Baptism

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by AdoptedDaughter, Nov 26, 2001.

  1. AdoptedDaughter

    AdoptedDaughter
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    I was doing my devotions last night and was reading what the Bible had to say about baptism. I believe that no one should be baptized until they have become saved.
    However, the section in Matthew about baptism got me a little confused. It says, "I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me will come one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not fit to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire." Matthew 3:11.
    What does the part about baptizing for repetence mean?
    Thank you in advance for your replies. I know that they will be helpful to me to understand this part of scripture.

    In Christ's Gracious love,
    Teresa
    :confused: :confused: :confused:
     
  2. donnA

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    A couple of months ago I did some study on baptism for Sunday school. Aren't you talking about John the baptists baptism? It is not the same as our baptism. They were baptised by John becaue they desired to repent, which is different from christian baptism. We are baptised because of personal faith in Jesus. It is a matter of where that faith is placed, John's baptism was for or because of salvation, only a desire to live better. Remember Paul(I forgoit which book), asked about the people's baptism, and they hadn't heard of Jesus but had been baptised, and Paul rebaptised them? They had been baptised with John's baptism. It did not mean salvation anymore then following the O.T. law had given salvation. I would have to go back onve it all to make it more clear. But you might want to look at again, read everything about baptism in the N.T. and you'll begin to see the differences.
     
  3. livin'intheword

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    Jesus was baptized by John right? What was he repenting for? :confused:

    Paula
     
  4. Brian Collins

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by livin'intheword:
    Jesus was baptized by John right? What was he repenting for? :confused:

    Paula
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Who says Jesus was repenting of anything?

    --B C
     
  5. livin'intheword

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    Katie said:
    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>They were baptised by John becaue they desired to repent, which is different from christian baptism. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    What was Jesus repenting for? He was baptized by John.

    Paula
     
  6. Brother Adam

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    Jesus was baptized because it was the will of His Father to be baptized. No, he did not have anything to repent of.

    I believe that Jesus' baptism says something to each of us about the significant meaning of baptism. All to often I see Baptist's take baptism far, far, to lightly. Think about of all of the specific things Jesus Christ commanded- baptism was a BIG one. And anything that Jesus Christ commands is not to be taken lightly.

    When Jesus was baptized the heavens opened up and His Father spoke to Him and He was prepared for His mission that He was about to attend to- the single greatest mission in all of history. As Christians when we are baptized we need to realize it is far more than a witness to others, far more than a mere "symbol". Yes one of the meanings of baptism that we are symbolically dying and rising with Christ, yet it also is a submittance to His will. In Baptism we draw closer to God and recieve His blessing. We are in a way also preparing for the goals God has for us in mind by obeying Him in this act.

    Teresa, those who came forward for John's baptism were being baptized for the "repentance of sins". They were sorry for what they had done, and were coming forward to show their obedience to God and be repentant for the sins they had commited. Yet remember that John said that one was coming who would baptize them with the Holy Spirit. So John was merely making the way for the Savior.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
    Mark 1:1-10
    The beginning of the gospel about Jesus Christ, the Son of God.
    It is written in Isaiah the prophet: "I will send my messenger ahead of you, who will prepare your way"--
    voice of one calling in the desert, `Prepare the way for the Lord, make straight paths for him.'
    And so John came, baptizing in the desert region and preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.
    The whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem went out to him. Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River.
    John wore clothing made of camel's hair, with a leather belt around his waist, and he ate locusts and wild honey.
    And this was his message: "After me will come one more powerful than I, the thongs of whose sandals I am not worthy to stoop down and untie.
    I baptize you with water, but he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit."
    At that time Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan.
    As Jesus was coming up out of the water, he saw heaven being torn open and the Spirit descending on him like a dove.
    And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    UNP, Adam
     
  7. changed_like_saul

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    When is "rebaptism" needed or is it ever needed?

    Changed like Saul, by God's grace
    Elder Chris Folsom
     
  8. Brother Adam

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by changed_like_saul:
    When is "rebaptism" needed or is it ever needed?

    Changed like Saul, by God's grace
    Elder Chris Folsom
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Rebaptism is done when a person recieves a baptism that is not a Christian baptism (such as a mormon baptism) or when they are baptized before they are saved. An example of this can be found in the book of Acts (though the chapter and verse are fleeting me for the moment so hopefully someone else can help). I was rebaptized on September 9th this year.

    UNP, Adam
     
  9. Dr. Bob

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    Actually, Adam, we add to the confusion of the issue by using a term "rebaptism". Such would by definition NOT ever be needed.

    If a person were biblically baptized in water, then it is a done deal. If they were unbiblically sprinkled, poured on, immersed or drowned, it should NEVER BE CALLED BAPTISM.

    If they were dipped before salvation, they just got wet.

    If they did the Mormon proxy dipping for the dead, they just got wet.

    Let's guard the use of the term "BAPTISM" since it is so closely associated with our name.
     
  10. Dr. Bob

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    Another thought -- baptism OF repentance is a reflection of the limitations of the English language. It makes it look like there is a cause-effect relationship, like this is some special dunking to repent.

    Baptism has always been an outward expression of an inward event. John's was to show a heart that was pure toward God.

    Jesus' was (of course, WITHOUT repenting of any sin)
     
  11. Briguy

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    Adam writes: "In Baptism we draw closer to God and recieve His blessing."

    Adam, I think your statement is an over statement to say the least. Before I comment I would like to know if you really meant it the way you wrote it or if it came out funny. I have agreed with you on other posts so I thought I would ask before I disagree.

    IN Christ,
    Brian
     
  12. Kenneth77

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr. Bob Griffin:


    If a person were biblically baptized in water, then it is a done deal. If they were unbiblically sprinkled, poured on, immersed or *drowned*, it should NEVER BE CALLED BAPTISM.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    :D :D :D :D :D :D :D That is funny, and I am off topic.
     
  13. Brother Adam

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Briguy:
    Adam writes: "In Baptism we draw closer to God and recieve His blessing."

    Adam, I think your statement is an over statement to say the least. Before I comment I would like to know if you really meant it the way you wrote it or if it came out funny. I have agreed with you on other posts so I thought I would ask before I disagree.

    IN Christ,
    Brian
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Yes I do agree that we recieve God's blessing when we are baptized. I can profess this from my own baptism. I don't mean blessing, as in a rush of feelings, and most definitely not in salvation, but none the less- a blessing. I also believe that whenever we are following God's will we have His blessing, and we also draw into a deeper relationship with Him.

    UNP, Adam
     
  14. livin'intheword

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    Just alittle off topic, but not much. Did you know that when a betrothed bride in a Jewish wedding waited for her groom to return from " preparing a place" for her...she would cleans herself in the Mikvah. Could Baptism be our "mikvah"? I think so....


    Paula
     
  15. Briguy

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    Paula, I think not (sorry I just had to say that).

    Adam, When you first trusted Christ you became a new creation (or is it creature), anyway, old was passed away and all was new. Nothing we do later can add to that. If you believe Baptism is mandatory and will bring you closer to God then indeed it may. If, like me, you view Baptism as not a big deal then it is not a way to draw closer to God.

    "Blessing" is a term used so differently by people it is hard to know what other are saying when using this word. A blessing to me is something received that I could not obtain on my own. For example: my 92 Dodge Shadow was a choice based on the resources I had. My wife however was a blessing. ( if you saw me and saw her you would know that God intervened on that one).

    In Christ,
    Brian
     
  16. Brother Adam

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    "Adam, When you first trusted Christ you became a new creation (or is it creature), anyway, old was passed away and all was new. Nothing we do later can add to that."

    Actually I believe we are saved when we come to have faith in Jesus Christ, which I think is somewhat different then trust. I feel that faith is something God gives us and our belief or trust is something that we do. After all, if we are spiritually dead, then we can hardly choose to come back to life.

    "If you believe Baptism is mandatory"

    I believe all Christians are called to be baptized. It is not necessary for salvation.

    "and will bring you closer to God then indeed it may. If, like me, you view Baptism as not a big deal then it is not a way to draw closer to God."

    That is too bad. God finds it to be a very big deal [​IMG]

    UNP, Adam
     
  17. Briguy

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    Adam, I think that you misunderstand God some when you say that he thinks it is a big deal. Actually, I think we should both be careful that we don't speak for God. My feeling from scripture as a whole is that for the early church, Baptism was a bold step to show you belonged to the WAY, sort of a signing on the doted line that you were a follower of Jesus. Now however, we "sign" by reading the Bible going to a local assembly, etc... Paul didn't Baptize hardly at all because he knew that Baptism was not at the heart of Christianity. Keep searching the subject as will I.
    In Christ alone,
    Brian
     
  18. AdoptedDaughter

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    If God didn't see baptism as a big deal, would He have commanded His disciples to go baptize new believers in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit?

    In Christ's gracious love,
    Teresa
     
  19. Jamal5000

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    Hi Teresa,

    When John baptized for repentence, he was both publicizing the coming of Jesus and inviting Jews to come turn away from their sinful behavior. Jews getting baptized before Jesus started his ministry received a different baptismal process than the one that Jews and Gentiles received after Jesus started his ministry. Jews receiving John's repentence baptism are being prepared for their official baptism initiation into the fellowship of believers that would occur after Pentacost. Gentiles like me received the one baptism in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

    I hope this helps.

    God Be With You, Saint
    Jamal5000
    [​IMG]
     
  20. DocCas

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    John's Baptism was Christian baptism and the exact same baptism we practice and receive today. Mark 1 tells us the beginning of the Gospel of Jesus Christ started with John's baptism. The Apostles received only the baptism of John. If John's baptism was not Christian baptism, the Apostles were unbaptized by Christian standards.

    The bible is clear, there is only ONE baptism. Going down into the water as a testimony of Christ's death, and coming up out of the water as a testimony of His resurrection, thus testifying to our participation in His death, burial, and resurrection.

    Baptism is the first step of obedience for the Christian. One who remanins unbaptized remains disobedient.

    [ December 01, 2001: Message edited by: Thomas Cassidy ]
     

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