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1 Cor. 1 and God's calling

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Isaiah40:28, Oct 19, 2007.

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  1. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    Something else I thought of is God elected Judas, hand picked by Christ. How could it have been better if Judas had never been born if Christ handpicked him? Both he and Abram were called by God to follow him, but only Abraham was deemed righteous. What was the factor?
     
    #21 webdog, Oct 19, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 19, 2007
  2. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    1. I know my Calvinists brethren have offered several conclusions on Judas, but I must admit that I find the fate of Judas to be a difficult one to handle at this time for me.

    2. I can only go with what the Scripture says and leave it at that:

    "While I was with them, I was keeping them in Your name which You have given Me; and I guarded them and not one of them perished but the son of perdition, so that the Scripture would be fulfilled" (John 17:12).

    3. At face value, even this text seems to overturn eternal security, so we must seek better explanations from the whole of Scripture.
     
    #22 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  3. webdog

    webdog Active Member
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    I think the explanation is the fact even though God elects...as with Judas and Abram...the ability to have faith is real, and required from us.
     
    #23 webdog, Oct 19, 2007
  4. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Of course, faith is real and required from us! But who is the source of all true faith?
     
    #24 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  5. Isaiah40:28

    Isaiah40:28 New Member

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    I don't really feel like explaining all this to you, but for the sake of others reading these posts I will.

    The reason this passage came to mind upon thinking about Mr. Dawkins is that it speaks about kinds of people who are saved.
    Verse 26 says, "not many of you were wise by human standards, not many were influential, not many were of noble birth", so apparantly the Christians in Corinth were like most of us. Common people who are not in high places of influence.
    Richard Dawkins is currently in a place of influence and is considered wise by many in this world.
    Therefore I recognize that while God certainly does have His children in "high places" it's not apparantly what we typically we see.
    I think as Christians we should be praying for the salvation of those who have great influence in all circles, certainly government officials and others in authority.
    I even pray for Hollywood celebrities as their names come my way.
    I often pray for anybody who makes the CNN homepage and appears to need Christ.
    I never ever limit who God can and will save, after all he saved me and I know how terrible my sin is.
    My views on salvation match my prayers. I ask God to change a person's heart from a heart that despises Him to a heart that desires Him and since I know that He does this, I pray with the knowledge that if it is His will, then He will answer that prayer.
     
    #25 Isaiah40:28, Oct 19, 2007
  6. Isaiah40:28

    Isaiah40:28 New Member

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    You are equating the election of Judas with the election of Abraham?
     
    #26 Isaiah40:28, Oct 19, 2007
  7. Isaiah40:28

    Isaiah40:28 New Member

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    What part of Judas' fate do you find difficult?
     
    #27 Isaiah40:28, Oct 19, 2007
  8. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Christ chose him, yet he was the son of perdition. I don't think he just happened to slip into the 12; in fact, Matt. 10 proves otherwise.
     
    #28 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  9. Allan

    Allan Active Member

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    All I wanted to know is - Did you pray for him as the Spirit urged you?

    I didn't need all of that, but do thank you for elaborating.
     
    #29 Allan, Oct 19, 2007
  10. Isaiah40:28

    Isaiah40:28 New Member

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    Yes, Christ chose him but for what purpose?
     
    #30 Isaiah40:28, Oct 19, 2007
  11. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    I think Judas was chosen for what he was, a son of perdition, so as to carry out the plan of God. I don't know when Judas became a "son of perdition" but I do think he was chosen for that purpose.

    BBob,
     
    #31 Brother Bob, Oct 19, 2007
  12. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    1. Judas was conceived, nursed, grew up, went to school, learned a trade, chosen by Jesus for the sole purpose of being the son of perdition.

    2. And BBob, you are not a hyper-Calvinist? What is preventing you from becoming one?

    3. What other choice Judas had but to become the son of perdition when the clock struck midnight?
     
    #32 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  13. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    This scripture seems to speak to God's choice of Judas:

    Rom 9:17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, "FOR THIS VERY PURPOSE I RAISED YOU UP, TO DEMONSTRATE MY POWER IN YOU, AND THAT MY NAME MIGHT BE PROCLAIMED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE EARTH."
    Rom 9:18 So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.

    God chooses based on His purposes.
     
    #33 Amy.G, Oct 19, 2007
  14. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    I also believe the Apostles were a part of God's plan. I also believe John the Baptist was a part of God's plan. I also believe that Apostle Paul was a part of God's plan. But in due time.
     
    #34 Brother Bob, Oct 19, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 19, 2007
  15. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Did Judas have choice but to be the son of perdition?
     
    #35 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  16. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    Did these biblical characters have a choice?
     
    #36 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  17. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    I think so or the scripture would be false. "Time and chance has happened to all".

    He was the devil's servant, maybe one of his ministers or angels, I don't know.

    I think he was chosen because he was "the son of perdition", not going to be.
     
    #37 Brother Bob, Oct 19, 2007
  18. TCGreek

    TCGreek New Member

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    1. So, it's a harmony of God's sovereignty and human responsibility that has given us the son of perdition.

    2. What does that look like?
     
    #38 TCGreek, Oct 19, 2007
  19. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    It seems to me that if God decided to harden your heart, you wouldn't have much choice about it. If He decides to show you mercy, He does it without your permission. He does what He wills.
     
    #39 Amy.G, Oct 19, 2007
  20. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    What is the difference in him and every lost person. We either are the servant of God or the servant of the devil, right??
     
    #40 Brother Bob, Oct 19, 2007
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