Baptists that have alcohol for Communion

Discussion in 'Baptist History' started by Ben W, Mar 23, 2005.

  1. Ben W

    Ben W
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    I have recently found out that there is a Baptist Union church in my state that has Port (aged wine) for communion. This got me to thinking, how many Baptist denominations have used Alcoholic WIne and still do for Communion Table, and how many once used Alcoholic wine but switched at some point to non alcoholic?

    NB This is not meant as a thread to discuss whether or not Christians should drink alcohol, but a focus on what has been done historically.
     
  2. Squire Robertsson

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    Here in the US, the practice died out amongst the majority of churches in the second half of the nineteenth century due to their stand on total abstiation. Continental Baptists I understand still have wine for the Lord's Supper. And the Evangelical Christian-Baptists of the the former Soviet Union most certainly have wine at their comemorations. Though, here in the States, the EC-B serve a decent vin ordinaire. Port is outside the budget.
     
  3. Bethelassoc

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    Ben W:

    I believe the Old School Baptists still use wine: Primitive Baptists, Old Regular Baptists, and maybe some United Baptists...though I'm not sure.

    David
     
  4. Bro. James Reed

    Bro. James Reed
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    Yes, the Primitive Baptists use real wine.

    Of course, it's Mogen David, so I don't know that you could really call it "real" wine. ;)

    You won't be finding it on the wine list of your favorite restaurant. [​IMG]
     
  5. mioque

    mioque
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    This thread makes me feel so very decadent.
    I am responsible for buying the wine for Communion.
    Chateauneuf du Pape is usually where it starts.... [​IMG]

    And yes I have bought crates of Champagne at times... :eek:
     
  6. Kiffen

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    It is may understanding as Squire pointed out that it was the common practice among all Baptists before early Prohibition. Mr. Welch who was a Methodist layman and a prohibitionist created a non alcoholic communion wine for churches that eventually it became so popular that Welch's grape juice is now no longer remembered as originally being a a non alcoholic communion wine.
     
  7. Brother J.B.

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    There is a church in the association that i am in that started off using wine. Then changed sometime in the sixties to grape juice, then later back to wine, feeling it was more scriptural. Our wine is made by an older Elder who i believe makes it for several of the churches. He has been an old regular baptist since about 1940 and has always advocated and used wine himself for communion.
     
  8. BIC

    BIC
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    Wasnt the main reason that wine was used was due to the fact that water was unsanitary and unfit to drink?
     
  9. mioque

    mioque
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    Absolutely, same for beer.
     
  10. Scott J

    Scott J
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    I thought beer accidentally created by monks trying to get bread ingredients into a liquid so they could fast longer?
     
  11. Jeff Weaver

    Jeff Weaver
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    Beer, as I understand it, has been found in ancient archeological sites, Egyptian, Sumerian, Persian, etc sites.
     
  12. Brother J.B.

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    I believe Christ had them get the water but then he turned it into wine.
     
  13. mioque

    mioque
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    I've drunk a glass of beer that was brewed according to an ancient Egyptian recipe.
    It was produced as an exercise in experimental archeology.
     
  14. HankD

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    Alcoholic wine is a natural defense against disease. The alcohol is a natural disinfectant and preservative which kills and inhibits pathogens within the wine and then in one's stomach.

    Today we have other methods to purify and prevent the spoilage of foods.

    However, some of those other methods involve toxic substances which IMO are far worse than alcohol.

    The use of alcoholic wine is scriptural apart from two reasons.

    1) Unless one is "given" to "much" wine.
    2) If the use of alcohol as a beverage offends the brethren or is disallowed (and IMO this is limited to the local church where one is a member).

    Therefore, I abstain for reason #2.

    If I had my "druthers", I would be Old School and use real wine at the Lord's Table.

    HankD
     
  15. Chad Whiteley

    Chad Whiteley
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    Many churches use juice now. I led my church back to using wine. I have a sort or irreverant webpage for those who want more information:

    http://www.freewebs.com/firstmbc/redwine.htm

    These are the basic reasons why I feel wine should be used:

    1) We have a biblical example.
    2) We have an historical example.
    3) We can not improve on what Christ did.
    4) Wine is a cleanser, and pictures the fact that Jesus' blood cleanses us from all sin.
    5) The bitterness of the wine pictures the bitter suffering of Christ.
    6) It is commonly accepted by all "Old School" Baptist that wine is the unleavened form of the fruit of the vine. This is born our in scripture. Real wine was used in the offerings in the OT, and it was considered unleavened.
     
  16. Preacher's Boy

    Preacher's Boy
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    wine and juice are not the same thing in English or Greek....the Biblical Greek uses the word for wine throughout...
     
  17. Ulsterman

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    I am sure those saved from the sin of alcoholism appreciate it.
     
  18. Chad Whiteley

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    There are some in the world who are hydro-phobic, but I still baptize them in water. I could email you the testimony of many alcoholics and their reaction to the Lord's Supper. It is much more important that we please the Lord instead of men. The fact is that an alcoholic man or woman who approaches the table with the right spirit will not be tempted to return to liquor over the feast.

    There is simply no reason for the modern church to change the word to make it more appealling to people. Instead, we should change the hearts and minds of men and women to make them conform to the word. The last point I submit to you is the fact that the Lord's Supper among Baptists is voluntary. I would never force anyone to take it. If a member of my church decides to come, but not partake, that is their choice. And I will not retaliate in any way.
     
  19. Chad Whiteley

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    Preacher's Boy, I would like to know from you what the Greek word for "juice" is. I actually have been unable to find one. I even have an old English-Koine Greek dictionary and it has not helped. This is something I have been working on for years. The Greek word for "juice" would make an even more powerful argument why we should use wine in the feast.
     
  20. Mark Osgatharp

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    J.B. Jeter, a well known Virginia Baptist of the 19th century, stated in his biography that in the early 1800s most all the Baptists used alcohol as a beverage and that he himself did. Then, throught the influence of the so called "temperance" advocates (who went around to churches getting people to sign teetotaling pledges), the use of alcohol became such a stigma that he quit using it altogether.

    Those behind the temperance movement were the same people behind the abolitionist and feminist movements.

    The Methodists were some of the primary movers of these social movements. Ironically, the Methodists today are known for being more tolerant of the use of alcohol than Baptists, when it was originally the Methodists who influenced the Baptists into a teetotaling position.

    By the way, though most all Landmark Baptist churches have a covenant which prohibits the use of alcohol as a beverage, there are quite a few which use wine in the Lord's supper, though not so many as in years gone by.

    Mark Osgatharp
     

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