AMERICA'S COVENANT WITH GOD!

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by BrotherRobert, Mar 20, 2004.

  1. BrotherRobert

    BrotherRobert
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    I beg to differ with those who say that America has no covenant status with GOD, as did ancient Israel.

    That status of a GOD fearing and blessed Christian nation is open to any country that follows GOD's Laws in the Love of our Lord JESUS CHRIST - both in the individual hearts of its citizens and nationally in its institutions and history.

    Consider the American Declaration of Independence of 1776:

    [​IMG]

    CHRISTIAN PRAYERS, SPEECHES & PRONOUNCEMENTS OF THE FOUNDING FATHERS!
    http://www.ourchurch.com/view/?pageID=175522


     
  2. Helen

    Helen
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    I'm afraid you are badly misled on several counts. You will note, first, that there is NO reference to Jesus Christ in Jefferson's material above.

    Secondly, Jefferson was NOT a Christian but, at best, a deist. Please see verification here:
    http://www.sullivan-county.com/id3/jefferson_deist.htm

    Thirdly, God had to agree to the covenant! We have no record of Him having done anything near that in American history.

    Americal, as a nation, as no covenant with God.
     
  3. donnA

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    In scripture, Israel knew they had a covenant with God, there was evidence and God Himself claimed it through His prophets. We have no evidence or word form God that He has a covenant with America. God' covenant with Israel was for a purpose of bringing the Messiah through those people. We have no such purpose. Why would God choose to covenant with America? And wouldn't He tell us so? Today God's covenant is with not a nation but with us, as Christians.
     
  4. Rosell

    Rosell
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    According to the Bible, only one nation, Israel, ever had a covenant with God. The door to a covenant relationship was opened to individuals through Jesus Christ. No other nation has ever been given that opportunity according to scripture.

    According to I Peter 2:9-10, the chosen people of God under the new covenant are found in the church as comprised of believers in Christ, and not in any particular nation.

    The founding of America as a nation without a state supported church did wonders for the Christian faith, releasing it and freeing it to be a genuine influence in society and culture, true "salt and light" as opposed to a required form of influence under state control. As a result, Christian churches, which accounted for fewer than 10 percent of the population of the country at the time of the Declaration of Independence, became the major influence in the country in less than a century. And it was a free church, a kind which exists in rare form elsewhere in the world.

    The problems came along when prosperity, prestige and power corrupted the free church and success created arrogance. The church became worldly, and to keep its numerical and financial power, it compromised its beliefs. It institutionalized itself and sided with the rich and powerful. It married tradition to the gospel. As a result, it lost its influence and now appears to the new generations as irrelevant and outdated. Church membership statistics show increases, while pews are empty and attendance is way down. We fail to reach our neighbors with the gospel because our approach is traditional and lacks the "gentleness and respect" that Peter tells us is necessary for us to keep our good reputation with outsiders. (see I Peter 3:15-17)
     
  5. vaspers

    vaspers
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    Well, I have mixed feelings on this.

    America was dedicated to freedom of thought and religion, yet many colonies ruthlessly persecuted and even killed those who were outside their denomination. Like Massachusetts Bay Colony for example.

    Baptists were persecuted like crazy. Remember Roger Williams and so many others.

    Yet many documents acknowledge God and Jesus Christ. I am thankful for deists and theists and evangelicals and anyone who adhered to what light they had and understood.

    This has never been a strictly Christian nation, yet we have sent out a lot of missionaries and have put "In God we Trust" on our money, etc.

    Not every one in America must become Christian before God will bless us again. That's silly. Even Sodom and Gomorrah didn't have a 100% righteous clause attached to them. Ha!

    But we do need Revival, genuine, not mega-church.
     
  6. Pennsylvania Jim

    Pennsylvania Jim
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    [​IMG] Good thoughts, Vaspers.

    Helen, I agree that evidence is that Jefferson was not a Christian. But "at best, a Deist" I think sells him short in the other direction.

    "The God who gave us life gave us liberty at the same time; the
    hand of force may destroy, but cannot disjoin them." --Thomas
    Jefferson: Rights of British America, 1774. Papers, 1:135

    "Can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have
    removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the
    people that these liberties are of the gift of God? That they are
    not to be violated but with His wrath?" --Thomas Jefferson: Notes
    on Virginia Q.XVIII, 1782.


    By the way, in the line of useless but interesting infromation, I have an iris plant that is a direct descendant of one of Jefferson's.


    ---edited for spellning AnD pUnctuation---
     
  7. vaspers

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    P Jim, we're playing "post tag" Ha!

    I also like Jefferson: "the government that governs best, governs least." Practically an anarchist, bless his heart.

    A political genius, hope he was saved too.
     
  8. Pennsylvania Jim

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    Amen. Jefferson's application of Godly principles to government makes today's politicians who claim to be Evangelical Christians look like atheists by comparison.
     
  9. vaspers

    vaspers
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    Amen, brother. You make a ton of sense here.

    Wow, you are refreshing to listen to. Bless you. [​IMG] [​IMG] :cool: [​IMG]
     
  10. Baptist in Richmond

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    Hey Helen:

    As an adopted son of the Commonwealth, I won't stand for any slanderous comments about one of our own. [​IMG]

    All kidding aside, you are correct in your assessment of Jefferson's beliefs, though. Here is some additional information from the Monticello website. Here is a link to information on the Jefferson Bible.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond
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    :eek: :eek: :eek:

    That is not useless information. That is actually quite fascinating, considering how many generations of plants that span between his iris and your iris. How did you get your hands on this?

    Do any of you recognize this building? I took this last summer. It is only about 60 miles to the West of Richmond.

    Take a look at this picture, taken in downtown Richmond. [Actually, I think I have posted this before this evening.] This is really neat, if you think about it. Lastly, take a look at this picture. Thomas Jefferson actually designed the middle building, and they added the buildings on either side (for the House of Delegates and the Senate).

    Can you tell that I am an admirer of Jefferson?
    [​IMG]

    Hope this post finds you well! [​IMG]

    BiR (VERY intrigued)

    [Edited to correct a URL.]

    [ March 31, 2004, 11:52 PM: Message edited by: Baptist in Richmond ]
     

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