Are we promised a place and position within The Godhead Itself?

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by S.k.y, Aug 24, 2003.

  1. S.k.y

    S.k.y
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    Based upon the following Scriptures it appears we are promised a place and position within The Godhead Itself.

    John 6:56, "He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him."

    John 10:38, "But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him."

    John 14:20, "At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you."

    John 14:10, "Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."

    John 14:11, "Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake."

    John 15:2, "Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit."

    John 15:4, "Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me."

    John 17:21, "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me."

    John 17:22, "And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:"

    John 17:23, "I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me."

    John 17:24, "Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world."

    John 17:26, "And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them."

    1 John 2:24, "Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father."

    1 Corinthians 15:50, "Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption."

    1 Corinthians 15:51-53, "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality."

    Luke 17:6, "And the Lord said, If ye had faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye might say unto this sycamine tree, Be thou plucked up by the root, and be thou planted in the sea; and it should obey you."

    John 14:12, "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

    Romans 8:14, "For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God."

    Romans 8:16, "The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:"

    Romans 8:19, "For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God."

    Philippians 2:15, "That ye may be blameless and harmless, the sons of God, without rebuke, in the midst of a crooked and perverse nation, among whom ye shine as lights in the world;"

    1 John 3:1, "Behold, what manner of love the Father hath bestowed upon us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew him not."

    1 John 3:2, "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is."

    Romans 8:17, "And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together."

    Revelation 21:2, "And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband."

    Revelation 21:22, "And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it."

    Revelation 3:21, "To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne."
     
  2. donnA

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    So you think we're going to be God? Or a part of God?
    According even to the very scripture you have posted, and all the rest of scripture, then answer has to be, absolutely NOT. Sounds like a new age/occult belief.
     
  3. S.k.y

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    I don't know. I'll not presume to know the mind of God. And I'm certainly not advocating any New Age beliefs.

    All I'm "tossing out" is that if we are in Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ is in The Father and if we are promised an heirship the same as The Son and if we are to be in the same ruling throne as The Son Who, at the same time, sits in the same throne as The Almighty, then, yes, as wild as it may sound, it does, still, nonetheless, sound as though we are to be a part of The Godhead. And exactly what that fully means or what the complete ramifications of that are, I have no idea; only that in being 'in Christ', Who possesses all power, and Who has promised us joint-heirship to all that is His...well, it certainly raises some interesting questions in that regard.
     
  4. S.k.y

    S.k.y
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    Jesus has promised us the same glory as is His; and, yet, He thought it not robbery to be equal with God.
     
  5. Baptist Believer

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    We share in His glory, but we do not take his identity.

    We are not gods nor will we be gods.

    Some of the verses you quote relate to the relationship and identity between the Triune Persons of God. The other verse you quote refer to the way in which the fullness of the Godhead dwells within us in bodily form. Yet, we do not take on the identity of God.

    Communion with God is not the same thing as union or assumption of the identity of God.
     
  6. S.k.y

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    As previously stated, the issue is not one of becoming gods or God.

    The divinity and glory of The Son of God are inseparable. Jesus has promised us that same glory.

    Remaining in Christ and in The Father implies a place within The Godhead Itself; though it would not of necessity demand equality with God Himself, only a place of rest and contiuance with and "in" Him, as the word "in" (Greek, "en") in all relevent instances implies.

    There will be no temple in the New Jerusalem for The Almighty and The Lamb ARE the temple; and we are "in" The Son Who is "in" The Father.

    I am NOT advocating that we shall be God or gods but that our place of rest is "in" God, ie The Godhead.
     
  7. Paul of Eugene

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    As long as we are finite instead of infinite, no matter how great we become, we are not God.
     
  8. S.k.y

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    Who said anythng about being God?
     
  9. BrianT

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    I don't think we become God, but there are a few passages that do give me pause for thought:

    2 Pet 1:4 "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust."

    John 17:21 "That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me."

    Eph 5:31-32 "For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh. [32] This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church."
     
  10. Artimaeus

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    This is classic and pure new age philosophy and it isn't even original. There was a certin angel who thought he would someday be included in the Godhead.

    You did, when you posted your original question.

    The Godhead is composed of ONE God in triune form, known as the trinity. There is not 4 or five or six or a billion. No one else is in the trinity, therefore, no one else is in the Godhead.
     
  11. Johnv

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    I agree, and I read these verses as you do. Very good summation [​IMG]
     
  12. Lorelei

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    I don't know if they are "New Age" but the Catholic Church also teaches that we will be gods.

    Christ said "I am in the Father and the Father is In me". This did not make Christ the Father, nor did it make the Father the Son. Each person of the Godhead remains distinct in this instance, just as we will. The context is a spiritual oneness that is not about actually becoming one or the other, but in spiritual unity.

    This reasoning would easily come from a Oneness believer, but I can't see how a trinitarian can not see the distinction between the Father and Son as relevant. In order to beleive that we become gods, or part of the Godhead, you would have to then suggest that Jesus IS the Father and the Father IS the Son. This would not allow for any distinction of person.

    ~Lorelei
     
  13. Johnv

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    .
    I don't think this is the case at all. I've never heard any ex or present RCC priest, member, layperson, or other say anything remotely close to the the idea that we become part of the Godhead in any manner.
     
  14. Lorelei

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    I don't think this is the case at all. I've never heard any ex or present RCC priest, member, layperson, or other say anything remotely close to the the idea that we become part of the Godhead in any manner.
    </font>[/QUOTE]
    I was just quoting their own catechism from the official Vatican website. Not sure what else they meant by "that he...might make men gods..". If it's part of their catechism, it's part of their beliefs is it not?

    But I didn't want to take the thread off topic, I just thought I would mention it since they are not considered "New Age" but do have this statement in their official catechism. Many folks are not aware that statement is there.

    ~Lorelei
     
  15. S.k.y

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    What does the Bible mean when it calls us "sons of God"?

    Surely the Bible mean what it says when it says we shall be higher than the angels?

    Obviously this puts us below God and above angels?

    Doesn't this mean we shall less power than God but greater power than angels?

    And, yet, if ALL power has been given to The Son do we not then share in this very power?

    Is not this power the same power that created all creation?

    Are we not partakers in this power?

    Do we and will we wield this power? Have some of the same capabilities even?

    All the verses that say The Father is "in" The Son and The Son "in" The Father and The Son "in" us and we "in" The Son; in fact, Jesus makes it plain that where they are we should be as well.

    John 14:3, "And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also."

    Where is this?

    John 17:24, "Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world."

    Where will Jesus be?

    Certainly we are not to selectively interpret Scripture to mean what we want it to or think it should but instead let it stand as it so states for where it refers to The Father and Son being "in" each other it should be regarded as literal but why when it refers, for example, to Jesus and we "in" each other some prefer it to be but figurative. This sounds contradictory.

    John 14:20, "At that day ye shall know that I am in my Father, and ye in me, and I in you."

    For example: how far "in"to the light must one go before being "in" the light?
     
  16. S.k.y

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    We share in His glory, but we do not take his identity.

    We are not gods nor will we be gods.

    Some of the verses you quote relate to the relationship and identity between the Triune Persons of God. The other verse you quote refer to the way in which the fullness of the Godhead dwells within us in bodily form. Yet, we do not take on the identity of God.

    Communion with God is not the same thing as union or assumption of the identity of God.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Identity is not the issue. Place and position is.
     
  17. S.k.y

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    Being God is not the issue; where our place is and what our position will be is.
     
  18. S.k.y

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  19. S.k.y

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  20. S.k.y

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    We share in His glory, but we do not take his identity.

    Agreed.

    We are not gods nor will we be gods.

    Agreed. We are sons of God, lower than God and higher than angels.

    Some of the verses you quote relate to the relationship and identity between the Triune Persons of God. The other verse you quote refer to the way in which the fullness of the Godhead dwells within us in bodily form. Yet, we do not take on the identity of God.

    when Jesus speaks of the future of our being in the same place as He and The Father; and employs the same speech for He and us as He does fpr He and The Father then it certainly sounds like there is more to it.


    Communion with God is not the same thing as union or assumption of the identity of God.

    "commUNION" seems to go along with all the "in"s, "with"s, "as"s and "like"s used to refer to The Father, The Son, The Holy Spirit, and we ourselves.

    {b]assuming the identity of God is not the issue; our placement and position is.



    [/b]</font>[/QUOTE]
     

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