Cheating Teachers

Discussion in 'News / Current Events' started by carpro, Feb 2, 2014.

  1. carpro

    carpro
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    Looks like it's becoming an epidemic...


    http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Govern...ed-In-Philly-School-District-Cheating-Scandal

    Nearly 140 Teachers, Administrators Involved in Philly School Cheating Scandal

    Nearly 140 teachers and administrators of the Philadelphia school district have been implicated in one of the largest cheating scandals in the United States. District officials say they expect to discipline or terminate several district employees in connection with the allegations.
     
  2. Jkdbuck76

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    Let me guess: they get funding bases upon test scores?

    This is what I love about the gubment...they are not allowed to control curriculum, but they control the money....which allows them to control EVERYTHING.
     
  3. carpro

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    Similar cheating and student test-score manipulation have been reported in public school districts in Baltimore, Washington, D.C., and El Paso, with the largest cheating scandal in the country taking place in Atlanta.
     
  4. InTheLight

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    Let's not forget Chicago.
     
  5. agedman

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    Teachers are the ONLY industry that is expected to produce an acceptable product from inferior raw materials. There is not one industry that has such expectations.

    There is not one person who would righteously expect some acceptable standard of product performance, when the basic raw materials delivered to the manufacturer of the product are not up to a certain recognized standard.

    Frankly, a doctor or dentist would not perform successfully with an inferior product or less than sterile tools.

    Yet, teachers are held to very high standards and public accountability in which not even parents are held.

    In no way should there be a condoning the cheating; rather, acknowledging why some feel obliged by administrative and social pressures (and by administrative approval).

    When are those in charge of accountability going to make the failures of home, family, and the expectations of parents the cause for the academic, social, and behavioral aspects of the child and not the teachers?

    If the truth were fully known, teachers "cheat" all the time by adjusting a student's grades, compensating for environmental, behavioral, social and cultural aspects.

    That the "cheating" crosses over into a state mandated test, in which not only the assessment of student academic growth is measured, but the teacher is held accountable and can be punished in some manner when students do not perform "acceptably," is continuance of what has been and is going to happen. It is the results of misdirected accountability.

    Change the rules of what the assessments are used for, and the accountability for student failure, and most if not all the cheating will be eradicated.

    Teaching is not an acquired skill. It is just as any other gifted professional; that innate ability is enhanced by developing and practicing with the tools of the skill. These tools are called curriculum, study aids (books, paper pencil...) and other stuff that goes into the academic world.
     
  6. Jkdbuck76

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    My wife teaches special education/ math inclusion. Her two biggest gripes:
    1) kids respect NOTHING b/c parents don't demand it.
    2) the kids show up in hs math NOT KNOWING BASIC MATH FACTS...WITHOUT THESE, YOU CANNOT FACTOR EQUATIONS!!!!! These kids LITERALLY have to have a calculator to do "6 divided by 3 is 2". Note: she teaches in a general ed classroom.
    The subject of Science is no longer a full subject in Elementary schools in Indiana....science us a weekly "special" just like Art and Music.
     
  7. carpro

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    Never. They have no control over home environment.

    This all started years ago when schools began to promote students to the next grade because they didn't want to damage the self esteem.

    Largely because of irresponsible parents pressuring schools and teachers to do so.

    The day is coming when we will have the worst educated kids in the civilized world.

    Cheating teachers only exacerbate the problem. They should be the ones demanding the most from their students and taking nothing less. Instead, they hide the failings of the system.
     
  8. agedman

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    These are all good points.

    No doubt that cheating is part of the institution on a daily basis - it has to be. The typical scenario is vastly different in the classroom than that of what it was in the 60's and that was night and day different than that of the turn of the 1900's.

    The failing of the system is because parents cannot face the truth about their children. Society won't let them.

    Until the social structure and expectations change what is important and parents place education as a top priority in the home, not tolerating less than the best from the child, then the problems will continue. Manifestations of the problems (cheating for example) will just be an indicator of a far deeper cancer.
     
  9. Revmitchell

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    Parents do not get their paycheck from the tax payers. Teachers do.
     
  10. agedman

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    Doesn't matter.

    For instance, doctors get their pay from the patients.

    Do the patients expect the doctor to not only be knowledgeable about disease and treatment but be able to use tools to effect a proper cure?

    Of course.


    What if the doctors also had to make the medications?

    But would the same parent expect the doctor who could not acquire useful medications or the raw materials to make the medications then able to produce a cure - though they paid for a cure?

    Of course not.

    Yet those same parents will give the teachers inferior raw materials and expect them to make of that material something that meets a standard that is established using quality material.


    That is like the car manufacturer producing a car from steel that doesn't meet basic engineering specs for the parts necessary.
     
  11. Revmitchell

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    It does matter to a whole lot of people whether it matters to you or not. If you take public money then the public has some say in the standards.
     
  12. agedman

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    The public entrusts the money and policy making decisions to the boards and legislators. But, such "standards" do not negate the responsibility rests totally with the parent as to the actual "raw material" is brought to the educational system.

    What I am suggesting is that the parents expect from teachers what they them selves have not provided, nor in many cases desire to provide.

    Are not parents responsible to prepare the child for education?

    Are the parents not responsible for the child having learned self control, learned to be attentive, and learned to be respectful of others?

    Are the parents not responsible to make certain the expectations of academic excellence are met, that the home work is not just completed but done with the expectation of excellence?

    If the "raw material" is inferior, the end product will not meet the standards needed.

    If the parents do not deliver and acceptable "raw material" to the educational system, they will reap inferior and unacceptable education.

    It doesn't matter how many mandates authorities place upon the ground soldiers of the educational system. The more the mandates - the more the cheating is obliged in the present educational schemes across the nation.
     
  13. Revmitchell

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    Reducing standards is not the answer to that. The current pubic educations system has also reduced in school discipline to the point that teachers are not able to control the kids. The problem does not fall entirely on the parents. This is not as simple as a raw materials argument.
     
  14. carpro

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    A teacher's job is not easy.

    Cheating is not the answer and should never be excused.
     
  15. ktn4eg

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    agedman (and anyone else for that matter) --

    I agree with just about everything you wrote in your post of February 2.

    Having been involved in both elementary and high school level education for over sixteen years, I know that teachers (whether they may be "first-year" teachers or ones with many years of teaching experience) face almost impossible goals when it comes to actually trying to teach whatever subject matter that they may be assigned to teach.

    There are a few things that I would hope that all of us (whether or not you have children that are currently attending any kind of educational institution or not) would keep in mind before forming opinions on the quality (or lack of it) that our nation's young people receive today.

    Please do not get me wrong--I certainly believe that a young person's parents play a vitally important part in the education of their children. In fact, God's Word commands the parents (especially the father) to take the initiative in training his children!

    However, the average government-run school (I prefer to use that term rather than "public school.") teacher quite often is tasked with instructing his/her class(es) on subject matter he/she about which he or she may have very little (if any) real college-level training.

    Then these teachers also must comply with a plethora of other tasks that have very little (if anything at all) to do with any kind of real academic subject matter. What I am referring to here is the fact that the teacher must maintain accurate and very detailed records of each of his/her students attendance (or tardiness).

    One of the reasons for this is because most school systems depend on the number of students present on each school day in order to acquire funding for all sorts of things that don't really have very much to do with academic teaching. EXAMPLE: Recently a few county schools near where I live (middle Tennessee) were forced to close down for several days simply because the school buildings were too cold, or because many of the school buses would not start because the batteries in the buses failed to work.

    Then, teachers also face the problem that some of the children in their classes do not even know how to read or speak English. What is a classroom teacher to do in that case? Is the teacher also expected to learn some foreign language (such as Arabic or Nepali or some other language whose alphabet isn't even the same as the alphabet on which our English language is based)?

    Also, a teacher's work is not finished when the school day is over. In addition to teaching his/her classes, the teacher usually has to grade a pile of assignments (some of which he/she may not even be able to read!), make lesson plans, and participate in other after-school activities such as helping to coach in his/her school's sports teams.

    I could go on listing several other things that our school teachers are expected to do, but I think that you catch my drift.

    This is not to say that a lot of our government-run schools have incompetent teachers because I know for a fact that they do. But, since most government-run schools have their faculties filled with people who are also members of some kind of teachers' unions, it is almost next to impossible to get rid of a teacher who is incompetent to teach.

    Some teachers' unions have policies that do not allow a teacher to be fired outright. So what is a school system to do in such a case as that?

    OTOH, I am glad that the vast majority of teachers are very dedicated to their calling to teach the ones entrusted to them.

    I could cite many examples of teachers using their own money to not only pay for some of their students' school supplies such as pencils, paper, workbooks, etc., but even to pay for some of their students coats and shoes.

    I can not think of another occupation that expects so much of its members---most of whom are paid less than the average person in their neighborhood is paid--and yet have so many of its members more than willing to go far beyond "the second mile" than our nation's teachers!

    If you are a teacher, I praise God for you, and want to thank you for choosing to help educate our nation's most vital asset---our young people!! :thumbs::applause:
     
  16. carpro

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    Are you condoning teacher cheating?
     
  17. ktn4eg

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    No, I am definitely NOT condoning any teacher cheating on any test(s)!

    All that I was trying to point out was that today's teachers are forced to spend much of their time each school day being involved in tasks that actually have very little (if any) relevance to the academic subjects that they are required to teach to their students.

    If I gave you (or anyone else) the impression that I condone not only teachers, but also any person on the face of this planet, cheating on any kind of test, I humbly apologize for doing so.
     
  18. Gina B

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    agedman, while I understand what you're saying, I have to disagree.

    I most strenuously object with the strong implication that the children being worked with are "inferior materials."

    They are not.

    The majority of children are quite capable.

    The environment they are put in? That's another story.

    Like another poster said, many teachers are tasked with issues that have little to do with the matter at hand.

    So are the students.

    The learning environment is messed up. Teachers aren't able to teach as they should be, and students aren't free to question and learn to their full potential because of surrounding issues and interferences.

    I could go on about what those are, but I'm pretty sure most everyone with half a brain is well aware of the issues in our modern public school systems.

    My pet peeve? Not everyone belongs in public schools. I wish people could get that through their heads. Mandatory attendance policies play a significant role in problems with public school environment.
     
  19. agedman

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    Certainly, I would never excuse "cheating" nor would I condone all that the current educational systems put forth as acceptable.

    However, I am convinced that the problem is directly related to parenting.

    I no longer have the documentation; it was part of the doctoral course work I was doing on education decades ago.

    It presented these facts:

    1) ALL children will thrive with a strong educational system and teachers up to grade four.

    2) All children from strong homes with high expectations will thrive in a poor educational system up to and through college.

    3) Children with weak parenting and/or parenting with low to no participation and expectations for the child to be academically successful have virtually no success in either a strong or a weak educational system beyond grade 4. This was astounding to me, and it was shown valid in more than one study.

    4) The ONLY condition in which a child will thrive educationally in weak parenting is when the child becomes self aware enough to make personal decisions (often through outside the home mentoring and mentoring programs) as to their own personal responsibility for success or failure. When they (irregardless of home support) hold them self accountable - often with the help of a mentor and/or mentor programs. Even then, often by grade 9, the child has an extremely high probability of giving up.


    The point being, that success and failure of the education of children rests squarely upon ONE source - the parents (the exception noted).

    That society would abdicate, to some educational system, the parental responsibility, then hold unreasonable demands for academic achievement in that setting, is just unrealistic.

    I do not doubt the innate ability of the child.

    I do doubt that the typical parent actually demands academic excellence from their child - irregardless of the school system.
     
  20. carpro

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    Not really. I just wanted to be sure.

    Teachers labor under all kinds of handicaps. I think we all understand that.

    But I find it reprehensible that those that cheat , cheat not to help the kids, but to help themselves.

    To improve their evaluations.
     

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