A New Southern Baptist College—in Vermont

Discussion in 'Baptist Colleges / Seminaries' started by Jerome, Jun 16, 2012.

  1. Jerome

    Jerome
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    BPNews: Baptist College to Open in New England
    College Founder/President Mark Ballard is currently pursuing a Ph.D at Trinity of Newburgh and has authored several pamphlets [Understanding Baptism, Understanding Fasting, etc.] which can be downloaded at the college's website.
     
  2. Salty

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    Its interesting you added the part of: Northeastern Baptist College, with classes set to start in August 2013 in Bennington, Vt., will require all faculty and students to sign and uphold the Baptist Faith and Message 2000

    Do you think that is a good thing or a poor choice?

    I think it is good - that way folks know where the school stands! :thumbsup:

    If a faculty member cannot sign it, then he can just teach at a liberal college.
     
  3. preachinjesus

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    More than the foolishness of making students sign the BFM2000, I'd be worried about the founding president's credentials.
     
  4. Jerome

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    Huh? It sounds like he'll have his Ph.D. by the time the school opens next year.
     
  5. Tom Butler

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    Good for the school's trustees. I'm assuming that the trustees all must also pledge fealty to the BF&M2000.

    I would take a softer position on the students, and not require them to sign the BF&M.

    But I will not criticize the school for taking the position they do.
     
  6. Michael Wrenn

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    preachinjeus is, I believe, referring to Trinity Seminary in Newburgh, IN. It has a "questionable" history.
     
  7. saturneptune

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    Not really sure being unaware of the inner workings of Baptist seminaries, but doesn't each school have the right to set its own standards like a local church? If one does not like the standards set, then they should go elsewhere. I think the BFM 2000 is an excellent standard. Tom, you know more about this than I, but what do you think our local church would do if the Convention split over the issue of sovereignty? I suppose it depends on how the split was made. If it was made down the lines of a Calvinist, non-Calvinist split, I have no idea which way the church would go, or if we would just become independent.
     
  8. preachinjesus

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    Michael Wrenn has accurately noted what I was referring to in the above post.

    Its not a good mark for an institution to begin with a leader who has less than credible academics. Good intentions are fine, but higher education demands a better background.

    Also, this business about having students sign the BFM2000 is ridiculous. It is a complete violation of historic Baptist, not to mention Southern Baptist, principles. We've never required students to sign a document as grounds for admission and enrollment. This is highly creedal and a step away from proper Baptist distinctives.
     
  9. Michael Wrenn

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    Quite so, but then the SBC has been taking successive steps away from those for years.
     
  10. Havensdad

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    That is the most ridiculous statement I have ever heard. First of all, "No creeds" IS a creed. Why are you being creedal, by condemning other peoples creedalism?

    Second of all, the idea that we are supposed to let Satan worshipers teach our children, because we "Refuse Creeds" is just stupid.

    Third, the idea that Baptists are "Not creedal" is not supported by history. The very first Southern Baptist Seminary, required adherence to a "creed" to be a teacher. So HISTORICALLY, the OLDEST of our traditions, are creedal.

    So, believe whatever you want. But the idea that a person should not have to adhere to biblical principles in order to train pastors, or be trained as a pastor, is neither biblical NOR baptist. It is, in fact, demonic. :tonofbricks:
     
    #10 Havensdad, Jun 17, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 17, 2012
  11. preachinjesus

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    No it isn't.

    Psst...hey Havensdad...I know you like to get all up and angry over little issues and such...but it you go back up and carefully read (possibly outloud) my post you'll see I never said anything about teachers. I said it is foolishness to require students to sign the BFM2000 for admission and enrollment. I didn't say anything about teachers.
     
  12. Tom Butler

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    I know that Southern Baptist Theological Seminary has its own doctrinal statement called Abstract of Principles, which all faculty and administration must sign. They've had it for a long, long time.

    I don't know if the other SBC seminaries have similar kinds of doctrinal statements. Some of you on the board can fill in the blanks on that.

    I chair the board of trustees at Mid-Continent University in Mayfield, Kentucky. It is Southern Baptist in every way, but is not connected either to the Kentucky Baptist Convention of the SBC except in a friendly relationship. Our doctrinal statement is the Baptist Faith and Message. Faculty, staff and trustees must accept it as the doctrinal guide. The smattering of non-Baptist employees agree not to teach contrary to it.

    Nobody questions the right of the school to determine what will be taught and how.

    Regarding the church we both serve, the issue does not seem to be on the radar of most members. I'm going to resist speculating on "what if," except to say that I'm going to continue to work (as you do as well) to make such Calvinists and non-Cals can peacefully co-exist. We already do, so we know it can be done.
     
  13. Havensdad

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    Yes, it is.

    I am not at all angry. I do agressively defend traditional Baptist teachings from recent postmodern revisionism, however.

    It is absolutely IMPERATIVE that we get serious about doctrine, and require those whom we are training as Pastors, to adhere to a minimum set of doctrine. What kind of hellish mischief has been unleashed, from pastors that were trained by one of our Big six seminaries, that have received our stamp of approval, but yet have not truly held to Biblical doctrine?

    Doctors have to take the Hippocratic oath; how much more serious should we take the souls of men? If we are training someone as a MINISTER, then they darn well better believe basic orthodox beliefs about Christianity, or we are helping to lead people astray.
     
  14. preachinjesus

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    You do realize that non-SBC students can and do attend (and always have done so) our SBC colleges and seminaries?

    Are you saying that in order to attend SWBTS and graduate my Roman Catholic priest friend should have had to sign the BFM? That's pretty ridiculous.

    It is not the place of the SBC (considering historic Baptist distinctives) to require anyone in a local church, any local church, or any pastor of a local church to sign anything. Autonomy is the key principle here. Requiring students, not teachers, to sign the BFM violates autonomy.
     
  15. Havensdad

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    For a ministerial degree? ABSOLUTELY. And no, it is not ridiculous. Issuing a degree which connotes readiness for ministry, to someone who believes in hell-damning doctrine, is completely irresponsible.

    Also, I would note that ALL of the SBC seminaries do already do this, in a sense, through tuition. Tuition is double for those not a member of a cooperating SBC church, or who have SIGNED a Covenant, including agreement with the BF and M, and agreed to BECOME a member of a SBC church.

    You are simply wrong. Historically, Baptists have always required a certain similarity of belief for cooperation. "Anticreedalism" is nothing but revisionist nonsense." Autonomy applies to churches, not to SBC institutions. SBC institutions should be required to adhere to the minimum level of doctrine agreed to by the body of cooperating churches; i.e. the BF & M.

    This includes the making ready of pastors, and therefore, students.
     

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