Can incurables be saved?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by agedman, Jun 8, 2013.

?

Your thoughts on incurables

  1. Psychopathy is incurable:

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Psychopathy is curable:

    1 vote(s)
    16.7%
  3. Psychopaths can be saved:

    4 vote(s)
    66.7%
  4. I don't have an opinion or knowledge:

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Narcissistism is incurable:

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  6. Narcissistism is curable:

    1 vote(s)
    16.7%
  7. Narcissistics can be saved:

    4 vote(s)
    66.7%
  8. I don't have an opinion or knowledge:

    2 vote(s)
    33.3%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. agedman

    agedman
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    I have never done a post with a poll so I hope I have done this one correctly. You do have the option of more than one choice.

    With the death of a serial murderer/rapist, and the very good thread on diabetes, my thoughts turned to incurables.

    In this thread, I would like for folks to give their opinion primarily on these two conditions that are held by the medical/psychological community as incurable.

    Narcissism
    Psychopathy

    I know there are others that can be added to the list (OCD, Autism, Tourette Syndrome, ADHD, Schizophrenia, Paranoia, ...)

    However, in each of the above, there is medical attention that can be used to lessen the impact or even somewhat control the manifestations.

    What this thread desires to answer is: Can one who is a Psychopath or Narcissistic actually be saved/cured?

    NOTE 1: No child (to my understanding) is born with these (Psychopathy, Narcissism) but I have witnessed the beginning manifestations in children as young as four.

    NOTE 2: This thread is not to discuss YOUR problems or to demean anyone who has a problem.

    NOTE 3: Please feel free to use your own anecdotes and any known experiential situations that might help clarify your view.

    NOTE 4: None of the above notes are meant to limit the discussion as long as it remains edifying.
     
    #1 agedman, Jun 8, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 8, 2013
  2. kyredneck

    kyredneck
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    Agedman, do you have some expertise in this field? (Sociopathy would be what I'd sum it up under.)
     
  3. agedman

    agedman
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    The term sociopath is often interchanged with psychopath under the broad tent in which antisocial and dissocial personality disorders are housed.


    I tend to differentiate them by stating that the sociopath may have a bit of feelings for a small nucleus (what that person might consider their immediate or near family members), where the psychopath has no feelings for anyone at all, and in some cases not even for them self.

    For instance: The psychopath will kill the neighbor's pet for the mere desire to inflict emotional hurt on the neighbor. They can just as easily cut off their own finger if it distresses someone else. The sociopath will kill the pet because it distresses the neighbor but wouldn't hurt their own child.

    However, there really is no significant distinction at this time, and it is fruitless to draw swords over the folks who interchange the terms, because such distinctions it really important nor is there significant empirical studies to rest the subject.

    However, all that really isn't the discussion of the thread.

    Do you consider that person capable of being cured/saved?
     
    #3 agedman, Jun 8, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 8, 2013
  4. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell
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    Years back I directed the nursing home ministry in my home church for more than 4 years. In one of the homes there was this particular woman who was always traveling around the hallways in her chair made of pvc which had a bar across the front of the seat so she would not fall out. She was constantly on the move scooting herself down the hallways with her feet.

    But when you tried to talk with her she was otherwise unresponsive. In fact when you could even get a look at her eyes it was like the light is on but no one is home.

    Every week I would gather folks up for service in the day room and then afterward I would wheel them all down to the dining hall for lunch. But before doing that and before ending the service I always gave a clear presentation of the gospel and then invited anyone there that wanted to to pray along with me if they wanted to confess that Jesus was their Lord and Savior.

    I had never heard anyone pray along with me out loud but most folks here were unresponsive to most things. So I asked if anyone confessed Jesus today, after I finished. That same lady I spoke of a minute ago just barely raised her hand. Out of all the services and invitations I had given in about three years, this was the first I had ever seen her respond to anything.

    I waited till last to wheel her to the dining hall. Just before I did I asked her if she confessed Jesus today and did she believe that He was her Lord and Savior. At that moment she slowly looked up and it was as if it took every last ounce of strength she had, she said Yes! At that moment she seemed to have life in her eyes. When she was done she went back to her normal facial affect and I never again saw a response from her about anything.

    God can and does reached is the the mind and heart of anyone no matter their mental condition and opens their heart to receive the gospel. God is not inhibited by their mental condition.
     
  5. agedman

    agedman
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    Thank you for that post!

    What a blessing was brought to you that day!
     
  6. Robert Snow

    Robert Snow
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    God doesn't know the word, Incurable.

    Great testimony, thank you Rev.
     
  7. kyredneck

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    Gotta agree with Snow:

    But they're cons; they'll con you to think they're 'saved.' And do a magnificent job of it too. I'd have to see a loooong probation period of good behavior before I'd trust them.
     
  8. righteousdude2

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    Me too....

    ....years back, like you, I was holding an alter call, and out of the congregation came a man who smelled like a brewery, and he projected a real anger towards me. Even the group that gathered with me to pray for the others who had come forward, took a step back when they sensed the anger.

    I thought for sure I was going to be slugged, and much worse. All I could do was pray and rebuke the spirit of anger, hate and addiction that possessed this man.

    As I prayed, the group [including the church pastor, his associate and several prayer warriors who followed me to ministries like this, moved back toward the guy, and laid hands on him like I had done.

    I rebuked the oppression I sensed coming from him, including any influence the devil may have held over him, and before I knew it, thirty minutes had passed us by, but, at the end of the prayer; he was totally calm, and miraculously; the heavy odor of alcohol had all but disappeared.

    We finished praying with all the others that came forward and left the church after midnight. As we left the church, the pastor told me that this man had never come to the church, but he'd always hang around outside, trying to insight and pick a fight. He was one bad owl hoot. He had been arrested for fighting, attempted murder, drugs and a list of other scary things, that had I known before I laid hands on him, I'd never have even tendered the prayer.

    However, once I started praying for him; I knew within me that there was no going back, and I just had to pray through in order to break through. The pastor told me that he was terrified, as was his associate, and they were ready for anything, including the fact that he singled an usher to call 911, as the pastor observed a switchblade in the mans back pocket.

    Well, to make things short. This man returned to the Wednesday evening service, clean, sober, and he went on to become an associate pastor that worked with the addiction program. Years later, I ran into him myself at a local Christian bookstore, and to be honest; I didn't recognize him, but he recognized me and thanked and hugged me.

    I don't know if this guy was afflicted by any of those diseases mentioned in the poll, but I know God delivered that man that night, and it was nothing short of a miracle.

    Can God heal the incurable mentally afflicted person? I would like to think He can do anything, after all He made us, and He didn't make "junk!" Not every story turns out like Revs and mine, but for every few hundred stories of failure, there are those often forgotten glimmers of pure hope.

    I'm not kidding when I say I feared for my safety and life as well as the safety and welfare of those gathered around that man to pray that night. I can't explain what happened, but isn't that true whenever God performs a miracle? :applause:

    Thanks for the question, and an opportunity to share the pure saving power of God! :applause:
     
  9. Oldtimer

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    Yes, thank you Agedman for starting this thread.
    Thank you Revmitchell and Righteousdude2 for your testimony.

    Mankind may not have the "cure" or all the "answers". God does!

    Without going into detail as to why, these posts are a blessing this Sunday morning. Thank you. :applause:
     
  10. Arbo

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    Amen, and amen.
     
  11. saturneptune

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    That testimony really touched me. I work in an adult day care, and completely agree. In fact, these folks have some of the characteristics of the fruit of the Spirit I do not see in some on this board. They trust as little children. They would give all they have to be able to help their neighbor. They are kind, patient, loving, and are bursting with hope. These are God's creation, and our God can do anything He wills.
     
  12. Judith

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    If one beleives that salvation is bound up in man then no one can be saved. If one holds that salvation is bound up in God then anyone can be saved.
     

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