ACLU loses 10 Commandments fight

Good News! Praise be to God.

 

call me a libberal, but i dont like it. I mean, would you be as happy if thy let the 5 pillars of islam stay up instead of the commandments?

 

Call me crazy, but if the display is as part historic significance, as is the ten commandments in this case, yes, I'd be happy. I'd rather have public displays of all historically significant religious culture than none.

[ August 23, 2002, 01:58 PM: Message edited by: Johnv ]

 

Has the 5 pillars of Islam ever been posted in a court before? I thought the 10 Commandments are the basis of our laws, not Islamic beliefs, or any other religious beliefs for that matter. I also know that the JW's would be happy if they weren't there either.

 

Great news webmaster about the ACLU not getting their way on posted the 10 commandments! I'm so fed up with the ACLU and their Communist agenda where they are out to destroy America's Christian heritage!

 

Well, thanks for the permission, as it turns out we cannot call you anything but.... BTW, what does the subject at hand has anything to do with the five pillars of Islam?!

 

YES!!!

Islamic stuff? What have they contributed to our country? We were founded on the Judeo-Christian heritage, and that VERY much includes the Ten Commandments.

Besides, they claim their god is the God of the Bible and that Abraham is their father, too. So why should the Ten Commandments bother them?

except for the part, maybe, about no murder....

[ August 23, 2002, 08:15 PM: Message edited by: Helen ]

 

Guess there a few decent federal judges left. Praise the Lord for this One! May God bless him & protect him.

Re: Islam. Looked like an attempt to hijack this thread!

I have no doubt the pillars of Islam (including the jihad pillar) are posted in Islamic countries in public buildings.

Despite what certain groups try to promote & trying to rewrite history (shades of George Orwell's 1984), the United States of America was founded on Judeo-Christian principles.

In fact, before a bunch of history rewriters, socialists, and liberals get on here & try to trash this thread as per usual agenda promotion & devices,

for the record, here's the Mayflower Compact.

We can all note the purpose for establishing this colony was for the "glory of God and advancement of the Christian faith."

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mayflower Compact 1620

Agreement Between the Settlers at New Plymouth : 1620
IN THE NAME OF GOD, AMEN. We, whose names are underwritten, the Loyal Subjects of our dread Sovereign Lord King James, by the Grace of God, of Great Britain, France, and Ireland, King, Defender of the Faith, &c. Having undertaken for the Glory of God, and Advancement of the Christian Faith, and the Honour of our King and Country, a Voyage to plant the first Colony in the northern Parts of Virginia; Do by these Presents, solemnly and mutually, in the Presence of God and one another, covenant and combine ourselves together into a civil Body Politick, for our better Ordering and Preservation, and Furtherance of the Ends aforesaid: And by Virtue hereof do enact, constitute, and frame, such just and equal Laws, Ordinances, Acts, Constitutions, and Officers, from time to time, as shall be thought most meet and convenient for the general Good of the Colony; unto which we promise all due Submission and Obedience. IN WITNESS whereof we have hereunto subscribed our names at Cape-Cod the eleventh of November, in the Reign of our Sovereign Lord King James, of England, France, and Ireland, the eighteenth, and of Scotland the fifty-fourth, Anno Domini; 1620.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The link:
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/amerdoc/mayflower.htm

 

This is good news for those of us in Northwest Ohio. In the 1950's Charleton Heston gave us a gift of the ten commandments that was used in his movie. They were talking about taking ours down too. I hope the ten commandments can stay in front of our courthouse in downtown Toledo.

 

oh please, what is communist about the ACLU?

or are civil liberties communist?

erm?

the argument, as I understand it, is that in a secular, puralist, democracy the government should not favour one religion over others - so if you have have the 10 commandments posted on a building then why not symbols from other world religions too?

this is ridiculous - there is no conspiracy here sheeagle and everyone who disagrees with you is not 'a bunch of history rewriters, socialists, and liberals' - they are as far as I have seen on this board people with a much sounder understanding of american history than yourself - aside from calling them trolls I have not seen you rebutt their arguments. Can you?

yes helen, no one from any other religion but ours has ever contributed anything to America at all

 

Ah hem....certain people certainly feel passionate about certain things happening in America when they live in a certain country that isn't America. Certain people seem to have a certain agenda they are trying to promote on this thread. Certain people should read the Mayflower Compact. But perhaps if certain people live in a certain country they say they live in, maybe those certain people are bitter. ???

Certain people say certain things that certainly make other certain people raise an eyebrow.

 

oh please, what is communist about the ACLU?

or are civil liberties communist?

erm?

the argument, as I understand it, is that in a secular, puralist, democracy the government should not favour one religion over others - so if you have have the 10 commandments posted on a building then why not symbols from other world religions too?

this is ridiculous - there is no conspiracy here sheeagle and everyone who disagrees with you is not 'a bunch of history rewriters, socialists, and liberals' - they are as far as I have seen on this board people with a much sounder understanding of american history than yourself - aside from calling them trolls I have not seen you rebutt their arguments. Can you?

yes helen, no one from any other religion but ours has ever contributed anything to America at all </font>[/QUOTE]For your information the founding of America is from a Judea-Christian base. (ie: Christianity)
Not Islam or any other religion. Our countries documents and writings of the founding fathers all point to Christianity.

As to the question of whether our countries history and the inclusion of our Christian heritage is being rewritten the answer is yes. Little by little of the last 15 or so years. Notably are such historic sites as The Liberty Bell, Independence Hall, Plymoth Plantation, Colonial Williamsburg which now give out information that either factually incorrect or completely leaves out anything about Christianity and its influence on the nations founding. Also, the Library of Congress has been systematically removing books from public access which deal with Christianity. All of this has been done within the last 10 - 15 years.

The Revolutionary Communist Party, USA in 1989 sued to have the "right" to burn our flag and the Supreme bowed to them. Antipatriotism is ok. Of course getting rid of posting the Ten Commandments and keeping patriotism and our Christian heritage out of view of the general public probably made this easier to pass.

The ACLU seems to be endorsing communist agenda:
Policy No. 81 calls for the permanent ban on displays of the nativity and the menorah on public property.
Policy No. 84 calls for the removal of "under God" from the Pledge
Policy No. 92 call for an end to tax exemptions for all churches and synogogues.

Today the ACLU closely patterns that of the organizations 1930's ideology, from which John Dewey resigned because of Marxist domination.

Today more than ever we need to reminded that there is a God and that there is a standard for our behaviour.

suzanne

 

&gt;&gt;The Revolutionary Communist Party, USA in 1989 sued to have the "right" to burn our flag and the Supreme bowed to them.&lt;&lt;

I meant SUPREME COURT. Sorry about that

 

Yes i am from alabama and yes i am a baptist. I just happen to be a liberal, there a problem with taht? or is it only close-minded conseravative basptists may post on this board?

[ August 24, 2002, 06:01 PM: Message edited by: Depuis 1919 ]

 

is there something wrong with that?

because I don't live in America I am not allowed an opinion or American current events?

I think that everyone has an agenda that they are trying to promote - why else would people participate in debate?

I have read the mayflower compact, i have also read the constitution - you know the difference between those documents? one is the foundation fo your system of government the other is not.

Perhaps you should read the Treaty of Tripoli:

but these arguments can go on and round in circles for hours - the simple fact of the matter is that the founding fathers did not set up a state church, sorry but there you go.

why would i be bitter?

well that must be the most times I have ever read the word certain in one sentence.

and nowhere have i disagreed with that - i disagreed with the following statement:

which is just so deeply offensive that it angered me a great deal.

do you have any actual evidence of this?

That was the Texas vs Johnson case - the supreme court ruled that flag burning was a form of speech and that it was therefore protected by the first amendment:

source

erm?

hardly a 'communist agenda' - but I have no idea what you definition of communist is?

I agree 100% - I simply think that God & government are best kept apart.

 

Let me take a stabb at this one. Let's see:

1. Malcolm X: Hatred and a murderous heart

2. Farakhan: Racism, Hatred, and a murderous heart.

3. Islam in general: Racism, Hatred, Murderous hearts, terrorism, Death to America.

Now I understand why our jealous friends from Europe and our anti-American friends here in America love Islam so much.

BTW, the only way their god is the same god of the Bible is, if by chance, they are referring to one of the false gods (which is no god at all) mentioned as an aside. If our friends in Europe don't love (or even like America), that is the reason we have a big ocean between us. Just stay on that side of the Atlantic and you won't have to deal with us. For those who live in America who hate America, I would like to invite you to get on an airplane (if you are not afraid to due to the terrorism brought on by your friends the Muslims), fly across that big ole ocean and live somewhere else...say...maybe...HMMMMMMMM.....Saudi Arabia?

Joseph Botwinick

Joseph Botwinick

 

In regard to the Treaty of Tripoli:

Recall that while the Founders themselves openly described America as a Christian nation (demonstrated in chapter 2 of Original Intent), they did include a constitutional prohibition against a federal establishment; religion was a matter left solely to the individual States. Therefore, if the article is read as a declaration that the federal government of the United States was not in any sense founded on the Christian religion, such a statement is not a repudiation of the fact that America was considered a Christian nation.

It would also be absurd to suggest that President Adams (under whom the treaty was ratified in 1797) would have endorsed or assented to any provision which repudiated Christianity. In fact, while discussing the Barbary conflict with Jefferson, Adams declared:

"The policy of Christendom has made cowards of all their sailors before the standard of Mahomet. It would be heroical and glorious in us to restore courage to ours."

Furthermore, it was Adams who declared:

"The general principles on which the fathers achieved independence were. . . . the general principles of Christianity. . . . I will avow that I then believed, and now believe, that those general principles of Christianity are as eternal and immutable as the existence and attributes of God; and that those principles of liberty are as unalterable as human nature. "

Adams’own words confirm that he rejected any notion that America was less than a Christian nation.

Now, I do agree with you....we do not have an official religion established by the federal government. This is separate from the fact that our underpinnings are from a Christian foundation.

As far as some of the comments about whether you're even qualified to respond to American history because you're British, I didn't make them , so could you acknowledge the quotes in some way as to avoid confusion? Thanks

Helen made the comment about Islamic stuff? What have they contributed to our country? Sorry....I agree with her. We will always be at odds with Muslim governments because of our Christian foundation. The whole Treaty of Tripoli was about Muslim nations declaring war on the U.S. along with some European countries.....Why? Our Christianity!!

suzanne

 

is there something wrong with that?

because I don't live in America I am not allowed an opinion or American current events?
</font>[/QUOTE]Certainly you are entitled to your opinion. Just be adviced that it probably won't hold much weight here as it comes from a jealous, anti-American Brit.

Cheers,

Joseph Botwinick

[ August 25, 2002, 10:38 AM: Message edited by: Joseph Botwinick ]