Asleep in Jesus will God bring with Him.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Brother Bob, Oct 4, 2006.

  1. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob
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    What are your views on those who are asleep in Jesus will God bring with Him. (To bring them with Him, seems they must be where He is?)
    Also, the following scripture talks about "those asleep in Jesus" and "dead in Christ".

    Who or what are they that sleep in Jesus?


    1 Thessalonians, chapter 4

    13: But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.

    14: For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
    15: For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

    16: For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:

    17: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
    18: Wherefore comfort one another with these words. :sleeping_2:
     
  2. Trotter

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    Asleep... dead in Christ... Why, they must be Baptists!

    Seriously, these are believers who have died.
     
  3. Brother Bob

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    I know that. I guess I should of ask the question a little different. What is asleep in Jesus and with God for Him to bring them. The soul or the body?
     
  4. tinytim

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    Body "asleep" or to put it the way our Lord had to put it to the disciples at the tomb of Lazarus, "He is Dead!"

    Soul, in the presence of God. And you are right, how could he bring them with Him unless they are where He is?

    The Spirit is the life of the soul
    The soul is the life of the body.

    In order for our body to raise, we must have our soul present.
    In order for our body and soul to go to heaven, the spirit must be made alive through Christ.
     
  5. Brother Bob

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    Tim;
    If what God is bringing is "asleep in Jesus" then how can it be the body if He is bringing the soul. What is that rest that remaineth for them that do love and serve the Lord that Paul spoke of.

    I agree with all you posted except, just think about "what God is bringing is asleep in Jesus", and I certainly believe He is bringing the souls of all the believers that have died. If the soul is asleep in Jesus then I can explain why Jesus said Lazurus is asleep and Lazurus is dead.
     
    #5 Brother Bob, Oct 4, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 4, 2006
  6. Allan

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    Soul sleep - Seventh Day Adventist hold to this view.

    Although they hold - The soul stays in the body till Jesus comes (to wake it up/resurrect it)

    I have only barely glossed this thread - so my comment is an uninformed one as to any dialog going on

    I just thought I would add the cultic opinion concerning the soul being asleep.

    Wow, I need to just shut up (ramble, ramble, ramble :wavey: ) Ok, I think I will now.
     
  7. Brother Bob

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    Oh, I certainly don't believe the soul is in the grave. Paul said "to be with Christ is far better", talking about dying, so he must of meant the soul, for the body certainly will not be with Christ until the end at the resurrection. Paul also said, there is a rest that remaineth for them that love and serve the Lord. Rest could be "dead" but I don't think so for he said "to be with Christ is far better". Your thoughts?
     
  8. LeBuick

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    2 Corinthians 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
    2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
    3 If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
    4 For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
    5 Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.
    6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
    7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)
    8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
     
  9. Brother Bob

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    Amen

    Now, are they awake or asleep, at rest or going about Heaven?
     
  10. LeBuick

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    I don't think one would go all the way to heaven to get some sleep...
     
  11. Brother Bob

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    Well, I would be glad to sleep in the arms of Jesus until the redemption of my body.

    I just wonder what it is that God will be bringing with Him in the resurrection that is "asleep" in Jesus. (God bring with Him)
     
  12. Allan

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    Bob,
    I think it is an expression that is dealing with our total wholeness.

    Explaintion:
    1. We are a tri-une being (in the likeness of God)
    2. If our spirit and soul is seperate from our body
    ------a. Therefore, we are not whole (one part is asleep [dead] -body) and one part alive in Christ

    So when speaking of us in context of being with God (spirit) we are alive and with Him.
    But in speaking of us with regard to total salvation (renewed body and spirit) we are asleep because in the physical aspect we are not yet alive and renewing completed.
     
  13. Brother Bob

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    That is a good answer.
    Why does it bother Baptist that the soul would be asleep in Jesus until the time of the resurrection. Are we afraid someone will accuse us of being a cult and believing like the SDA?

    Allan; What do you think the souls of the departed are doing them. I mean those that were beheaded for the word of God that were under the altar of God they were at least at rest until they were disturbed and were given white robes and told to rest on for a little while longer?
     
  14. Allan

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    I don't believe those under the altar are any of the church, but those who become believers during the tribulation and are persecuted (and beheaded).

    The soul and spirit, I find in scripture both are used interchangably by scriptures authors as well as distinct but apparenty inseperable, as noted in Hebrews 4:12:

    Each of these are seperate and distinct items (for lack of better wording) and yet they are melded so intimately that we do not know where one begins and the ends. - they are useless by themselves yet we see that together, one animates the other and the other is the definer of what the one does. (That may be reading a little more into it - but I'm open to suggestions)

    With due regard to His Rest:
    The ENTIRE chapter 4 of Hebrews speaks of what it is and is for.
    Rest is not sleep.
     
  15. Allan

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    I forgot one Bro. Bob:

    Well, I what 2 people weren't doing (sleeping that is)

    It appears those who have entered into that rest was talking with Jesus. Although they may have been asking for a lul-a-by but... :laugh: :laugh:

    Anyhoo, the argument could be made that Elijah did not die and therefore has not yet attained, but Moses IS dead and therefore has attained the rest afore mentioned in my previous posting.
     
  16. tinytim

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    I think Allan has hit the nail on the head... and although I could not articulate it the way he did, that is exactly what I believe concerning "asleep"

    As for rest, I think it is in relation to the struggles we go through here.
    It will be soooooo nice when I finally get to Heaven...

    So peaceful, and restful....no problems.... just, well, Heavenly!

    I really don't care what I do. Just being with Christ is enough, and if He wants to put me to sleep for awhile....GREAT!! I love to sleep.

    As a matter of fact, it is raining here, and I would love to just craw back into the bed and go back to sleep...:sleeping_2:
     
  17. Brother Bob

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    Well here, I started to the Gym and my car battery is dead but at least I am alive.

    As far as the souls under the altar of God, even if they were of those who repented later they still were at rest under the altar of God and can't see God putting some souls one place and some another.

    Not trying to be difficult but all the Hebrew scriptures about rest, that is all it says is "rest", no explanation of what that rest is.

    The scripture about Moses does put me to thinking for he certainly was not under the altar.

    There are some things that we see through a glass darkly and I guess this is one of them.

    The reason I brought this up is that I preach that they are asleep in Jesus and God will bring them with Him in that day. So,

    all we have discussed from all of you and myself I can't see where my preaching that would be wrong according to the

    scriptures. I probably will in the future preach they are with Jesus and let it go at that. Thoughts?
     
    #17 Brother Bob, Oct 6, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 6, 2006
  18. bound

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    Great discussion everyone! Very thought provoking...

    Peace and God Bless. :thumbsup:
     
  19. tinytim

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    I think that would be good... afterall, we can't say for certain what we will be doing in Heaven...I don't think our small minds now can even comprehend what is in store for us.
     
  20. Brother Bob

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    My preaching they are asleep in Jesus is also in line with Allan's post above. BTW, I been preaching that for 34 years which is longer than Allan is old.:laugh: :wavey: :flower: Almost got you too Tim.
     
    #20 Brother Bob, Oct 6, 2006
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