Biblical counseling

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by evangelist6589, Jun 6, 2016.

  1. evangelist6589

    evangelist6589
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    This is an effective method for dealing with "sin" problems but sometimes Biblical Counselors assume things to be sin problems but in reality they are not. For example there are books out there that treat insomnia like a spiritual issue when it's not. Or take anxiety and depression which can be spiritual problems but also can be chemical imbalances. Any objections?

    I mean there is a difference between a sin problem and a chemical imbalance. Turret syndrome is not a sin problem for example but a medical problem. Many more examples can be mentioned that some Biblical Counselors mistake to be sin problems.
     
    #1 evangelist6589, Jun 6, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2016
  2. Rolfe

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    My own opinion. The claim that most mental problems can be blamed on that individual's sin is overly simplistic.
     
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  3. Darrell C

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    Maybe. But I don't think you have much to worry about, because it is standard procedure these days to find a physical condition and diagnose meds for it/them.

    One question I would have for you is, do you not think that Biblical canceling can help those who anxiety, depression, or turrets? I knew someone diagnosed with turrets, and my diagnosis?

    Spoiled, undisciplined brat. And this was a grown man, lol. If he spent more time in study and seeking after God, rather than shooting pool and drinking beer, perhaps his "syndrome" may have dramatically improved. I have known many people who were "diagnosed" with some condition or other, and most of them are completely dysfunctional. I would suggest to you that the last course of action that should be taken is prescribing medications, which will ensure more medications and a scrambled personality. They will diagnose, prescribe, and before long there is no question you are what they diagnosed.

    Curious, no?

    It's big business, and just like abortion, the ethical standard, in my opinion, is highly questionable.

    Biblical counseling is far superior to medicating, and the Diagnosis of God about man is a diagnosis that is faithful. While I do not take the view that some of those who are more radical in their behavior must be demon possessed, I do not discount it as a possibility. Most problems people have are emotional, which leads to drug and alcohol abuse. Abuse your mind too long with these substances, and you can do irreparable damage. Is the answer to put them on psych meds? I don't believe so. The answer must first start with teaching them to deal with their problems head on, and getting their emotions under control. AA has this simple principle a a foundational method of dealing with alcoholism (as does NA), and while the psycho-babblers give an impression of dealing with this/these issues, to keep "the business" afloat...meds are of course prescribed.

    Most people suffering from certain conditions have something in common, they need to grow up a little emotionally. And the best way to do that is to first perceive yourself with a realistic perception, which is a fundamental failure we all have, lol. It's not until we can compare ourselves with God that we better know ourselves. And it is when we understand God's diagnosis concerning mankind, well, if you ask me, that's actually a comfort. People who feel bad about themselves might not dwell on it so much if they understand...that the condition they were born in. And then...

    ...it's time for the Good News.

    Worked for me. I was both a drug addict and alcoholic, and because of Biblical counseling, and the Ministry of God, He took those things out of my life.


    God bless.
     
  4. Earth Wind and Fire

    Earth Wind and Fire
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    AMEN....you paint a solid picture of the situation.....and I agree, what you don't want to do is treat problems with medications that will make you more blotto. But it is a delicate balance, if there is someone with manic depression (bipolar), that is a chemical imbalance. It really depends on the individual & the ailment. My niece has a nervous disorder ---brought on by undue stress that really debilitated her. So they had to treat her but they also told her that she had to work through it---tough it out if you will. Today, I am proud to say she is much better, graduated college & working on her masters. She now only takes the meds when very stressed.....a work in progress.
     
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  5. evangelist6589

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    Being a drug addict and a alcoholic are sin problems and need Biblical counseling. However Tourette syndrome is a medical problem and I assure you that you do not fully understand it. I have the condition and require medications to stop the ticks. Without the meds I have ticks, the body is not stable, I feel more anxious and such. But with the meds there is a world of difference. This is not a biblical counseling issue as I had tried talk therapy for many years and it got me nowhere until I got some prescribed meds and bango the problem has been treated.
     
  6. Earth Wind and Fire

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    If you can disclose, what type of meds are used to treat the Tourette's? Note, I had to treat my own depression but that's not the same thing....and of course, everyone's different
     
  7. evangelist6589

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    Abilify
     
  8. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Thanks.....please be cautious with it.
     
  9. tyndale1946

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    I have a question... Many years ago I went to counseling with my wife... This was not biblical counseling and I won't get into it... But the counselor told her well the problem is you... You need to accept this man as he is... That is the answer?... What kind of solution is that?... I turned to her and said this man cannot help us and walked out...I addressed a problem and sought help and that's the help I got?... The problem I see there are good and bad counselors.. I suppose but I don't for sure in biblical counseling this is not also so... But I do know one thing that the best counselor is the Lord... In fact that is one of his names... Wonderful Counselor!... I am not trying to throw anyone under the bus but the bible also says to guard yourself as you can also be tempted... I feel and I be wrong but those who can help those the best are those who have walked in their shoes... I can't never help a drunk... I've never been a drunk... Or a drug addict... I will try to phrase this as kind as I can and these are just my thoughts how can you help or understand what a brother or sister has been through unless you have been through it yourself?... I know you mean well we all do but unless you have been there would not the helper cause more harm than good?... Those are my thoughts... Brother Glen
     
  10. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Huh....when did I say counseling?
     
  11. evangelist6589

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    Thats the claim of some christians, even those in leadership positions.
     
  12. Rob_BW

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    I have known two men with Tourettes, neither were what I would consider undisciplined. Good men doing their best with their condition.

    And as far drug and alchol addiction, they may arise from sin, but they develop a definite medical apsect after time.
     
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  13. Darrell C

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    That is not all that is associated with this "syndrome," though I do admit my understanding of it is through this person I know. Included were tendencies that were without question what I believe to be treatable with Biblical counseling (and perhaps application of Biblical principles, such as the rod, for example).

    But I'll google it to see if what I was told doesn't match the syndrome.

    Okay, found this:


    Perhaps the most dramatic and disabling tics include motor movements that result in self-harm such as punching oneself in the face or vocal tics including coprolalia (uttering socially inappropriate words such as swearing) or echolalia (repeating the words or phrases of others). However, coprolalia is only present in a small number (10 to 15 percent) of individuals with TS. Some tics are preceded by an urge or sensation in the affected muscle group, commonly called a premonitory urge. Some with TS will describe a need to complete a tic in a certain way or a certain number of times in order to relieve the urge or decrease the sensation.

    Tics are often worse with excitement or anxiety and better during calm, focused activities. Certain physical experiences can trigger or worsen tics, for example tight collars may trigger neck tics, or hearing another person sniff or throat-clear may trigger similar sounds. Tics do not go away during sleep but are often significantly diminished.



    This person was basically excused from social activity which was not appropriate. Again, he needed a swift kick in the rear to address those issues, and again...Biblical counseling wold have been preferable to excusing his behavior.You are right, I don't fully understand Tourette syndrome, but I understand fully how Biblical Counseling could impact those who suffer it. My only point was that it is better than simply prescribing meds, and this dealt more with thos who are diagnosed with conditions then end up suffering the consequences of the side affects.

    In regards to this...

    ...do you really not understand that drug and alcohol abuse impacts people physically? Of course they are sin problems but most become alcohol and drug abusers due to issues that, again, could be avoided through Biblical counseling. This begins when they are children.

    As a former drug addict and alcoholic, I can tell you now that if I were given a choice between that and having tourette's...I would have gladly exchanged the two.

    I am not saying it's not bad (tourette syndrome), and I am sorry you have had to suffer it, but only a drug addict and alcoholic can understand the literal Hell one can be in while in the throes of addiction. Usually these are turned to to "medicate" the underlying problems, and the irony is that they are then given...more drugs, which also impact the physical body. Supposedly they are supposed to be good, but, having seen the results of these medications I can assure you that is not always the case. So again...Biblical Counseling first.


    I see that it can be a sin problem, and saw that in the person I knew. It was used as an excuse for inappropriate behavior. And his mother contributed to that. You present it as though tics are the only element to the syndrome, thus limit it to "a medical problem." Then, limit drug and alcohol abuse to a sin problem. I don't see either as accurate.



    God bless.
     
  14. Darrell C

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    I would agree with that, because there are circumstances that arise...through someone else's sin, which impacts those who have "mental problems."

    So two questions:

    1. Do you think that there is a larger percentage of people with "mental problems" who could benefit from Biblical Counseling rather than being medicated, and

    2. Why does your Icon look like he's toking on a roach?

    ;)

    I am a former drug addict, after all, don't blame me if my mind sees that.


    God bless.
     
  15. evangelist6589

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    Yes there can be elements of TS and those that have it to be sin related but it would be a huge mistake to draw a straw-man from your one experience and label everyone who has the disorder by your experience. What do you say of my example?

    "Perhaps the most dramatic and disabling tics include motor movements that result in self-harm such as punching oneself in the face or vocal tics including coprolalia (uttering socially inappropriate words such as swearing) or echolalia (repeating the words or phrases of others)."

    I do not experience these symptoms and if I did I would be in sin and too this we can agree. Not everyone with the syndrome repeats the above behaviors, and if they did it would be a sin.

    "Some tics are preceded by an urge or sensation in the affected muscle group, commonly called a premonitory urge. Some with TS will describe a need to complete a tic in a certain way or a certain number of times in order to relieve the urge or decrease the sensation....Certain physical experiences can trigger or worsen tics, for example tight collars may trigger neck tics, or hearing another person sniff or throat-clear may trigger similar sounds. Tics do not go away during sleep but are often significantly diminished."

    These I have experienced and the meds definitely help reduce the need for tics. Can Biblical counseling solve a medical problem? Like I said earlier I had tried for years with talk therapy to resolve these kinds of issues to no success. The success came when I started taking the meds which would indicate I have a medical problem.
     
  16. Rolfe

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    You are joking, right?
     
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  17. JonC

    JonC
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    To those unlearned in muppetology, well....:Roflmao
     
  18. tyndale1946

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    Now be kind to the brother he never was exposed to the finer points of humor!... Brother Glen
     
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  19. Rolfe

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    Seriously, what is it about people whining about others' avatars?

    First someone complained about this:

    [​IMG]

    Then this:

    [​IMG]

    Now this:
    [​IMG]

    I think some need to pick the burrs out of their backsides if this is the type of thing that bothers them. Lighten up, people.
     
  20. Darrell C

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    And that's the point: the "diagnosis" was used as an excuse.

    It's interesting the link said something like only 10-15% experience certain "symptoms," and in my view these were not symptoms but excused behavior.

    So too with many people who are "diagnosed," just like with substance abuse, there are underlying issues that could be effectively treated with Biblical Counseling, rather than meds.

    Now I ask you, does your medication treat the physical aspect, or have they told you it treats you psychologically? Are the tics and other physical traits physical, or only in your mind?


    It's not even relevant to what I was speaking about.

    And it isn't relevant to the premise of your OP. You seem to mock those who look at conditions diagnosed and treated with medications with disdain.



    Biblical Counselors assume? It's not an assumption that insomnia is not a spiritual issue? Where do you get your basis for this?

    And can you tell me on what authority you state "take anxiety and depression which can be spiritual problems but also can be chemical imbalances."? Can you tell me how those "chemical imbalances," if they are in fact a reality, came about?

    Can you tell me that all people function upon the same chemical structure? And that if one does not meet a standard chemical profile, then there is something wrong with them that must be treated with drugs?

    And can you tell me why trying to work someone through depression or anxiety cannot be successful with Biblical counseling? Why would you discredit the views of those who think the Word of God can help people with "mental problems?"

    As far as Turrets, while the physical aspect of it is a physical condition, it is only relevant when the social behavioral aspect of it enters this discussion. I will say it again: psycho-babble is big business and as far as I am concerned primary a scam on their part and a crutch for most who are involved. I can talk about this because in my days of addiction I dealt personally with this issue.

    And it was God that delivered me, not secular counselors trying to shift me from my choice of drugs to theirs.


    God bless.
     

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