1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Your View On The Roman Catholics

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Baptist4life, Jan 12, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. annsni

    annsni Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    May 30, 2006
    Messages:
    20,914
    Likes Received:
    706
    If they believe as the Bible tells us to believe, then the belief is valid. Are there extra beliefs? Yes but not every Catholic believes those beliefs and not all of them compromise the Gospel.
     
  2. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,695
    Likes Received:
    82
    Faith:
    Baptist
    The Catholic Church has proclaimed five Dogmas about Virgin Mary, the mother of Jesus Christ:
    1- Mary Mother of God, 431.
    2- Mary always Virgin, before the birth of Jesus, during the birth, and after the birth of Jesus, 649.
    3- Mary Immaculate: On December 8, 1854, Pope Pius IX issued the bull Ineffabilis Deus, which proclaimed the dogma of the Immaculate Conception of Mary, "preserved free from all guilt of original sin".
    4- The Assumption of Mary, on November 1, 1950, when Pope Pius XII stated that Mary was "taken up body and soul into heaven," and "exalted as Queen of the Universe."
    5- A fifth dogma is "Mother of the Church", proclaimed by Paul VI, Second Vatican Council, Nov. 21, 1964

    6- Lately, the Pope is being urged to proclaim Mary with another three titles, with three dogmas:
    - The Co-redeemer or Co-redemptrix,
    - The Mediatrix, or Mediator of all graces,
    - The Advocate for the people of God, Intercessor, Helper, Benefactress.

    The Maternal Mediation of Mary is under its three essential aspects of Co-Redeemer ("the Mother Suffering"), Mediator("the Mother Nourishing"), and Advocate ("the Mother Interceding")... so, these three dogmas are interrelated and may be it is only one, because the roles of a mother, as heart of the family, are multiform but the truth of her motherhood is singular, only one!.

    This last triple dogma would be the climax of the Age of Mary, and like all dogmas is right now highly debated within the Catholics, Protestants and Orthodox. In fact, the reason of any dogma proclaimed by the Church is to clarify and assert the truth on any important biblical issue when it is being debated with controversies among the faithful... this was the case of the declaration by the Church of the dogmas of the Trinity, the Divinity of Jesus, the Divinity of the Person of the Holy Spirit... all the dogmas declared were under high controversy at the time of their proclamation!.

    Once the dogma is pronounced, all the doubts end, at least for the faithful of the Catholic Church.




    THAT IS HERESY!
     
  3. Thinkingstuff

    Thinkingstuff Active Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2008
    Messages:
    8,248
    Likes Received:
    9
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Nothing in your quote suggest that they loose salvation if they don't attend. It seems to say they aren't guaranteed it either. I'll look at the referrence in the CCC.
     
  4. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,695
    Likes Received:
    82
    Faith:
    Baptist
    BTW, I am not trying to bash catholics by this. As I said I have very many catholics in my family and I love them dearly. But they are NOT Christians! I know very well what they believe and MUST believe. They are very sincere, but they are sincerely WRONG.
     
  5. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    You're correct. Protestants get hung up on the word "obligation", as though it were salvific or something. The phrase simply means those are the minimum requirements for attendance which is expected of practicing Catholics. BTW, the reason SoCal doesn't have Jan1 as a holy day of obligation this years is because of an existing church custom in the US of the obligation not existing if said day falls on a Saturday ot Monday. The Los Angeles diocese formally extends that policy to Fridays as well. The Orange and San Diego Diocese do the same thing in practice, but not formally.
    Being a member of any church, whether it's Catholic or other, neither affirms nor negates one's salvation. I live in a heavily Catholic part of the country (at least, compared to where some of you folks reside), and every Catholic I know (more than casually) is a Christian. Part of that might be the more progressive nature of the local diocese, I don't know. OTOH, that doesn't mean that diocese in other parts of the country or world are similar. You might have a diocese in one are that is very biblically forward, while another one elsewhere might be biblically backward. You certainly see that in protestant regions, so it would not be unusual to see this in the practice of catholicism from region to region.
     
    #65 Johnv, Jan 13, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 13, 2010
  6. Peggy

    Peggy New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    0
    BTW, I am not trying to bash catholics by this. As I said I have very many catholics in my family and I love them dearly. But they are NOT Christians! I know very well what they believe and MUST believe. They are very sincere, but they are sincerely WRONG.

    I guess you are entitled to your opinion, although it certainly seems to me that you are out to bash Catholics. Why not focus on our similarities - what we believe in common - rather than attack Catholics and say they are not Christian. Saying a Catholic is not Christian is an insult and an attack whether or not you think it is.

    Why do we Baptists get so worked up about Catholics? This is the most I've seen posted since the divorce thread :)
     
  7. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    5,360
    Likes Received:
    134
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Would you say the same about Mormons? I'm curious, what do you think the reason for the Reformation was?

    What if it's true? Out of curiousity, do you believe that it's insulting for them to pronouce us anathema, say that our churches are not legitimate, or that we cannot be saved outside of the Catholic Church?
     
  8. Jon-Marc

    Jon-Marc New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,752
    Likes Received:
    0
    So, are they going to write a whole new Bible with all their false doctrine in it? They have enough unscriptural and false beliefs to fill a good sized book.

     
  9. Steven2006

    Steven2006 New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    2,065
    Likes Received:
    0
    I am trying to understand your point. Are you suggesting that if someone insults you that you should then, or it would be OK to insult them back?

    Secondly while the RCC does take that position, while being around probably thousands of catholics in my lifetime I have never once had one of them ever say this to me. I have however had many comment that we were both Christians.

    But to answer your question, if someone did tell me I was going to hell because because of my church membership I wouldn't even take them serious and think them a fool. Now if they wanted to talk about our different beliefs and why we believe such, I would engage them, share and if necessary defend the Gospel. By the way, this I have done with catholics, and I find they have a much more open mind as I explain scripture than if I had first already judged and declared them hell bound.
     
  10. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    5,360
    Likes Received:
    134
    Faith:
    Baptist
    First, this is a strawman.

    Second, no. I'm just asking why the double standard.
     
  11. Steven2006

    Steven2006 New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    2,065
    Likes Received:
    0
    I don't think it is, I was truly trying to understand the point you were trying to make?

    While I have witnessed countless of baptist doing this, again I have never witness even one catholic doing so. Again I am not talking about the RCC's position, but individuals on a personal level.
     
    #71 Steven2006, Jan 13, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 13, 2010
  12. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,695
    Likes Received:
    82
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Again, I'm shocked that people on a BAPTIST board are defending the RCC! You guys are apparently ignorant of the doctrines (catechism) of the RCC. The RCC is about as un-Christian as anything I can think of! As a matter of fact, it makes a mockery of Christianity.
     
  13. Johnv

    Johnv New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    So much for civil discussion. I suspect that anyone who disagrees with you will be considered by you to be a compromiser of scripture.
     
  14. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    19,500
    Likes Received:
    2,880
    Faith:
    Baptist
    ...think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham......
     
  15. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    5,360
    Likes Received:
    134
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No, the tragic thing is that they're not ignorant. They know exactly what Catholicism teaches and they just don't care.
     
  16. ashleysdad

    ashleysdad Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2009
    Messages:
    147
    Likes Received:
    0
    While this may be true of some Catholics on an individual level. It is certainly not true of the Catholic Church as a whole. The Catholic Church as a whole teaches a salvation that is entirely based on works and baptism. The Bible teaches salvation based on grace through faith alone and repeatedly states that works cannot save a person. This is where the Catholic church has its error. They believe that due to the death of Christ they can now work for salvation. I am not saying that all individual catholics believe this (many are not sure what they believe) but this is definitely true of the catholic church as a whole and is what their official doctrine is. Just in case anyone is wondering I am not basing this on hearsay but am basing it on speaking with two different priests as well as my dads very devout catholic family. Either the Catholic church is wrong in their teaching of salvation or Paul was wrong when he wrote the book of Romans, both viewpoints cannot be correct. A site that I found that goes into a lot of detail on what the catholic church teaches is catholic answers.com. Ironically there is a message board very similar to this. They also have an apologetics section where you can click on various topics and it will tell you what the catholic church teaches about that topic. Again, not slamming individual catholics, but as a whole the catholic church is a heretical body that teaches a false gospel.
     
  17. Zenas

    Zenas Active Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2007
    Messages:
    2,703
    Likes Received:
    20
    It is a mortal sin to deliberately skip mass on a holy day of obligation. Those who die before repenting of mortal sin go to hell. I'm about 99% sure that this is their belief.
     
  18. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,695
    Likes Received:
    82
    Faith:
    Baptist
    After spending 28 years with an aunt-in-law who's a nun, and a uncle-in-law who's a priest, I'm 100% sure! :tear:
     
  19. JohnDeereFan

    JohnDeereFan Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2009
    Messages:
    5,360
    Likes Received:
    134
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Correct. Why do they think they call it an obligation?

    And you would be 100% correct.
     
  20. Baptist4life

    Baptist4life Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2007
    Messages:
    1,695
    Likes Received:
    82
    Faith:
    Baptist
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...