Should members give money to their church?

I don't know, I thought Paul was fairly strait forward here...

1Co 9:13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

 

I also had this question to ask, Would a Pharisee being a temple worker have crops and animals? If not, why would this one say "I give tithes of all that I possess"? If he tithed of all that he possessed, seems that would be more than crops and animals... He says all...

Lk 18:10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.

 

Here is another example of tithing before the Mosaic law, does this mean Jacob was following a pagan tradition also?

21 So that I come again to my father's house in peace; then shall the LORD be my God: 22 And this stone, which I have set for a pillar, shall be God's house: and of all that thou shalt give me I will surely give the tenth unto thee.

 

I would hope so, you thinking he would place on my heart that which he is contrary to what he wants me to teach his people?

I believe that was the point I was making when you made humor of my statement. I'm accepting the statement as humor at least. I wouldn't teach anything I didn't believe "squared" with the book and the more I study on this the more I know I am right.

Your belief and position is based on God changing. That what he instituted at one time doesn't apply to all. Jesus didn't do away with the law, He fulfilled it. Those are His words, not mine. The law says thou shalt not kill and trust me, God didn't change on that. The law says to love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and trust me, God didn't change on that. I still believe God's Word is in the law. The only difference is I don't obey the law to be saved, I obey the law because I am saved.

It doesn't make me Gods child because I obey the law, I am Gods child so I obey his word. And it is nothing I did, he placed this obedience in my heart.

Though we are not "under" the law the law is still there and very much the word of God. God doesn't change and so his desires and still his desires. I have seen SFIC for example use the law when it comes to drinking and modest dress but all of a sudden it doesn't apply here. Kind of a double standard I would say. It's like we can pick and choose what parts apply to us.

As for money, I don't have crops or animals so I tithe of the increase the Lord has blessed me with.

 

They had crops and animals. You have been shown verses where they lived on land provided by one of the tribes, they weren't allowed to own the land but they were provided land to live on, them and their "cattle and beast". They worked the temple in one week shifts with a rotation of 24 courses. At the most, they worked the temple 2 weeks a year, they lived on the provided land the rest of the year raising cattle and crops.
I wll combine answers to your 3 posts in this one. God isn't changing. The law was to drive people to Christ. It isn't our schoolmaster. Jesus did indeed fulfil it. God does in fact reveal different things at different times,

(Deu 29:29) "The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things that are revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may do all the words of this law.

Christinas are NOT under the law or ever have been, other than what is naturally written on our hearts.

Your other "before the law verse" was about Jacob. You sure you want to use that one? Tithe all you want but like I said before, better be doing the other 612 also. I don't care if you "tithe" or not, you better be sure of it if you are teaching God's children to do it though, He will be mad at false teaching.

Gal 5:1 For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery. Gal 5:2 Look: I, Paul, say to you that if you accept circumcision, Christ will be of no advantage to you.
Gal 5:3 I testify again to every man who accepts circumcision that he is obligated to keep the whole law.
Gal 5:4 You are severed from Christ, you who would be justified by the law; you have fallen away from grace.
Gal 5:5 For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.
Gal 5:6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith working through love.
Gal 5:7 You were running well. Who hindered you from obeying the truth? Gal 5:8 This persuasion is not from him who calls you.
Gal 5:9 A little leaven leavens the whole lump.
Gal 5:10 I have confidence in the Lord that you will take no other view than mine, and the one who is troubling you will bear the penalty, whoever he is. Gal 5:11 But if I, brothers, still preach circumcision, why am I still being persecuted? In that case the offense of the cross has been removed.
Gal 5:12 I wish those who unsettle you would emasculate themselves!
Gal 5:13 For you were called to freedom, brothers. Only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.
Gal 5:14 For the whole law is fulfilled in one word: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself."
Paul is pretty clear on what God thinks. Give all you want, even teach others to give all they want, this is a good thing. Be sure that God might call you to the carpet for teaching falsely. Paul wanted the ones teaching circumcision(law) in the verses above to cut the whole ......... well, you read it and you'll get the message.

Christians have NEVER been under the tithe or any other part of the law to fund God's church, I would study what you teach if I were you. You are overriding what God told in Paul's writings.

 

The first tithe recorded in the Bible can be noted in Genesis 14:20, given to Mechizedek from Abraham. The next tithe that is mentioned can be found in Genesis 28:22, when Jacob made a vow to God. Then we find in 1 Samuel 8:15-17 that secular kings were taking a tenth in taxes of "vintage and grain". from the people. It was on this basis that it was incorporated into the Mosaic Law. The tithes were done in 3 ways: (1) the first was eaten/drunk at the temple feast by the giver - Deuteronomy 14:22-23. (2) The second tithe was given yearly to support the Levites - Numbers 18:21. (3) The third was given every 3 years to support the poor - Deuteronomy 14:29-29. All in all these tithes amounted to over 20% in total and not 10%.

It is when Malachi 3:10 is taken out of context to mean that Christians are to pay a 10% tithe to the Church, i.e., storehouse tithing, which restricts them to give only to their local Church and not to any other organizations. (I'm referring to the actual 10% tithe here, not offerings in general).

For when there is a change of the priesthood, there must also be a change of the law - Hebrews 7:12. This confirms that the Mosaic Law has ended (as a code to live by) and has been replaced by the Law of Christ - which is made up of some old Laws - Romans 13:9, some new ones - 1 Timothy 4:4, and some revised ones, all of which are binding on the Christian today.

And the tithe was never incorporated into the Law of Christ. The Christian, being under Grace is not obliged to tithe, but instead they are held to the higher law of stewardship, which means that everything we own is a gift from God and are to give it up any time they are commanded to do so - Matthew 19:21.

In finances and giving it is the responsiblity of Christians to provide for other Christians who are (financially) in need or destitute - Acts 11:27-30, 1 Corinthians 16:1-2, Romans 15:26.

The other area of responsibility for the Christian is to support Christian Leaders - 1 Corinthians 9:14, Galatians 6:6. (no-one is obliged to give to apostate Christian leaders though).

But the amount a Christian is to give isn't stated, nor graved in stone, like 10% for instance. How much we are to give is stated in 2 Corinthians 9:7 and 2 Corinithans 8:12, and so Christian giving should be in line with scripture as follows:

- Cheerful : 2 Corinthians 9:7
- Consistent : 1 Corinthians 16:2
- Proportional to their income : 1 Corinthians 16:2 and 2 Corinthians 8:12
- Sacrificial : Mark 12:43-44 and 2 Corinthians 8:2-3

Those are the guidelines we as Christians are to follow, not the old 10% tithe of the Mosaic Law which was intended for the Jews before the New Covenant was established.

 

Apparently they did have crops, not sure about animals. Jesus commended the Pharisee in Matthew 23:23 for tithing his spices and herbs.

 

Scripture never says Jacob fulfilled that vow. It also points out that Jacob did not return to the land until nearly 21 years later.

Jacob set down requirements that God was to meet before he would give a tenth to the Lord. Does that mean since we are not under the Law, we have bargaining power with God?

 

I'm not going back and reading 19 pages, and all I have to say about this topic, depends on what the current topic is I guess, so I guess it's the title of the suposed topic I am commenting on,, is that, if members of a church do not give money to their church they should not go to church service and expect heat and air conditioning, drinking water, or a functioning bathroom, electric lights, or really even a place to sit other then the floor, or ministry of any kind that requires spending money. If in fact there even is a building to hold worship service in, because you can't buy one without money.

 

I don't think anyone is debating that.

 

I think they are. The whole thesis here is that Christians have no responsibility to support Christ's church.

 

Don't know who's thesis you are reading, but that's not mine. I would like to see post numbers where that has been said, OR are you making it up?

 

No one has said the Church is not to be supported. What we have said is it is wrong for the pastor to stand behind the pulpit and teach or preach that the Church is to receive tithes for support.

We are against fear-mongering preaching that tells people if they 'want to remain under a curse, then just don't pay your tithes' (I myself have heard a preacher here in this town make such foolish claims).

 

Then there should be no question that we are to give money to support our church. Yet it seems to be debatable since this thread is 20 pages long.

 

The topic is:

Should members give money to their church?

I don't see everyone strongly saying yes to that question do you.

 

YES! There ya go BB.

 

Then you might want to actually read the discussion in its entirety, the current discussion is not directly related to a simple answer of "yes" or "no" to the general question in the OP. It is more now a debate over what tithes were in the Bible and how or if they apply to Christians.

 

Does the Bible teach that Christians should give generously to support their church and its ministers? YES

Does the Bible teach that Christians are obligated to give one tenth of their net/gross/gross+benefits monetary income to their church? NO

If you actually read through the discussion on this thread, I think you should reasonably come to these conclusions.

 

I answered these questions somewere on the third page of 20 posts per page. Here is what I wrote:

Give 100% of what you purpose to give in your heart.

If you purpose in your heart to give 30 dollars a month, give 30 dollars a month... 100%.

If you purpose in your heart to give 60 dollars, give 60 dollars.

No Less than 100% of what you purpose in your heart.
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As to the how, the answer is give cheerfully.