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Women in Leadership (not as pastor, but in leadership)

Discussion in 'Fundamental Baptist Forum' started by mercy4all, Nov 18, 2008.

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  1. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Correct, and if you remember my position on that matter I see that as a flaw in today's local church. It is the same thing as having a woman pastor as both violate that requirement, IMO.
     
    #81 webdog, Nov 16, 2009
  2. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

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    I do indeed remember, and while we don't agree on the topic, I sincerely gotta give you kuddos for being very consistent on the application. :applause:
     
    #82 Johnv, Nov 16, 2009
  3. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    I do not see leadership and the pastorate as one and the same. There's a difference.
     
    #83 TCGreek, Nov 16, 2009
  4. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    You are correct. A pastor has to be a leader, but a leader doesn't have to be a pastor. I had elder on the mind...
     
    #84 webdog, Nov 16, 2009
  5. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Yes, I don't see Scripture authorizing women elders. Deacons, yes.
     
    #85 TCGreek, Nov 16, 2009
  6. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    I had deacons on the mind as well :laugh:
     
    #86 webdog, Nov 16, 2009
  7. John Toppass

    John Toppass Active Member
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    Just because Paul does not say what some would rather he said, doesn't mean Paul was not clear in what he did say.:flower:
     
    #87 John Toppass, Nov 16, 2009
  8. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Well, no way out for me.

    But I see Pheobe of Romans 16:1 as a deaconess.
     
    #88 TCGreek, Nov 16, 2009
  9. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    Deacons were not leaders; they were servants.
     
    #89 Marcia, Nov 16, 2009
  10. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Jesus says a leader is a servant and slave (Matt. 20:25-28).
     
    #90 TCGreek, Nov 17, 2009
  11. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
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    Was she in the position of a deacon or was she a servant? We can't tell from the context of the verse.
     
    #91 annsni, Nov 17, 2009
  12. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    A leader has to be a servant, but a servant doesn't have to be a leader.
     
    #92 webdog, Nov 17, 2009
  13. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    I disagree. They had the same requirements as the elders (except for teaching). They clearly were leaders of the servant ministry. All church members are to serve and be servants and they need someone to lead them which should not be the elders.
     
    #93 webdog, Nov 17, 2009
  14. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Well, I'm not the only one who sees her as a deacon and that the context supports such a conclusion.
     
    #94 TCGreek, Nov 17, 2009
  15. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Fair enough, as far as recognition goes.
     
    #95 TCGreek, Nov 17, 2009
  16. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
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    You mean that the context supports her being in leadership?
     
    #96 annsni, Nov 17, 2009
  17. Jerome

    Jerome Well-Known Member
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    Faith:
    Baptist
    Romans 16:2 (ESV)
    that you may welcome her in the Lord in a way worthy of the saints, and help her in whatever she may need from you, for she has been a patron of many and of myself as well.

    How that got past the ESV Gender-Agitprop Committee I'll never know:laugh:

    Online Etymological Dictionary: patron comes from Latin pater "father" and means "a lord-master".

    Strong's says the Greek word signifies "a woman set over others".

    She probably ran the cradle roll:laugh:
     
    #97 Jerome, Nov 17, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 17, 2009
  18. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
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    Hmmm - we have LOTS of women over others in our church.

    I'm over all of the computers that project stuff.

    One woman is over all of the women's ministries.

    Another is over all of the children's ministries.

    Another runs the preschool.

    Another is in charge of the nurseries and managing the facilities use each week. She also is in charge of any of the large gatherings we have.

    Another one is in charge of all of the counseling to women and children - and manages the other counselors.

    Oh - and there have been many men instructed to help them out in their various ministries. But none of them are in charge of men. :D

    Next example??
     
    #98 annsni, Nov 17, 2009
  19. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
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    Looking at the verse in the Greek and apparently the ESV translators didn't translate the word properly that you show "patron". The word is actually "prostatis" which is your second definition. Patron is completely wrong as far as the definition you have. However, your Strongs reference is missing the remainder of the definition which is " a female guardian, protectress, patroness, caring for the affairs of others and aiding them with her resources" Does that change anything??
     
    #99 annsni, Nov 17, 2009
  20. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    A deacon is a leadership function.
     
    #100 TCGreek, Nov 17, 2009
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