self-inflicted. That is to say, they suffered far more from cruelties and tortures inflicted upon one another, than from the common enemy outside the walls. In this strange feature of the case it was surely "a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation, even to that same time" (Da 12:1).

    What went on within the distressed city calls to mind the words of Isaiah:

    "Through the wrath of the Lord of hosts is the land darkened, and the people shall be as the fuel (the food) of the fire. No man shall spare his brother. And he shall snatch on the right hand and shall be hungry; and he shall eat on the left hand and not be satisfied; they shall eat every man the flesh of his own arm. Manasseh, Ephraim; and Ephraim, Manasseh. For all this His anger is not turned away, but His wrath is poured out still" (Isa 9:19-21).” Mauro, Chap 13, 70 Wks.
     
    #8 kyredneck, Nov 19, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  9. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    Yes. A close study of Scripture reveals that the ACTUAL sequence of events will be:

    1.) The coming to power of the beast/antichrist & his empire.

    2.) Either the rapture or the Jews' building a new temple in Jerusalem will come next.

    3.) the beast will commit the "abomination of desolation" in the new temple & the marka the beast will be issued.

    4.) God will send strone delusion upon all who take the marka the beast so they won't believe in Jesus & thus be condemned. However, there'll be some saints, including the 144K Israelis mentioned in the Revelation.

    5.) The great trib will begin. I believe God's physical agent to cause it will be the approach of another planet to earth, whose gravity could cause all its plagues, either directly or indirectly. remember, Jesus also said in Luke 21 that the seas will roar with perplexity, meaning that the tides will be disrupted, & men will faint from fear of what they see coming upon the earth, as they'll believe earth's gonna collide with the approaching other planet. In that same chapter of Luke, Jesus also said the powers of the heavens will be shaken. "Powers of the heavens" is an old term for the apparent motions of the celestial bodies as seen from earth.

    6.) Jesus will return, stopping the trib, casting the beast & his false prophet alive, directly into the lake of fire, without passing "Go" or collecting $200. Jesus will then begin His millenial rule.
     
  10. robycop3

    robycop3 Well-Known Member
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    It's VERY OBVIOUS Jesus has NOT yet returned! What the Scripture is indicating is that He won't be too long in coming once the trib starts.
     
  11. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    A thousand years is like a day to God. So two thousand years is "very little" time, to God. The stars already fell from the sky in the great meteor shower that happened in America around 1833, which happened not too long from the great Lisbon earthquake around 1755, and the sun was darkened and the moon was turned bright red as witnessed in America around 1780, all in correlation with the first portion of the sixth seal, which are all warning signs, before the final portion of the sixth seal is fulfilled, which is the second coming of the Messiah. The sun will also be literally darkened, it is not a metaphor.

    The events of the second coming are the "great tribulation", because it will come with the worst events that have ever befallen the earth, hence "great tribulation". It surpasses all the tribulations that have indeed occurred on earth.
     
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  12. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    The antichrist already came. The little horn comes in the context of the fourth beast of Daniel, which is Rome. As such, the only man that has ever fulfilled all the prophecies related to the antichrist are the line of popes. He is the true seat of the antichrist. He already came and has been alive for a long time. There is no "rapture", only the gathering shortly after the second coming. The mark of the beast is already here also, it is the banking system. If you swipe a debit card, you already have the mark of the beast. It is evil because it is based on an abomination forbidden in the Torah, interest and usury. The 144k will be the number of those who inherit the kingdom of God, from among Jews and also Gentiles, who will become the true Israel at his coming.
     
  13. OfLivingWaters

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    If you are a CHRISTIAN Jew then feel free to share your opinions , I do disagree with much of what you have said though . If you are simply Jewish based on lineage and practice what you call Judaism, why would any Christian take anything you say as fact at all? It is only through the light of the New Covenant that one can understand the Word of God.
     
  14. OfLivingWaters

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    There are many perspectives on this, some correct and incorrect. No doubt keeping all of which Christ says concerning keeping vigil:
    Matthew 24:44
    For this reason, you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect Him.

    Live for Christ today and every day. Practice the faith in good times and in bad. Do not be deceived He already came. If you believe in a pre-trib rapture (snatching up) and you find you are still here anyway, then you got it wrong if mid-trib and you her still going through the tribulation you too got it wrong. If end trib and you are taken , you got it right. Makes no difference to what is expected of us - FOLLOW CHRIST no matter what, and know , no one else is HIM. He came once to take away sins and the second time the whole world will see come again with all His angels upon the clouds , with power and majesty.

    Times and dates are nonsense , and do not matter when you live in present obedience always. Personally I believe in the end trib snatching up.
     
  15. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    You cannot know things in the Book of Revelation unless you know the Torah, and you cannot know things in the Torah unless you know the Book of Revelation. Both books complement each other, and one was given through the old covenant, and the other was given through the new covenant. As such, just as the trumpet sounds and bowls of wrath happen in the context of the autumn appointed times of the Torah, so does the "mark of the beast" exist in the context of the commands of the Torah, where the only system that exists throughout the world to buy and sell, which is contrary to Torah, is the banking system. You may disagree as much as you want, but this is the truth. This has nothing to do with being Jewish or being Gentile, the Torah of God is ONE for both Jew and Gentile. If you are in fact willingly using this system, which is an abomination, you deserve the punishment that comes along with it, the aeonial fire. The only way to not receive this punishment is to stop using this system.
     
  16. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    No knowledge of God is "nonsense". Only dogs and swine think pearls have no value, hence "do not cast your pearls to the dogs and do not give what is set-apart to pigs".
     
  17. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    The greatest proof that Jesus has not yet returned...

    Sin and death still abounds.

    1 Corinthians 15:26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
     
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  18. OfLivingWaters

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    Oh please pipe down. My point- you are not going to teach a Christian anything if in fact you have NOT received Yeshua Ha Mashiach. I use both books. The New Covenant however, is the means by which to see clearly the teachings and mysteries of the Torah. No one was rejecting the Torah I am only rejecting any so called non believing Jew's interpretation of anything the ONE TRUE Messiah teaches and reveals. The only ones who will be getting any "aeonial fire" are satan and all devils and anyone teaching false doctrine. The smoke of ones burning can not go up forever if there is an end to the burning "aeonial fire" is a Greek translation for age long burning. Many false teachers misinterpret this to mean there is an end. That is not true. The age long burning last as long as the age of the eternal existence of the new heaven and the new earth. Meaning their burning ( satan and all who follow him) is a burning through the age of our (the chosen's) existence. Since we are part of the ETERNAL AGE the age of their burning will be as long as our age. An age in which in this case is ETERNITY and does not end.

    Age also means a point , or coming into age point in history or rather THE ETERNAL POINT of His Story.
    Hebrews 6:5
    5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come,

    We who are chosen taste the powers of the age to come. St. Paul is speaking of the heavenly kingdom and the eternal age.
     
    #18 OfLivingWaters, Nov 19, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2018
  19. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    Why would you think I do not believe in Yeshuah? Am I not on here teaching from books that are in the "new testament" that began with Yeshuah? Hello? A true Jew is not one who lives by Torah, but one who believes in Yeshuah through Torah. Besides stating the obvious, concerning my personal belief in Yeshuah, everything I have said concerning the "mark of the beast" is the truth, that it is the banking system, which you are dodging by attacking my belief in Yeshuah, which I already have. So what will your next excuse to not believe what I am telling you be? Hmmmmmm.
     
  20. piziqof

    piziqof Member

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    And also, the aeonial fire will be outside Jerusalem, as it is written,

    …declares Yehovah, whose fire is in Zion, and whose furnace is in Jerusalem. (Isaiah 31:9)

    The blazing flame shall not be quenched, and all surfaces from south to north shall be scorched by it. All flesh shall see that I Yehovah have kindled it; it shall not be quenched. (Ezekiel 20:47-48)

    And if your eye should cause you to stumble, cast it out; it is better for you to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes, to be cast into Gehenna, where ‘their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched.’ (Mark 9:47-48)

    And they will go out and look on the dead bodies of those who rebelled against me; the worms that eat them will not die, the fire that burns them will not be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind. (Isaiah 66:24)

    For Mount Zion will come into existence from the second coming of the Messiah, and will flow with lava to the south, to Negev, and to the North, to Jerusalem, to the valley of Hinnom, which is outside the southern wall of Old Jerusalem, which is why Yeshuah called the place of fire "Gehenna". And because it will be a lake of lava is why the fire is unquenchable. Don't believe me? Go to Hawaii and try throwing water on top of lava. It is "aeonial" because it will be a lava that will flow for one aeon, the aeon of the rulership of the Messiah. Once his rulership is over, heaven and earth will pass away, INCLUDING this aeonial fire, which implies it is not eternal as your pastors say it is.

    Also, God has predestined who will be delivered and who will not be. There would be no purpose in God predestining most all man to suffer eternally. Their only purpose is to exist is to be judged, and then to be destroyed, because they were appointed to be sinners, to thus be destroyed, to thus demonstrate the power and wrath and judgment of God.
     
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