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Who is the one chosen from the womb

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by psalms109:31, Jan 14, 2012.

  1. psalms109:31

    psalms109:31 New Member

    Jun 5, 2006
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    Isaiah 44
    Israel the Chosen
    1 “But now listen, Jacob, my servant,
    Israel, whom I have chosen.
    2 This is what the LORD says—
    he who made you, who formed you in the womb,
    and who will help you:
    Do not be afraid, Jacob, my servant,
    Jeshurun,[Jeshurun means the upright one, that is, Israel.] whom I have chosen.
    3 For I will pour water on the thirsty land,
    and streams on the dry ground;
    I will pour out my Spirit on your offspring,
    and my blessing on your descendants.
    4 They will spring up like grass in a meadow,
    like poplar trees by flowing streams.
    5 Some will say, ‘I belong to the LORD’;
    others will call themselves by the name of Jacob;
    still others will write on their hand, ‘The LORD’s,’
    and will take the name Israel.

    Is it Israel, Jacob, Melchizedek, is it David, or is it the up right one who can only be Jesus and those who are in Him, Jesus being the womb that God forms and changes us to be the righteousness's of Jesus Christ the one to come through the prophets or the one who has already come for those after Jesus Christ glorified or does He do this in the womb of our mother while we are in her womb?

    Does he start changing us before we come to God or after we trust in God alone for our salvation?
  2. convicted1

    convicted1 Guest

    Jan 31, 2007
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    God's true Elect is His Son, Jesus(Isaiah 42). We who are saved are grafted into His election, the true Vine, the true Israel.
  3. OldRegular

    OldRegular Well-Known Member

    Nov 21, 2004
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    Pleased to see that you have endorsed the Doctrine of Grace O convicted1!
  4. beameup

    beameup Member

    May 20, 2011
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    I would disagree as to your meaning of Yĕshuruwn, as it is a direct reference to Yeshua [Jesus].
    "Jacob" is (genetic) Israel. Unless you are of Jewish descent, you cannot claim to be "Jacob".

    Perhaps it would be worth looking at the next section in ch. 44:6-7
    Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no other God.
    And who, as I, shall call, and shall declare it, and set it in order for me, since I appointed the ancient people [genetic Israel] and the things
    that are coming, and shall come, let them shew unto them.

    I have no doubt but that this section of Isaiah will be instrumental in bringing the "Remnant" of (genetic) Israel to faith in Jesus as Messiah
    during those dark final hours of the Great Tribulation.

    Isaiah 44:1-5 gives us a glimpse of born-again (genetic) Israel as they enter the Millennial Reign of Beloved ("david"), and they proudly proclaim
    that Jesus (Yeshua) is their God - even going so far as to put His name on their hand (an indirect reference to the "mark of the Beast" which they rejected).

    Of course I, as a member of the Body/Bride of Christ will not "repopulate" the earth as the surviving remnant of (genetic) Israel will, as I will have the oiketerion (οἰκητήριον).

    Isaiah 44:3b: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:
    If you are not a living, breathing, Human being, you cannot have "offspring" or "seed". :)

    PS: As to the title of your thread, Jacob (genetic) Israel was "chosen from the womb".
    Romans 9:13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.
    Romans 9:11a For the children [Jacob & Esau] being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil,
    that the purpose of God according to election might stand
    -- Jacob was chosen from the womb; he was ordained by God to become (genetic) Israel.
    #4 beameup, Jan 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 21, 2012
  5. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Mar 25, 2010
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    The Servant Of The Lord...is The True Israel of God.

    All believers are seen to be in Covenant Union with Him.......

    This is why many understand the necessity of particular redemption

    Isa.49 1:1-8..

    Our eternal High Priest..intercedes eternally for all those for whom he died.

    10By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

    11And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:

    12But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

    13From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.

    14For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.
    15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,

    16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

    17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

    18Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.

    19Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

    20By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh;

    21And having an high priest over the house of God;

    22Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

    23Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised;)
    #5 Iconoclast, Jan 21, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 21, 2012
  6. psalms109:31

    psalms109:31 New Member

    Jun 5, 2006
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    From O.P.
    So are you saying this is your choice?

    The only upright one is Jesus so Jesus is the true Israel.
  7. psalms109:31

    psalms109:31 New Member

    Jun 5, 2006
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    God choose Jacob before he did any right or wrong to be the line to bring Jesus into the world, just like He choose Jesus before He did any right or wrong to be the salvation of the world to those who trust in Him. His election will stand and God has no reason to lie whosoever believes in Jesus will be saved.

    We cannot be like Adam who did not believe God that he shall surely die when you eat from the tree of the knowledge of God or evil, So trust in Jesus and you will be saved.

    If Adam did not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil would he be saved by what he did or what he didn't do? To trust in God there is no work.
    #7 psalms109:31, Jan 22, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 22, 2012