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Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by LadyEagle, Nov 29, 2002.
E-mail I received:
I'm not sure what your concern is - can you explain? This appears to be similar to our Canadian Bill C-145, which I fully support. Hate crimes should be illegal towards *anyone*.
"Since the bill does not exempt religious organizations, it
could silence Pennsylvania pastors and subject those who
dare to speak out on issues of human sexuality to lawsuits
or worse! Plus, this bill would set a precedent for similar
laws in other states!"
The Bible says homosexuality is sin! So pastors could be forbidden by law from preaching against this particular sin.
This bill tosses the US Constitution First Amendment right to free speech & freedom of religion right out the window. You may be happy with your Canadian laws.
But we have a Constitution that says we have free speech here in the old USA.
Where are you PA Jim?
Have you even read the bill itself? Or are you just feeding the conspiracy machine?
read it here
Basically, in the bill there is a list of people you are not allowed to destroy crops or livestock of, based on prejudice towards their race, religion, etc. Sexual orientation is added to the list. This means if a homosexual kills your chickens just because you are a heterosexual, they can be arrested.
This is NOT about sending preachers to prison, demolishing free speech, or anything like that. Those websites that are in an uproar about this bill are nothing more than paranoid extremists, and you should be wary of passing on stuff like this without checking it out for yourself first.
We've gone the rounds on this kind of thing before.
Either throw out all hate crime legislation (which I'm actually for, btw), or include sexual orientation to the list. I don't see how this is difficult.
Most of the talk about "oooh -- that Bible would be illegal," and "oooh, pastors wouldn't be able to preach against homosexuality" is a bunch of nonsense, and is used, IMNSHO, to put fear into people's minds. It's not about protecting the Bible or pastors (who would not be affected, btw, unless the pastor runs around inciting violence or advocating genocide, but that's a completely different story), but about keeping sexual orientation of the list because of disgust at homosexuality and homosexuals (and the rest of the queer community). It's just wrapped up in that alarmist language to make it appeal to the more liberal folks.
[ November 29, 2002, 06:13 PM: Message edited by: stubbornkelly ]
Speaking of hate crimes, what was the outcome of the case in which 13-year-old Jesse Dirkhising was sexually assaulted and murdered in Rogers, Arkansas on Sept. 26, 1999 by two sodomites? When Matthew Sheppard was murdered by two rednecks, the news media kept it in the forefront for months. Anyone ever hear anything on the news about Jesse Dirkhising? I didn't.
Hypocrites them all.
In the Father,
Well, Brian, the version of the bill you posted is the gutted bill, in which all references to agriculture & livestock were taken out.
According to the American Family Association of NW of PA website:
Also, and I choose to side with them & traditional family values...
I checked around. The wording "sexual orientation" have the gays & lesbos thrilled. So, if they are happy over it, then it sure can't be too wholesome for the general society who doesn't want anything to do with perversions.
As explained further on this web site, things like transvestites in public restrooms could be an issue, bestiality, and other things considered, too, not just the gutted bill which you posted a link to.
When I go to a public ladies restroom, I don't want some freaky man dressed up in high heels & pearls in there with me because he wants to pass himself off as a woman, for one thing.
Dr. Kennedy and other conservatives and those who believe in Traditional Family Values rather than all this kinky abomination junk do have cause to be alarmed. We are not some kind of "paranoid extremists" as you call us. I imagine similar accusations were made when a handful of people protested prayer being taken out of American public schools, too, ala Madeline Murray O'Hare. Well, here we are.
And Kelly, you ranted a similar tune about the Canadian bill, even though people in that thread told you it's a slippery slope.
I never thought I'd be living in ancient Greece, but it's sure starting to look that way.
Everybody wants their rights to flaunt their perversions on the rest of society and make it be the accepted "norm" while God fearing Evangelical Christians have their rights legislated and adjudicated away. And to think people on this Board defend all the madness!
Anyone ever hear of Mary Stachowicz, the 51-year-old woman who was allegedly beaten and stabbed to death after she told 19 year-old Nicholas Gutierrez God would not approve of his lifestyle?
I haven't heard this in the major media outlets.
"This woman, Mary Stachowicz, was killed evidently because she was sharing the truth about homosexuality to a gay activist," Peter LaBarbera said. "We will be waiting to see, now, if the media treats this case like it treated the Matthew Shepard case." So far it has not. Laura Montgomery, of Soulforce — a gay-activist organization — seemed to avoid the hate crime aspect of the incident.
[Read the story here.]
This is why Christians need to crush hate-crime laws. They will be used against us in an attempt to silence us. Guess what... Won't silence me.
Stop hate crime laws now.
[ November 29, 2002, 08:52 PM: Message edited by: JamesJ ]
??? What??? Did you even read the bill I linked to? Notice what I'm bolding:
What??? Are you saying that hate crime against those of a different sexual orientation should not be illegal?
As explained above, extremist paranoia.
You're right. Promoting genocide against those of a different sexual orientation should not be illegal.
Have you noticed that these VERY SAME BILLS protect YOU from hatecrime because of your nationality and/or religion? No, I suppose you haven't.
Solomon was right, there is nothing new under the sun.
In the Father,
[ November 30, 2002, 10:43 AM: Message edited by: new man ]
Ah... But I thank Him and praise Him that to those who DO persevere, He gives eternal life on the new earth, in the new city of Jerusalem, where there will in no way enter into it anything the defiles it or makes an abomination or is a liar. Where there will be no more curse, and we will see His face, and He will be the only light, and this will continue forever and ever!!
Praise, Glory, and Honor to the Lamb!
THE WAY, THE TRUTH, and THE LIFE!
Personally, I think that hate crimes legislation should be overturned. There is no possible way for all groups to be covered as targets of hate--and I don't know that a premeditated murder of anyone is not an action of hatred no matter what.
What I want to know about transvestites in restrooms. How do you know that you aren't already sharing restrooms with transvestites/transgendered individuals? I mean, I've never been strip searched before entering one to be sure that I was a girl or told that I looked too funny to enter. Ladies' rooms have stalls so I don't see how you could tell or (more importantly) what business it is of yours what kind of parts people have under their clothes.
And the line of reasoning that if "gays & lesbos" are thrilled about something then it can't be good!! So if homosexuals think that a new neighborhood park is good, then obviously it's a perversion? Or if teaching fine arts is something that a homosexual group or individual thinks is good, then we should outlaw music and theater?
Neither of these ideas make any sense to me.
It's not about making sense. It's about prejudice and using the Bible to reinforce those prejudices (just as some baptists did in the fifties with the evils of "race mixing.") Don't try to figure it out. It will make your head hurt and it's not good for the blood pressure.
That's weak at best and deceitful at worst.
God has already judged and declared that homosexuality is a sin. We don't judge, we say what God has already said.
The reason we say it, is so that those who are trapped in that habitual behavior may hear what God calls the behavior (He calls it sin), and may also hear that He so loved the world that He sent His only begotten Son that whomsoever believes in Him will not perish but will have everlasting life.
There's no prejudice involved. God said ALL have sinned, so ALL need to hear the message. The message is REPENT for the kingdom of Heaven is at hand.
The reason that this issue is so visible is because organizations like GLAAD, GLSEN, PFLAG, ACLU, NEA, etc want to force it on our society. They demand that homosexuality be presented to our schoolchildren as a normal alternative lifestyle. We demand that it not be presented that way.
God says homosexuality is sin. We agree with God.
Men are soon going to make it a hate-crime to proclaim that truth. We follow God, not man (see Psalm 118:8).
Stop hate crime laws now.
We should punish the action, not the motivation. If someone murders, they should be charged with murder and that is it. I don't care who they murdered, or why, they murdered. I someone rapes, they should be charged with rape. I don't care who they did it to or why, they raped. Hate Crime legistlation is idiotic.
That is exactly what I am saying. I don't think hate crime legistlation should even exist. Like I said, I don't care who they did it to or why, all I care about is what they did. Punish the crime, not the intent.
Yes, SheEagle, and I refuted their slippery slope argument.
I don't like hate crime legislation either. I'd prefer it was done away with. If anything, charge someone with intimidation of a group (which is what hate crime leg. is about, really).
However, if hate crime legislation is going to stick around, I can't support leaving out a significant target group.
Sure, that sounds OK. But since it does exist, it shouldn't be a problem to add "sexual orientation" to it - that's not about killing free speech or throwing preachers in jail or anything that the alarmists say will happen.
The IPA lists seven basic propaganda devices
and number 4 is
4) Transfer — Gay activists have borrowed legitimacy by allying themselves with racial minorities, bypassing careful analysis of some very real distinctions.
You should learn some new tricks of the trade Josh because me and my Father are sick & tired of it.
The transfer thing, while an issue, is not as big of one as some people think. Most of the transference done by the queer activist groups is along the lines of "same struggle, same fight."