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Why is life in prison more "Christian" than the death penalty ?

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Bro. Curtis, Sep 25, 2011.

  1. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    Can we settle this ?


    If we are not to use the death penalty because Christ rescinded the "eye for an eye" command, then why is ANY punishment appropriate ?


    What is the "Christian" response to the violent lawbreakers ?
     
  2. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    Because for most people in the slammer prison is nice than living at home.
     
  3. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    From a philosophical and theological perspective, it may make an interesting discussion. However from the view of civil government, it is irrelevant. The nation is not governed by the dictates of the Bible, but rather from the Constitution of the United States, the constitutions of the states, statutory law and case law.

    While the emotional desire for vengeance may find the death penalty gratifying, I oppose it for several reasons, among them:

    - The large number of convicts found to be innocent by new technology
    - The failure of capital punishment as a deterrent
    - A personal conviction that we should not as a society condone killing
    - The inequitable aspects of the justice system
     
  4. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    The death penalty is punishment, not vengeance.

    The rest of your post lacks any substance, proof, or biblical reference. Personal conviction over the word of God.

    I am asking when Christ told us not to use capital punishment, in accordance with the law.
     
  5. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    And I pointed out, it is irrelevant under the laws of the US. Your question could be turned around to ask when did he tell us TO use it? Or when did he tell us not to have juries. Or not to have flags in the courtroom. The question has no bearing. The Bible record of Jesus' views is silent on many matters. However, one may view his compassion and forgiveness (e.g. the woman at the well, the man about to be stoned, etc.) that punishment is not always in line with his views.
     
  6. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    The question has bearing. This country uses the death penalty, and some folks, including some Christians tell us it is against God's will.

    As far as the woman at the well, she was NOT going to be put to death in accordance with Old Testament law, so if anything, that has no bearing on the discussion.

    The episode of Jesus stopping a MAN from being stoned escapes me. I would like to address it, if you could give me a reference.
     
  7. canadyjd

    canadyjd Active Member

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    I don't believe Christians should support the death penalty based on scripture.

    Paul tells us in I Tim. 1:16 that our Lord Jesus Christ gave Christians an example to follow. The example was to show mercy with perfect patience to the worst of sinners, even murderers like Paul. Support for the death penalty is contrary to that command.

    Jesus changed the conditions for implementing the death penalty in John 8, with the woman caught in adultery. He referred to implementing the death penalty when He said the one who is without sin among them is the one to cast the first stone. According to O.T. Law, the 2 or 3 witnesses are the first to cast stones in the execution. Jesus changed that to the "one who is without sin". We do not have the wisdom to implement the death penalty. Only God, since He is without sin, has such wisdom and righteousness.

    As far as your concern that such beliefs lead to not punishing anyone for anything, I find that argument to be a red herring/straw man...etc..etc... it has no basis in reality.

    The difference is .... death. I oppose executing people... I don't oppose punishing people for their crimes.

    What makes for an appropriate punishment for various crimes is a separate issue, and yes, I believe you can still show mercy to someone and still support punishment for their crimes.

    As to your question about whether we can settle this issue.... I am not particularly hopeful given the responses I have seen in other threads. Over 60% would support executing a fellow Christian knowing that God was using them to further the cause of Christ in the world.

    I really do find that shocking.

    peace to you:praying:
     
  8. Benjamin

    Benjamin Well-Known Member
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    The question becomes very relevant “IF” the people of the that civil government that do dictate the law are guided on their values of right and wrong through a Christian perspective by interpretations which come from the Bible.
     
  9. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    The woman caught in adultery was not going to be put to death according to God's law. Her example is not a good one. It is a favorite of death-penalty opponents, but you have to leave out a bunch of scripture to say Jesus did that to show the death penalty was wrong.
     
  10. matt wade

    matt wade Well-Known Member

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    Can you elaborate on your answer? How, exactly, was she "not going to be put to death according to God's law"?

    What scripture is left out?
     
  11. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    Simply put, God's law required the woman, and the man involved to BOTH be put to death. There are also issues of witnesses, and the fact that the woman was held unlawfully.
     
    #11 Bro. Curtis, Sep 25, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 25, 2011
  12. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    So is our response to violence to be "go, and sin no more" ?

    Hardly a red-herring argument.
     
  13. carpro

    carpro Well-Known Member
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    There is no doubt that capital punishment is justified in the Old Testament.

    Jesus, even though a victim of capital punishment himself, did not condemn it. And there are other places in the New Testament where it is alluded to , but still not condemned.

    My conclusion is that it the Bible makes it clear there is a justifiable need for capital punishment administered by the state after due process.
     
  14. Matt Black

    Matt Black Active Member
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    What Canadyjd said. Plus there are the issues of wrongful convictions and also a longer opportunity to repent and turn to Christ.
     
  15. targus

    targus New Member

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    Wrongful convictions - using that argument then no one should be put in jail either. The possibility exits that someone could be wrongfully convicted and thus unfairly suffer the loss of freedom. Would you accept that sort of justice as the logical extension of your argument?


    Repenting - it seems to me that someone who is facing immediate death would have a greater motivation to accept Christ than someone who is sitting on death row for 20 years. Also why do you think that the Holy Spirit needs the extra time to convict a killer of his/her sin?
     
  16. Matt Black

    Matt Black Active Member
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    Why did He need 16 years to convict me?
     
  17. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    I am seeing no solid biblical reason to ban the death penalty. Nobody has offered anything but emotion trumping the word of God. Sorry, folks, but I see a bunch of people here using their own limited understanding to tell me the bible is wrong.
     
  18. targus

    targus New Member

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    The Holy Spirit convicts as the Holy Spirit convicts.

    You however are the one that is suggesting that we need to make decisions based on giving the Holy Spirit more time therefore you are the one that needs to defend that notion.

    What about my question concerning the injustice of imprisionment of a possibly innocent person? Would you accept not putting anyone in jail on the chance that an innocent person was wrongly convicted of a crime?
     
  19. Bro. Curtis

    Bro. Curtis <img src =/curtis.gif>
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    That was my point. Thanx, T-Man.
     
  20. freeatlast

    freeatlast New Member

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    The Lord did not resend the death penalty as some claim. He gave the eye for eye command in the OT but the Jew had taken it for personal revenge and the same Lord in the NT was correcting the misuse of the original command not doing away with it. It was never for personal revenge but a way to show and limit how justice should be carried out by the government in a proper proportion for the crime committed.

    The death penalty was given of God so it is of God for the carrying out of justice through the government and remains today. It is putting criminals in prison that is the sin not the death penalty. God never commanded prison for crimes.

    You can rest assured that anyone who claims to be a Christian and stands against the death penalty today would stand against it when it was given. Time periods does not change hearts. This is not a good or bad issue, but a heart issue that stands against the word of God. Those who oppose the death penalty do so in full rebellion against God.

    While they claim compassion, mercy, and love, they see through blinded eyes as have been blinded by their rebellious hearts because of a lack of faith to believe the God they claim to follow. The death penalty was given by God, is of God, and God has not changed and sadly neither has some who claim to know Him as their hearts remain in rebellion against His authority.
     
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