Birth Control ... Right or Wrong?

Well I am sure glad this new thread has cleared up this topic for us

 

4His_glory is right. Where the bible is silent so shall we. Yeah I know there are verses that say God opens and closes the womb. But many children died and so did mothers during childbirth, keeping numbers down. Times are different.

God gave us modern medicine to both help control too many unwanted pregnancies and to keep both babies and mothers alive. I do not advocate killing babies at conception or at any time. It is up to each couple and their relationship with God on how many kids they want. A quiver full for one couple may not be the same quiver full for another. That verse isn't talking about numbers.

To have children to prove ones spirituality or for wrong motives is worse than child abuse or neglect. For couples who love kids and have nothing to "prove", who can care for them in all the ways kids need to be cared for great. Praise God and may God bless them with all they want.

Thank God for vasectomies, or I would have a child every year.

 

"God gave us modern medicine to both help control too many unwanted pregnancies and to keep both babies and mothers alive. I do not advocate killing babies at conception or at any time."-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What a contradiction. Look folks, I have given you the facts, what you do with them is up to you. If you are using BCP's you will eventually pass a live zygot that could not implant because of your BCP's. If you are not against abortion, you should have no porblems with this fact. But if you are against abortion you can not equvicate on BCP's without becoming a big hypocrite. You can't be a man and woman at the same time, you can't be a murderer and an innocent man at the same time, You can't vote for Bush and Kerry at the same time. Some things are mutually exclusive. You can't be against abortion and for BCP's at the same time. I know you hate it, but it is just the way it is. Sorry. I really am!

 

Why is this a contradiction?

Not all birth control gets rid of conception.
vasectomies, tying tubes, condomns, pills, patches etc.
So what is the problem?

 

Well some folks are saying birth control is ok, without any qualifications. If you qualify it and say you are talking about rhythm or withdrawal or condoms then you are ok. But you did say modern "medicines" so that would include BCP's and surgical means. So you have to be clearer.

 

I thought I was clear!

I am against any type of "birth Control" that kills conception. Any type of birth control that doesn't allow conception to me is fine.

 

Bunyon,
The problem is that how does one know whether you have given the facts.
I, for example, have asked prolife doctors in my town about this issue, and they disagree with you. They say that NOT all pills are abortifacients.

Karen

 

"Since you think it was legal, you prove that it was. Go ahead. I double dog dare ya"--------------------------------------------------------------

But you are not clear Sunny. Stoping conception means a life never happens. Only things that stop a pregnancy after conception is abortion. So I am gatering that you are saying that anything that stops a pregnancy after conception is wrong, this is what you mean by "kills conception", and I agree.

 

I agree. I thought that was clear too. By the way not every BCP will do as Bunyon is saying.

 

lol

 

"""Bunyon,
The problem is that how does one know whether you have given the facts.
I, for example, have asked pro-life doctors in my town about this issue, and they disagree with you. They say that NOT all pills are abortifacients.

Karen "-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I am more qualified than your doctor in that area, but you don't have to depend on me. Go to your local pharmacy and ask your pharmacist to give you a package product insert on a bi or tri-phasic birth control pill. That would cover all the bcp's on the shelf in most pharmacies. It will tell you that the secondary mechanism of action is to make the uterine mucosa hostile to the zygote implantation. If you get an honest answer from a proffesional, he will tell you that this secondary effect will come into play at some point. The primary effect is only 90 something percent effective, to achieve the 99+ percent effectiveness that all major BCP's have you must use the Bi and Triphasics which will rely on the secondary effect I described to achieve the 99+ percent effectiveness.

There are BCP's that only cause an-ovulation, but no one uses them because they do not have a 99+ percent effectiveness rate and the cause lots of bloating, breast tenderness, spot bleeding etc etc.

No pharmacies carry them, no one buys them.

Your pro-live doctor has probably compromised, as we all have, on BCP's and dose not want to admit the facts to himself.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I wonder how many true Calvinist out there use birth Control in any way. Seems like a contradiction to their theology.

Max

 

Whats a true calvinist? What do you mean?

 

I don't think they do. I don't know the percentage, but I would be surprised if even 10% of never-marrieds between 15-30 are virgins. (I just picked that age range arbitrarily)

 

About 35% of all babies are born out of wedlock, including nearly 70% of all black babies.

So, I would say that it's not a very often practiced form of birth control before marriage, and I hope it's not practiced too often within marriage.

 

You know, until someone can tell me just when God provides a human being with a soul, I'm not about to tell someone that they are commiting murder by taking BC pills.

Do any of you have any idea of how many zygotes fail to implant in ladies that don't take birth control?????

My body let go of a bunch of them because I always ovulated at a time when my uterus wasn't primed for action. ie, you can't get pregnant if your womb isn't in just the right condition. I managed to get pregnant three times. Once took a year and a half of trying until my body was just right. The second took fertility drugs. The third was the result of those BC pills you've just told me not to take. Well those pills primed my body to the point where just one week after being off them I conceived. My doctors had already told me that I would never concieve again without help. The pills were by that point being taken for other problems.(not that those problems had ceased, that month I had just run out and hey, I wasn't supposed to get pregnant anyway!)

Now I'm going to go hunt down some stats and links. While I'm gone someone can explain to me just how a fact of nature becomes a sin when we encourage it.(in case you've gotten lost by this point, I want to know how keeping a zygote from implanting is a sin when this happens naturally all the time. To do that you are going to have to convince me of just when God provides us with a soul).

 

"Do any of you have any idea of how many zygotes fail to implant in ladies that don't take birth control?????"-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is completely beside the point. Do you know how many folks get murdered each year? That does not justify you to murder. If you can't see the logic in that, I can't help you.

And I for one don't want to convince you of anyting. But you should be honest and not a hipocrite. If you are ok with BCP's than you must be Ok with Abortion also. You are responsible for what you do with the info. Or what you encourage others to do with it.

Lastly, taking the BCP's for a true medical condition is beside the point. Some women will abort a baby while on cancer meds. That is not murder. Killing you baby on purpose is.

Also, your first statement would allow abortion also, unless you have some magical moment when you think a soul enters the body if not at conception. But it is funny we never questoned that until abortion came along.

 

Manage,

Losing a baby in the second trimester happens all the time too, are you saying that this makes abortion all right? You seem to be using contradictory logic here.

"I'm not God so I do not know when a soul enters the body.'---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If we don't know than why would we say there is no soul at conception. I mean to allow an abortion ASSUMING that the soul might not be there is arrogant.