beer and religion?

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by johnlad, Dec 28, 2001.

  1. johnlad

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    What does the bible say about beer?
     
  2. Psalm145 3

    Psalm145 3
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    I believe beer is considered a strong drink.

    Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

    Ephesians 5:17,18 Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is. And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit.

    1 Corinthians 6:9,10 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

    Galatians 5:19,21 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these... Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

    Christians should totally abstain from alchoholic beverages in this adulterous and sinful generation.

    1 Thessalonians 5:22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

    If it takes you 12 beers to get drunk, then one beer is 1/12th drunk.

    Let me encourage everyone to stay away from those New Year's Eve parties where alchohol is involved. Are you really a Christian? Then let your light shine! Tell your friends what the Lord Jesus has done for you and how you want to follow Him. They might think you're weird, but your testimony may help them to repent and come to Christ.

    1 Peter 4:3,4 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries: Wherein they think it strange that ye run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you.

    1 Peter 4:7 But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.
     
  3. S. Baptist

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by johnlad:
    What does the bible say about beer?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Do you know why Jesus said he was "thirsty", then refuse to drink when offer, as he was being Crucified???

    Nu 6:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

    2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When either man or woman shall separate themselves to vow a vow of a Nazarite, to separate themselves unto the LORD:

    3 He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink, and shall drink no vinegar of wine, or vinegar of strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grapes, nor eat moist grapes, or dried.

    Jesus was a "Nazarite", (Nazarene in NT).

    Mt 27:34 They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink.

    If Jesus had drink the "Vinegar", he would have broken his "vow", and "SINNED".

    If you're to "Conform to his image", you have to be a "Nazarite" also.
     
  4. Rev. Joshua

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Psalm145 3:
    If it takes you 12 beers to get drunk, then one beer is 1/12th drunk. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    If jumping from 100 feet will kill you, then if you jump from 10 feet are you 1/10 dead? If drinking 10 gallons of water will drown you, will drinking a glass make you 1/100 drowned?

    As to the original question, I don't think you'll find much mention of beer in the Bible. I think it was limited to the Germanic areas of the world for a long time. Of course, real beer didn't come along until Sam Adams.

    Joshua

    [ December 28, 2001: Message edited by: Rev. Joshua Villines ]
     
  5. S. Baptist

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rev. Joshua Villines:


    Of course, real beer didn't come along until Sam Adams.

    Joshua

    [ December 28, 2001: Message edited by: Rev. Joshua Villines ]
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


    Kinda had me worried for a minute, I thought you were going to say "BUDWISER".

    :eek: ;)
     
  6. Psalm145 3

    Psalm145 3
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    Rev. Joshua Villines - repent!
     
  7. swaimj

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    This past summer I toured Lexington and Concord, MA. In the house where Paul Revere aroused some militia, the guide showed us a picture of Paul Revere. I thought to myself, isn't that Sam Adams? The guide explained that the picture of "Sam Adams" on Sam Adams beer is a picture of Paul Revere. I guess Paul was better looking!
     
  8. Mike McK

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by S. Baptist:


    Do you know why Jesus said he was "thirsty", then refuse to drink when offer, as he was being Crucified???

    Nu 6:1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

    2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When either man or woman shall separate themselves to vow a vow of a Nazarite, to separate themselves unto the LORD:

    3 He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink, and shall drink no vinegar of wine, or vinegar of strong drink, neither shall he drink any liquor of grapes, nor eat moist grapes, or dried.

    Jesus was a "Nazarite", (Nazarene in NT).

    Mt 27:34 They gave him vinegar to drink mingled with gall: and when he had tasted thereof, he would not drink.

    If Jesus had drink the "Vinegar", he would have broken his "vow", and "SINNED".

    If you're to "Conform to his image", you have to be a "Nazarite" also.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    A Nazerite and a Nazerine are two different things.

    I'm not sure Jesus was a Nazerite. What's the point of our being freed from the law if we have to take a Nazerites vow anyway.

    Besides, part of the Nazerite vow is not cutting your hair. This could be quite a quandry for IBF'ers, who believe long hair is evil.

    Anyway, about beer. In about a half hour, I'm going to play at the East End. When I'm done (never before), I'm sure I'll have a Yeungleung or two. I might even dance when we get done.

    Mike

    http://www.keylife.org
     
  9. Deitrich B

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    The scripture says nothing about beer. Therefore you need to discern if it is right or wrong for you. I personally enjoy tossing back a few, if its an issue for you I would suggest you not partake, if its causing your sister/neighbor to stumble; abstain. This is not a difficult question why try to make it one?
    D
     
  10. rlvaughn

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    Since this topic refers to "what the Bible says about beer" rather than, for example, what do Southern Baptists, independent Baptists, or American Baptists say about beer, I feel it is better to move this to the Bible Study forum.
     
  11. Psalm145 3

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    I think some people do not understand how serious this matter of alchohol really is. Can you "catch a buzz" on a few beers once and a while and think nothing of it? If so, you better really wonder if you are saved. If you "catch a buzz" once a year, like on New Year's Eve, then you are a drunkard. Drunkards shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

    Listen, this is very serious! Hell is real, and drunkards will be punished there forever and ever, Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. What shall a man give in exchange for his soul? Is a few beers worth everlasting life?

    The good news is, there is forgivness. If you have been drinking and now you are convicted by the Holy Spirit that drinking is sinful, and that you deserve everlasting punishment in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone, and you know you cannot save yourself, then repent of your sins and flee to Christ. Jesus will take you in just as you are, but He won't let you stay that way. If you really believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, you will repent. Christians are no longer drunkards. Repentance is absolutely necessary for salvation.

    2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
     
  12. Pete Richert

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    I was hoping S Baptist would comment on being a "nazarite" and cutting your hair. Should none of us ever cut our hair, in order to conform to the image of Christ.
     
  13. Helen

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    The Bible has a little more to say than what has been said above:

    Proverbs 31:4-7:
    It is not for kinds, O Lemuel --
    not for kings to drink wine,
    not for rulers to crave beer,
    lest they drink and forget what the law decrees,
    and deprive all the oppressed of their rights.
    Give beer to those who are perishing,
    wine to those who are in anguish;
    let them drink and forget their poverty
    and remember their misery no more.


    And, from Matthew 11:18-19 -- Jesus is speaking:

    For John came neither eating nor drinking and they say 'He has a demon.' The Son of Man came eating and drinking, and they say, 'Here is a glutton and a drunkard, a friend of tax collectors and "sinners"'! But wisdom is proved right by her actions.

    I would suggest that in order for Jesus to have been accused of being a drunkard, he must have been doing more than drinking water and unfermented fruit juice! He also turned the water in to wine at the wedding.


    The point of the entire teaching in both the Old and New Testaments is not to drink to excess -- don't get drunk. Best not to even get high unless you are dying or in great agony (Prov. 31).

    It is also important to remember that different people do have different reactions to alcohol and some should not touch the stuff with a ten-foot pole. Ever. And the rest need to understand that and not accuse them of being 'legalistic,' when what they might be doing is simply protecting themselves.

    On the other side of the fence, those who know they are free to have a glass of wine or beer occasionally without ill effects should not be accused of being sinners by others.

    There is one time in particular the Bible mentions a man falling down passed-out drunk: Noah. And the Bible NEVER condemns or even criticizes him regarding this episode. Personally, I think he got drunk because of a dramatic change in air pressure after the Flood and he had no idea that wine in the amount that was safe before the Flood would do that to him after. We sure don't have record of a second episode.

    But what should be noticed about this is that Noah WAS growing grapes for wine. Some say he did not know the grape juice was fermenting as fermentation was not in effect before the Flood. First of all, there is no reason to think the chemical properties of anything changed after the Flood and, secondly, if Noah had been expecting grape juice and gotten a mouthful of wine, his -- any anyone's -- natural reaction would have been to spit it out!

    Noah was a righteous man. He made and drank wine. Jesus turned water into wine. Paul told Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach's sake. Jesus was accused of being a drunkard.

    The Bible does NOT prohibit drinking wine or beer. The Bible DOES prohibit drinking in excess so that one's sensibilities are compromised. For some people half an ounce is half an ounce excess. For others, a normal glass of wine or beer occasionally is fine. THIS IS BIBLICAL!

    Also, regarding Nazarite vows. Jesus made a deliberate comparison of himself with John the Baptist as quoted above. John the B. was a Nazarite and had taken the vows as indicated by mention of his food and clothing. By contrasting himself with that, Jesus was clearly indicating that He was NOT a Nazarite.

    As far as what a drunkard is, in terms of not being allowed in heaven, I think Isaiah has a pretty good description of this sort of person in 5:11 & 22:

    Woe to those who rise early in the morning
    to run after their drinks,
    who stay up late at night
    till they are inflamed with wine.

    ...Woe to those who are heroes at drinking wine
    and champions at mixing drinks.


    Neither of these verses describes the person who has a glass of wine or beer occasionally.
     
  14. Psalm145 3

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Noah was a righteous man. He made and drank wine.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    David was a righteous man. He committed adultery and murder.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> I would suggest that in order for Jesus to have been accused of being a drunkard, he must have been doing more than drinking water and unfermented fruit juice! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Why are you so quick to believe the accusers? The Lord Jesus Christ was accused of many things, yet He was without sin. There is NOWHERE in the infallible Word of God that says Christ drank alchohol.

    When Jesus made the water into wine at the marriage in Cana, it had to be unfermented, non-alchoholic.

    Habakkuk 2:15 Woe unto him that giveth his neighbour drink, that puttest thy bottle to him, and makest him drunken also...
     
  15. Chris Temple

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    John 2:1-11 (ESV)
    On the third day there was a wedding at Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. [2] Jesus also was invited to the wedding with his disciples. [3] When the wine ran out, the mother of Jesus said to him, "They have no wine." [4] And Jesus said to her, "Woman, what does this have to do with me? My hour has not yet come." [5] His mother said to the servants, "Do whatever he tells you."
    [6] Now there were six stone water jars there for the Jewish rites of purification, each holding twenty or thirty gallons. [7] Jesus said to the servants, "Fill the jars with water." And they filled them up to the brim. [8] And he said to them, "Now draw some out and take it to the master of the feast." So they took it. [9] When the master of the feast tasted the water now become wine, and did not know where it came from (though the servants who had drawn the water knew), the master of the feast called the bridegroom
    [10] and said to him, "Everyone serves the good wine first, and when people have drunk freely, then the poor wine. But you have kept the good wine until now." [11] This, the first of his signs, Jesus did at Cana in Galilee, and manifested his glory. And his disciples believed in him.

    How can wine be evil, when Christ is the Great Winemaker?

    Proverbs 31:6 (ESV)
    Give strong drink to the one who is perishing,
    and wine to those in bitter distress;

    1 Tim. 5:23 (ESV)
    (No longer drink only water, but use a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent ailments.)
     
  16. Kiffin

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    Jesus was not a Nazarite! He was a Nazarene from Nazareth. The 2 terms are not the same.
     
  17. doodle

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    If you take a Baptist friend on a fishing trip, do you know how to keep him from drinking all the beer?

    That a second Baptist along...Get it??? :D
     
  18. Lorelei

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Psalm145 3:

    When Jesus made the water into wine at the marriage in Cana, it had to be unfermented, non-alchoholic.
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Says who? Why do you insist it HAD to be unfermented? Because you don't want to think that Jesus may have had a glass of wine? Look at the verses quoted by Chris.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>10] and said to him, "Everyone serves the good wine first, and when people have drunk freely, then the poor wine. But you have kept the good wine until now." <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Why do they save the poor wine for later? Becuase by that point people are at least "tipsy" if you will, otherwise people would surely realize it was a poorer tasting wine. I know if I were at a wedding that served pop, I would notice if they suddenly traded the name brand I had been drinking for generic. But if I had been drinking wine and were tipsy I might not notice the change.

    And what IF the wine before had been fermented but when Jesus made his wine it was Un-fermented? (Which I dont' believe to be the case) Was Jesus being a bad witness for attending a party where real wine was served? According to you He would have been! :confused:

    ~Lorelei
     
  19. Roadrunner

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    Hi John,
    The Bible clearly condemns drunkeness. That is always a no-no. As for moderate alcohol intake, treat it according to Romans 14.
     
  20. S. Baptist

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Smoke_Eater:


    A Nazerite and a Nazerine are two different things.

    I'm not sure Jesus was a Nazerite. What's the point of our being freed from the law if we have to take a Nazerites vow anyway.

    Besides, part of the Nazerite vow is not cutting your hair. This could be quite a quandry for IBF'ers, who believe long hair is evil.


    http://www.keylife.org
    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    1. Nu 6:1 When either man or woman shall separate themselves to vow a vow of a
    Nazarite,
    1A. Ro 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your
    bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.


    2. Nu 6:1 to separate themselves unto the LORD:
    2A. Co 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord,

    2. Nu 6:3 He shall separate himself from wine and strong drink,
    2A. Tit 1:7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not
    soon angry, not given to wine,

    3. Nu 6:5 All the days of the vow of his separation there shall no razor come upon his
    head:
    3A. 1Co 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a
    shame unto him?

    Do you get your hair "cut" or head "shaved"???


    To be saved, you have to make the "vow of a Nazarite".
     

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