Considering Hebrews 11:39,40

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by percho, Aug 15, 2016.

  1. percho

    percho
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    And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise: God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect. Hebrews 11:39,40

    Does the above perfection have anything to do with the redemption of the body, the adoption and is that the end result of our having been made righteous by the obedience of One?

    If yes; Does that make that, obedience of One, the obedience of faith, the faith by which they would receive a good report from the obedience to come and we will receive the same good report by the obedience that came.

    And I know most of you do not like the YLT but I will use it because of the definite articles which I deem important even though I know no Greek.

    Compare, based upon my thoughts above:
    Romans 3:30 yes, also of nations; since one is God who shall declare righteous the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through the faith. ----- with ----- Gal 3:23-25 And before the coming of the faith, under law we were being kept, shut up to the faith about to be revealed, so that the law became our child-conductor -- to Christ, that by faith we may be declared righteous, and the faith having come, no more under a child-conductor are we,

    The faith through which we and they at the same time will be perfected is directly proportional to the obedience of One and therefore has to be the faith of God which came at the moment of that obedience. see Mark 11:22

    Son through the things he suffered, learned the obedience and became obedient unto death even the death of the cross which was the belief (faith) of God the Father. Not my will but thine be done.
     
  2. percho

    percho
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    I'm going to bed, Good night!
     
  3. Van

    Van
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    The answer is NO! This view requires that no one has yet been made perfect. But flip the page to Hebrews 12:23 and note those who have entered heaven have been made perfect. This verb is in the Perfect tense, and thus indicates a completed action with continuing result.
     
  4. percho

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    Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness; In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began; Titus 1:1,2


    Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. Hebrews 11:1


    Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: 1 Cor 15:1-4


    And if Christ be not raised, your faithisvain; ye are yet in your sins. 1 Cor 15:17


    But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality (incorruptibility) to lightthrough the gospel: 2 Tim 1:10


    Who/what is the substance of things hoped for the evidence of things not seen? Is it not the resurrected Christ? This Christ? 1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:


    If Christ had not been resurrected from the dead, quickened by the Spirit; Would there have been any substance of things hoped for evidence of things not seen?


    Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with himthrough the faith of (the death of Christ, per above) the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead. (from above) Col 2:12

    For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likenessofhisresurrection: Rom 6:5


    Are the dead in faith of Hebrews 11 of the same status with God, as are the dead in Christ of 1 Thess 4:16, those asleep in Christ?
     
  5. percho

    percho
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    Relative to Icon;s post in the BIB's thread on same verses.

    Bear also in mind, Christ also died for our sins. Is a dead Christ perfected? Romans 6:9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.

    Hen 5:5,6 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee. As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
    7 & 8 the Christ born of woman, the very Son of God, through the things he suffered learned the obedience unto death. He died, was dead.

    VERSE'S 9,10 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him; Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec. ---- Being made perfect by the resurrection from the dead the same he of verse 5 therefore called him high priest after the order of. Romans 6:9 see also Heb 7:16
     

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