Black Rock Address

Discussion in 'Baptist History' started by John Public, Oct 23, 2015.

  1. John Public

    John Public
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    Much of Old School Baptist history has been destroyed by the Catholic church. I suspect more is secreted away into the sundry places. However, here is one of the precious things we do know– the Black Rock Address.
    http://marchtozion.com/historic-documents/49-black-rock-address

    It is a fascinating study for interested souls.
     
  2. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Thanks.....I consider myself an Old School Baptist & so I agree with a great deal of the Black Rock Address.:)
     
  3. John Public

    John Public
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    Well, hello there! Grace to you from a Primitive Baptist in the name of Immanuel.
    The Black Rock Address is so beneficial to read as it exposes the beliefs of our forerunners. Many arminians would do well to note it; the Address is a fun study of itself, even for an arminian.
     
  4. Jordan Kurecki

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    Interesting, some of what is said is just plain unfounded. like the attacks on sunday school and tracts. though I did like what they said about Missions societies.
     
  5. Squire Robertsson

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    Have y'all read a contemporary work Notes on the Principles and Practices of Baptist Churches by Francis Wayland. Also, we would do well not to conflate Arminianism with Finneyism. Much of what is laid at the door of the first is really the fruits of the teaching of Charles Finney.
     
  6. John Public

    John Public
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    You do raise a good point, Squire. However, the two are very much intertwined. I have seen the above. Interesting document.

    In the new testament, the point revolves around the family.
    As an Old Schooler, one notes the words "Sunday" or "school" are absent in the Scriptures or not used as a command, neither are a tradition (but as a descriptor or part of a word), as is the concept of segregated education for adults from the niños. Instead, in Deuteronomy we see this, chapter six,
    1Now these are the commandments, the statutes, and the judgments, which the LORD your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:

    2That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments, which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.

    3Hear therefore, O Israel, and observe to doit; that it may be well with thee, and that ye may increase mightily, as the LORD God of thy fathers hath promised thee, in the land that floweth with milk and honey.

    4Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

    5And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

    6And these words, which I command thee this day, shall be in thine heart:

    7And thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children, and shalt talk of them when thou sittest in thine house, and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down, and when thou risest up.

    8And thou shalt bind them for a sign upon thine hand, and they shall be as frontlets between thine eyes.

    9And thou shalt write them upon the posts of thy house, and on thy gates.

    However, the assertion the Address is against tracts your own. I know not how that you garnered, brother or sister. One of the reasons to have tracts are the over 20 commands to publish in the Bible. John was told to write Apocalypse in a book for example. These things are the exact reasons there is a difference between missonary or New School, and primitive or Old School, or why there was a divide to begin with.
    Peace be upon you.
     
    #6 John Public, Oct 25, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2015
  7. Squire Robertsson

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    In part the section on Tract Socities reads
     
  8. Jerome

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    The 'Black Rock Address' of 1832 echoed sentiments expressed in the 'Declaration of the Reformed Baptist Churches in the State of North Carolina' (1826):

    "
    Article 1. Our body of churches shall be known by the name of the 'Reformed Baptist Association of Churches.'

    Article 2. ....Missionary Societies are only the inventions of men, and like all other such inventions will only prove a curse to the church of God....

    Article 3. ....no person who is a member of any such Tract Society, shall have membership with us except he first renounce his connexion with the society; and no minister or preacher in membership with these societies, shall be invited into our pulpits if it be known to us that he is a member of such societies.

    Article 4. Convinced that Theological Seminaries are the inventions of men, and have no warrant or sanction from the New Testament,....We therefore fell constrained to declare a non-fellowship with all such human institutions and devices, and to discountenance all societies and travelling beggars for their support, believing them to be the emissaries and agents of Anti-Christ, and opposed to the true kingdom of Jesus Christ.

    Article 5. In regard to the spread of the Bible, and Bible Societies,....no person who is a member of any such Bible Society shall have membership with us except he first renounce this connexion therewith, for we are fully assured that if a worldly minded Judas betrayed Christ, so will these worldlings in Bible Societies betray the cause and church of God
    ...."
     
  9. Rippon

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    LOL! I couldn't stop laughing. The word publish in the KJV means to proclaim.

    Mk.1:45
    in the KJV publish it much
    NKJV : proclaim it freely

    Mk. 5:20 in the KJV : began to publish
    NKJV : began to proclaim

    Mk. 7:36 in the KJV : published it
    NKJV : proclaimed it

    Mk. 13:10 in the KJV : must first be published
    NKJV : preached

    Luke 8:39 in the KJV : published
    NKJV : proclaimed

    Acts 10:37 in the KJV : published
    NKJV : proclaimed

    Acts 13:49 in the KJV : And the word of the Lord was published
    NKJV : The word of the Lord was spread.

    Do you understand now?

    A scroll to be precise.
     
  10. rsr

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    Just a reminder that food fights are not tolerated in this forum. Be civil; this is a discussion forum.
     
  11. rsr

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    As to tracts:

    Certainly, the main criticism in the address is against the tract societies.

    So, yes, the address leaves open a door for tracts ... but the entire tone of its treatment of tracts is dismissive.

    So, I think an accurate representation would be that the address condemns tracts in general, while not entirely prohibiting them, and tract societies in all their particulars.

    This is in line with the condemnation of seminaries, which they considered attempts to usurp the primacy of the local church and its ministry, as well as the role of the Holy Spirit in preparing ministers.
     
  12. Squire Robertsson

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    My question is looking at the Address' section on Bible Societies, where did they expect ot procure their Bibles? Only secular for profit publishers?
     
  13. rsr

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    Yes.

    Now, I think this is partly a consequence of naivete on the part of the elders. There was only one version of the English Bible, after all, and any American printer could surely reproduce it, and the lowest bid wins.

    I am sure they had no idea what an undertaking it was to produce a translation into a non-European language. The first Baptist missionaries -- like Carey and Judson -- considered it part of their mission to translate the Bible into those languages, and it was no easy task because they had to learn the local languages and then develop grammars and dictionaries.

    Not to mention that many of them considered that it was presumptuous to even consider such a thing through the means of a society. I would recommend reading Daniel Parker's Address to the Baptist Society (1820), which sets out many of the themes elucidated in the Black Rock Address.

    Now, to be sure, the elders who signed the address outline biblical principles, but it is clear that there is more to it than that. They hate the idea of concentration of power and of elites and an ecumenism that threatens the authority of the church.

    There is in this section a representative sample of the charges:

    Emphasis added.

    Now, exactly how one is to produce and distribute Bibles is really beside the point. The ecclesiological and sociological questions are really the ones addressed.

    On the ecclesiological side, it is simple. The local church alone has the authority to propagate the gospel.

    On the sociological side, the society's proponents were, to put it bluntly, well-off, formally educated Yankees (or at least the coastal elite). They would squeeze the poor, pious frontier folks in order to lay up their treasures on earth, in money as well as public approbation. (This is hard for us to understand today, but the civil religion of the time would lionize those who would seek to propagate the gospel and print the scriptures. And having seen the mess that many Christians have made of trying to marry politics and religion,or of using one to advance the other, the objectors' point should not be dismissed out of hand.)












     
  14. Squire Robertsson

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    Speaking of the Jefferson\Jackson distrust of centralization. The men lived through the Second Bank of the US controversy.
     
  15. tyndale1946

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    #15 tyndale1946, Oct 31, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2015
  16. rsr

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    Thanks, Brother Glen. The Black Rock Address should be considered as presenting a crystalization of the differences that had grown up between the Missionary Baptists and the Old School Baptists over the course of many years. As has been pointed out, the North Carolina Declaration (1826) and Parker's address (1820) predate Black Rock. The seeds of discord were planted with the establishment of the Triennial Convention in 1814.
     
  17. Squire Robertsson

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    I believe Andrew Fuller was the initial planter. His work laid the foundation for William Carey's missionary venture. Which encouraged Adoniram Judson and Luther Rice to launch off to Burma. Rice then boomeranged back to the States to raise support among Baptists for Judson with the Triennial Convention as an out growth.
     
  18. rsr

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    I wouldn't disagree with any of that. I also don't think it's only coincidental that the Black Rock Address followed within a few months the founding of the American Baptist Home Mission Society.
     
  19. tyndale1946

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    I agree with all that has been said on here in regards to the Black Rock Address and The Kehukee Declaration... Brethren of The Old School & The New School are each going to hold their ground and saying one is right and the other is in error... We each worship according to the dictates of our hearts and fellowship accordingly and each hold to what we feel is the foundation of our belief... Yet even though we don't fellowship together and do have our differences we are still followers of Jesus Christ and those who believe in Christ is my brother or sister... I have seen churches in my lifetime split over less trivial matters as am sure many on here have... We can agree to disagree and even though we my differ in doctrine and practice their is none on here is better than the other in Gods eyes... We all walk with feet of clay!... Brother Glen
     
  20. Squire Robertsson

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    From the name, I hazard the ABHMS was a Northern Baptist organization.
     

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