Can a person who denies the trinity still be saved?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by TaliOrlando, Jun 25, 2008.

  1. TaliOrlando

    TaliOrlando
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    Can a person who denies the trinity still be saved?

    This past Saturday I was invited to this Church anniversary and it was very good. They had a guest ministers who'd I have never heard of before, his name is Tommy Tenney and he preached his heart out that Saturday. It was a great message and it blessed me.

    I started to research more about him and found that he has some previous ties in his youth to the Oneness Pentecostals who deny the Trinity. I looked at his statement of faith and its similar to TD Jakes. Also compared them with what others state and John Haguee, Paul Washer and Jack Van Impe all speak about the trinity and stuff but theirs doesnt. Can a person who denies the trinity still be saved?

    Tommy Tenney

    God There is one God, Creator of all things, infinitely perfect, and eternally existing in three Manifestations: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

    Td Jakes

    God -There is one God, Creator of all things, infinitely perfect, and eternally existing in three manifestations: Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

    Jack Van Impe, John Haguee and Paul Washer have statements that actually speaks on the trinity of the God Head.

    Example: Our Statement of Faith
    JACK VAN IMPE MINISTRIES
    We believe in the verbal inspiration of the Bible, both the Old and New Testaments; the Trinity of the Godhead; the creation of man by the direct act of God; the fall of man and his need for redemption; the Deity, Incarnation and Virgin Birth of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ; His vicarious atonement for the sins of mankind by the shedding of His blood on the cross; the resurrection of His body from the tomb; His ascension into heaven; His personal, imminent return; the Deity of the Holy Spirit; justification of the believer by grace through faith; a literal devil who is our adversary; a literal heaven for the redeemed and a literal hell for the lost; the infallible rule of interpretation of Scripture to be Scripture itself; and the requirement of implicit obedience to the expressed commands of Christ as the standard by which He will judge our love to Him.

    or

    HEARTCRY MINISTRIES (PAUL WASHER)
    THE TRINITY. God is revealed to us as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, each with distinct personal attributes, but without division of nature, essence, or being.
     
  2. Thinkingstuff

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    I let God determine salvation. On the other hand if someone doesn't believe in the trinity they are not following sound christian doctrine and are in anathma sit.
     
  3. Tom Butler

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    I believe that God saves people who repent of their sins and trust Christ for salvation. I suspect that most children who are saved probably have little or no concept of Jesus as deity. The same is true for some adults. They are also untaught about some of the deeper theology. That's why they are called baby Christians, who must be taught.

    The Lord saved me more than 60 years ago. I still find the Trinity a difficult concept to understand, even though i believe it because the Scriptures clearly teach it.
     
  4. jdlongmire

    jdlongmire
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    Salvation belongs to the Lord. Independent of pristine doctrine. Praise God! :)

    Romans 10:8-10
     
  5. Shortandy

    Shortandy
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    a thought

    We are to repent of our sin and trust Christ alone for our salvation in order to be born again. But what if you are not trusting in the Jesus of the Bible but another Jesus; is that okay? If a person does not believe in the Trinity then they don't believe in the Jesus of the Bible but another Jesus. If you don't believe that Jesus is God then how can you be saved?
     
  6. donnA

    donnA
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    I agree.
    A person indwelt by the Holy Spirit (every true christian) will not deny the Trinity or the deity of Christ, it is the Holy Spirit that witnesses these truths to them.
     
  7. trustitl

    trustitl
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    A person can be saved and think all kinds of crazy ideas. I am a living example of it.:wavey: However, the OP seems to be dealing with teachers and their doctrine. Look in scripture and see how Paul spoke about those who believed false teachings and those that taught them.
     
  8. donnA

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    Paul wasn't the least bit tolerant of false teachings and teachers, makes me wonder why we think we need to be.
     
  9. Darron Steele

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    Yes -- IF s/he does not deny the Deity of Jesus Christ simultaneously.

    Many people mistakenly believe that denying the Trinity means denying the Deity of Jesus Christ. This is not so. One can believe the Deity of Jesus Christ while doubting or denying the precept of the Trinity.

    The Bible does not explicitly teach the Trinity -- the religious precept of the Trinity is based upon inference of Scripture. That said, at present, I think it is the best system of inference humans have come up with regarding what the precept of the Trinity tries to answer.

    If believing in the existence of a Trinity was really as important as many Christians think, I do not believe the Lord would have been so non-explicit about it. The Lord was explicit about the Deity of Jesus Christ and how accepting that is vital to salvation. If a person denies the Trinity but believes in the Deity of Jesus Christ, s/he can be saved.
     
    #9 Darron Steele, Jun 25, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 25, 2008
  10. annsni

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    That's what I'm thinking. I've spoken to a JW online and she has all the right keywords about believing on Jesus Christ as her Savior - that He died for her sins and everything - however it's a different Jesus. Hers is not God.
     
  11. dcorbett

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    No, no, no.

    You must believe that Jesus is a diety, or you are not saved. You might get saved and not understand it as of that time, but if you are taught the correct doctrine, you will understand because the Holy Spirit will guide you.

    Jehovah Witnesses and Mormons don't believe in the deity of Christ. They are lost and on their way to an eternity seperated from God.

    Debbie Mc
     
  12. TaliOrlando

    TaliOrlando
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    The reason I asked is because the Oneness Pentecostals simply believe that:

    Jesus is God, Holy Spirit is God and Jehova is God..... he is all of them in different manifestations. They simply do not think its different persons, but they do not deny that God paid the price for our sins.
     
  13. DHK

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    Such a person would not be saved. They have a knowledge of the trinity and reject it. They have accepted false doctrne in the place of truth.

    When one has knowledge of the truth of God and rejects it he is a false teacher, and cannot possibly be saved. If he understands the trinity and rejects it (just like every J.W. does) then how can that person be saved. This same doctrine leads to a denial of the diety of Christ.

    Can a person be saved by simply believing that Christ is just a good person and that is all.
    The Bible says: "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."
    It does not say: "Believe on that good man Jesus Christ and you shall be saved!"
     
  14. MNJacob

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    I have a minor quibble here. Mormons and JWs do believe that Jesus is a god, but not the God. Maybe that is deity with a small "d".

    :)
     
  15. Amy.G

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    A person who is ignorant of the Trinity can be saved, but a person who denies the Trinity, need to "examine himself". (2Cr 13:5)
     
  16. Alcott

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    There is no scripture which says one must believe in the trinity to be saved. That was not Paul's answer to the Philippian jailer, for example-- "Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved." It can be argued that the trinity should follow from further study of sound doctrine-- the 'meat' rather than the 'milk,' as NT writers put it-- but if you are going to argue that from such further consideration a person continues to deny the trinity that means he is not saved-- or was never saved, if you shove OSAS into it-- you are saying it is impossible for that Philippian jailer to have a part in the kingdom if he had been executed right there on site (as he feared) for letting his prisoners escape. And, of course, we don't know if he wasn't put to death in a short time, which could easily have been longer than to 'get the right idea' about the trinity.

    But if you think all this doesn't lead to any conclusion(s), then consider the real possibility of a "death-bed confession." If you were to witness an accident and a victim was fatallly injured, would you ask him if he believes in Jesus Christ? [I would, for the record.] But if he said he does not, would you try to convince him of the gospel? [Again, I would; but if summoning emergency help were possible, I would take care of that first-- like Paul told the jailer to not harm himself first, before telling him how to be saved).] Then if he said he does believe in Jesus, and he was choking and his eyes were getting glossed (some others have seen that, I'm sure), would you be shouting at him that he must believe in the trinity also?..."Wait a minute!-- you gotta believe in the TRINITY, too! Don't breathe your last breath til you do that!!!" I'm not sure what would come next-- perhaps you would say, "As little as it matters, you must believe in once-saved/always saved".......

    For me, if he said he believes in Jesus, that's it. Then I would turn all my attention (not having neglected it) to the present emergency.
     
  17. DHK

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    Then when Paul said to the Romans:
    Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

    Which Lord did he mean? Allah, Buddha, one of the many Hindu gods?
    There are many "lords," or gods.
    But if that "Lord" is not defined as Jesus Christ, deity, the second person of the triune Godhead, then who is He? Just another heathen God.

    Paul also said:
    Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead;[/b[ so that they are without excuse:

    The "Godhead" is a trinity. God says he can be known through nature and all mankind is without excuse for not knowing this.
    The J.W.' realize what the trinity is and reject it. The same is true of the Muslims. They don't want to believe. They reject the doctrine. When truth is rejected, objected to, refused, then the person is not saved. The refusal to believe the trinity is the same as a refusal to believe the deity of Christ. If one does not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, then what Jesus Christ does he believe. The Jesus Christ of Islam is only a prophet, a good man at best. That is not the Christ that I believe in, and not the Christ that can save.

    When Paul said: Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, he meant much more than just a good man. He meant God, the second person of the triune Godhead. Knowledge of who you are believing in for salvation is essential for salvation.
     
  18. donnA

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    If a 'christian' does not believe in the Trinity and the deity of Jesus, then they only believe in the same fraudulent Jesus of the muslims, not the biblical, real Jesus, but a fake one. No salvation in a fake Jesus.
     
  19. Alcott

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    Show me where Paul explained it exactly as you do.


    Show me where Paul explained it exactly as you do.

    Now-- if the Philippian jailer were executed shortly after believing and being baptized-- or if he just croaked shortly thereafter; either way we don't know-- and he had not developed a trinitarian thelogy, was he saved? Yes or No.
     
  20. donnA

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    According to the op, he is not asking about what a person knows and understands at the moment of salvation,. But an established christian, one whose claim of christianity is not a new event.
    Can a long time christian be a christian if they do not believe in the Trinity and deity of Christ, seems to be the question.
    The answer would be no, they believe in a false made up Jesus, not the biblical Jesus.
     

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