Contemporary Judaizers

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by NetChaplain, Jan 20, 2014.

  1. NetChaplain

    NetChaplain
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    Not that God would have it done any other way in which it has been done, but if all men in the OT were as Abraham and others who He used, there would have been no need of the Mosaic Law which came after them. When all of them were brought to, and convinced of their indwelling sin, they chose to remain in belief and in fellowship with God.
    -NC

    Contemporary Judaizers

    “The law is good, if a man use it lawfully”; and its lawful application is expressly not to form, guide and govern the righteous, but to deal with the lawless and disobedient, ungodly and sinful, unholy and profane, and, in short, with whatever is contrary to sound doctrine (1 Tim 8, 9). Sin, we are told in Romans 6, shall not have dominion over Christians, “for you are not under the law, but under grace”; and this is a chapter where the question is the righteousness walk of the saint, not his justification.

    Yet in the face of this clear and uniform teaching of the New Testament, the tendency of most Christians habitually is to go back to law, especially where there is feeble separation from the world. But it is easily understood, for the world does not receive or understand the grace of God, whereas it can appreciate in the letter, the righteous law of God. Hence, where the world and the Christians are mixed together, the will of man soon takes the upper hand. Then, as the Christian cannot elevate the world to his standing, he must inevitably sink to that which he holds in common with the world. Thus both meet once more on Jewish ground, as if the Cross of Christ had never been, and the Holy Spirit was not sent down from heaven to gather believers out of the mixed condition into the Body of Christ apart from the world.

    Even for the individual Christian, as well as for the Church and most of all for God’s truth, grace and glory, the loss has been incalculable. For the ordinary walk has been reduced to a string of negatives, save in public acts of philanthropy, religious activity, or ritual observances, which the Christian shares with any and everybody that will join him—plain ecumenism. It is not occupation with good according to God’s will, still less is it suffering for the sake of the Lord Jesus and of righteousness from a world which knows them not. This is not Christianity, though it is the state and the system of most Christians.

    Did the Lord Jesus ever obey from the fear of judgment (which the Law threatened due to inability to keep perfectly—NC)? Was not His life a surrender of Himself to the holy will and pleasure of His Father? So our souls are to be occupied with the Father’s grace in His Son, if we are to find strength in pleasing Him. The mere avoidance of evil, the not doing this or that, is below our calling. Do we indeed desire to know and to do the Father’s will as His children? Are we zealous in learning to do well, no less than careful to cease from each evil? If not, the day will come when we may begin to do evil again, and with a conscience the less sensitive, because we have learned truth which we do not carry out.

    To talk about the Ten Commandments as the rule for the Christian’s walk now, is to go back from the sun which rules the day to the moon which rules the night; it is to eclipse the Lord Jesus by Moses, under the delusive profession of doing God service. In general, what the law exacted from those under the principle of right, the Christian is responsible on the principle of grace to exceed in every possible way (Mat 5:20—NC). The scope of obedience is immensely increased; the inward motives are searched out and laid bare. The tendency to violence, corruption and falsehood is judged in its roots (old man—NC), and suffering wrongfully and withal in love takes the place of earthly righteousness for the disciples. Such is the unquestionable teaching of our Lord and of His disciples; it is darkened, undermined and denied by those who insist on Judaizing the Church by putting the Christian under the law as his rule of life (which, due to misunderstanding is a recurrence of the past unlearned Jews practice—NC). Truly they “understand neither what they say nor whereof they affirm” (1 Tim 1:7—NC).

    Wm Kelly

    http://www.abideabove.com/hungry-heart/
     
  2. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    NetChaplain;

    .

    This is a grave mistake.



    [/QUOTE]

    This man was antinomian as is any who claim the law is no more...

    31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
     
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan
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    I believe the Baptist Confession of Faith gets this part right - though they are not perfect in every doctrinal statement they make.

    ============================================

    [FONT=&quot]CH Spurgeon[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    “The Perpetuity of the Law of God”
    [/FONT][FONT=&quot]
    Very great mistakes have been made about the law. Not long ago there were those about us who affirmed that the law is utterly abrogated and abolished, and they openly taught that believers were not bound to make the moral law the rule of their lives. What would have been sin in other men they counted to be no sin in themselves. From such Antinomianism as that may God deliver us. We are not under the law as the method of salvation, but we delight to see the law in the hand of Christ, and desire to obey the Lord in all things. Others have been met with who have taught that Jesus mitigated and softened down the law, and they have in effect said that the perfect law of God was too hard for imperfect beings, and therefore God has given us a milder and easier rule. These tread dangerously upon the verge of terrible error, although we believe that they are little aware of it.

    Section 19 of the Baptist Confession of Faith .

    Section 19
    . The Law of God [/FONT]

    • [FONT=&quot]God gave to Adam a law[/FONT][FONT=&quot] of universal obedience which was written in his heart[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and He gave him very specific instruction about not eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. By this Adam and all his descendants were bound to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience, being promised life upon the fulfilling of the law, and threatened with death upon the breach of it. At the same time Adam was endued with power and ability to keep it. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN COMMANDMENTS, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]Besides this law, commonly called the moral law, God was pleased do give the people of Israel ceremonial laws containing several typical ordinances. These ordinances were partly about their worship, and in them Christ was prefigured along with His attributes and qualities, His actions, His sufferings and His benefits. These ordinances also gave instructions about different moral duties. All of these ceremonial laws were appointed only until the time of reformation, when Jesus Christ the true Messiah and the only lawgiver, Who was furnished with power from the Father for this end, cancelled them and took them away. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]To the people of Israel He also gave sundry judicial laws which expired when they ceased to be a nation. These are not binding on anyone now by virtue of their being part of the laws of that nation, but their general equity continue to be applicable in modern times. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]The moral law ever binds [/FONT][FONT=&quot]to obedience everyone, justified people as well as others, and not only out of regard for the matter contained in it, but also out of respect for the authority of God the Creator, Who gave the law. Nor does Christ in the Gospel dissolve this law in any way, but He considerably strengthens our obligation to obey it. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]Although true believers are not under the law as a covenant of works, to be justified or condemned by it, yet it is of great use to them as well as to others, because as a rule of life it informs them of the will of God and their duty and directs and binds them to walk accordingly. It also reveals and exposes the sinful pollutions of their natures, hearts and lives, and using it for self-examination they may come to greater conviction of sin, greater humility and greater hatred of their sin. They will also gain a clearer sight of their need of Christ and the perfection of His own obedience. It is of further use to regenerate people to restrain their corruptions, because of the way in which it forbids sin. The threatenings of the law serve to show what their sins actually deserve, and what troubles may be expected in this life because of these sins even by regenerate people who are freed from the curse and undiminished rigours of the law. The promises connected with the law also show believers God's approval of obedience, and what blessings they may expect when the law is kept and obeyed, though blessing will not come to them because they have satisfied the law as a covenant of works. If a man does good and refrains from evil simply because the law encourages to the good and deters him from the evil, that is no evidence that he is under the law rather than under grace. [/FONT]
    • [FONT=&quot]The aforementioned uses of the law are not contrary to the grace of the Gospel, but they sweetly comply with it, as the Spirit of Christ subdues and enables the will of man to do freely and cheerfully those things which the will of God, which is revealed in the law, requires to be done. [/FONT]
     
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan
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    Bible texts both NT and OT about God's Commandments - Showing that the TEN Commandments in assigned that title "in scripture"

    [FONT=&quot]10 Commandments are[/FONT][FONT=&quot] –[/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]Commandments of God” Neh 10:29[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]“Law of God” Neh 10:29[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]“Word of GodMark 7:13[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]“Commandment of GodMark 7:6-13[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]NT “Scripture” James 2:8[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]NT “Law” – James 2:9-11[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]NT Commandments[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Eph 6:2, Rom 13:9, Romans 7:7-10

    [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]Mark 7[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

    7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
    8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
    9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
    10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
    11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
    12 And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
    13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

    John contrasts "LOVE" to the Commandments of God. He does not say "By this we know that we Love God -- if we Love God". Rather John points to obedience to the WORD of God "the Commandments of God" as the sign that we truly to LOVE God. Being at war against his Word is not such a great sign of "loving God" as some had perhaps imagined.

    [/FONT] 1 John 5
    "Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and whoever loves the Father loves the child born of Him.
    2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments.
    3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome.
    1 John 5:1-3


    ===========================
    What IS sin according to the NT Word of God?

    1John 3:4
    4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

    How does the saint view that Law according to Paul?

    "what matters is KEEPING the commandments of God" 1Cor 7:19
    "do we then make void the Law of God? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God" Rom 3:31

    "
    8 For finding fault with them, He says,“Behold, days are coming, says the Lord,
    When I will effect a new covenant
    With the house of Israel and with the house of Judah;
    ...
    10 “For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel
    After those days, says the Lord:
    I will put My laws into their minds,
    And I will write them on their hearts.
    And I will be their God,
    And they shall be My people.

    How does this Law of God relate to Love for God and Love for one another?

    1 John 5:1-4

    Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and whoever loves the Father loves the child born of Him.
    2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and observe His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments; and His commandments are not burdensome. 4 For whatever is born of God overcomes the world; and this is the victory that has overcome the world—our faith.

    Does not Grace - free us from the issue of sin and rebellion against God's law so that we need not worry about it ? Can we marry rebellion and Grace together?

    Romans 6
    7 for he who has died is freed from sin. 8 Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him, 9 knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, is never to die again; death no longer is master over Him. 10 For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God. 11Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.
    12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, 13 and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God. 14 For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
    15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be! 16 Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?

    John 14:15 "IF you Love Me KEEP My Commandments"
    Ex 20:7 "Love Me and KEEP My Commandments"

    Rev 14:12 the 'Saints KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus"

    Rom 2:13-16 "It is NOT the hearers of the law that are just before God - but the DOERS of the Law WILL BE justiFIED ... on the day when according to my Gospel God will Judge"

    Matt 7 "Not everyone who SAYS Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven but he who DOES the will of My Father"

    What about the one who "says" that the Commandments of God are impossible to keep -- who are they?

    Romans 8
    the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
     
  5. BobRyan

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    The point is that Romans 3 and Galatians 3 tell us clearly that the Law defines sin and places all mankind under condemnation - so all need a Savior.

    Without that "detail" there is no need of the gospel.

    Then Heb 8 (and Jer 31:31-33) tell us that the Law is at the heart of the NEW Covenant - written on the heart and mind. Not a detail that New Covenant saints are likely to trivialize.

    Then John reminds us in Rev 14:12 and in 1John 5:1-4 that the difference between the saints and the wicked is that one group is keeping the Commandments of God - and the other is not. (John hammers this point pretty hard in 1John 3).

    So while the saints do not get saved by obeying the Commandments - they are clearly known for doing it according to the post-pentecost apostolic teaching of the Apostle John and Paul and ...

    And of course - the NT saints use the OT as their "text" of scripture for all sola-scriptura testing of doctrine.
     
  6. NetChaplain

    NetChaplain
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    This man was antinomian as is any who claim the law is no more...

    31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.[/QUOTE]

    Hi I - I appreciate your reply, but I believe antinomianism is a misunderstood term, in that a differentiation must be maintained between old and new dispensations, otherwise there is a detraction from both in attempting the admixture, which is unknowingly misunderstood in the phrase Judao-Christian.

    This is attempting to follow two separate systems simultaneously--an impossibility.
     
  7. BobRyan

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    Paul is opposing Judaizers who are defined well in Acts 15:1-2 no doubt about it.

    But if one is not careful - one can get caught claiming that Paul was opposing Paul. That is why I keep bringing up these NT texts that show that the OT was the scriptures of the NT saints and more - that the Law of God - the Ten Commandments were the Law of the NT saints as even Paul quoted directly from the OT - TEN Commandments.

    More than this - Paul goes to the extreme in Acts 21 of engaging in the ceremonial law AND of paying others to join him in doing so.

    This is the "ultimate mix" of OT ceremonial law - with the OT texts dealing with the Moral law of God - that "does not change" because "God does not change".

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  8. BobRyan

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    In addition to Acts 21 - there are many examples in the NT -- of the OT text upheld in the NT - as "scripture" -- "The Word of God" that is binding on the NT saints.

    ========================

    [FONT=&quot]the accusations of the non-Christian Jews against Paul were not true.

    BTW - Acts 25
    [/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot] 7 When he had come, the Jews who had come down from Jerusalem stood about and laid many serious complaints against Paul, which they could not prove, 8 while he answered for himself, “Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Caesar have I offended in anything at all.


    Acts 26
    [/FONT]

    19 “Therefore, King Agrippa, I was not disobedient to the heavenly vision, 20 but declared first to those in Damascus and in Jerusalem, and throughout all the region of Judea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent, turn to God, and do works befitting repentance. 21 For these reasons the Jews seized me in the temple and tried to kill me. 22 Therefore, having obtained help from God, to this day I stand, witnessing both to small and great, saying no other things than those which the prophets and Moses said would come— 23 that the Christ would suffer, that He would be the first to rise from the dead, and would proclaim light to the Jewish people and to the Gentiles.”
    [FONT=&quot]

    Acts 28[/FONT]

    17 And it came to pass after three days that Paul called the leaders of the Jews together. So when they had come together, he said to them: “Men and brethren, though I have done nothing against our people or the customs of our fathers, yet I was delivered as a prisoner from Jerusalem into the hands of the Romans, 18 who, when they had examined me, wanted to let me go, because there was no cause for putting me to death. 19 But when the Jews spoke against it, I was compelled to appeal to Caesar, not that I had anything of which to accuse my nation. 20 For this reason therefore I have called for you, to see you and speak with you, because for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.”
    [FONT=&quot]
    [/FONT]

    [FONT=&quot]23 So when they had appointed him a day, many came to him at his lodging, to whom he explained and solemnly testified of the kingdom of God, persuading them concerning Jesus from both the Law of Moses and the Prophets, from morning till evening.

    Luke 16 Christ said "If they do not hear Moses - neither will they listen though one rises from the dead"

    [/FONT]
    Notice how the NT church appeals to the OT text as if the OT text is valid for doctrine and practice.

    13 After they had stopped speaking, James answered, saying, “Brethren, listen to me. 14 Simeon has related how God first concerned Himself about taking from among the Gentiles a people for His name. 15 With this the words of the Prophets agree, just as it is written,
    16 ‘After these things I will return,
    And I will rebuild the tabernacle of David which has fallen,
    And I will rebuild its ruins,
    And I will restore it,
    17 So that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
    And all the Gentiles who are called by My name,’
    18 Says the Lord, who makes these things known from long ago.
    19 Therefore it is my judgment that we do not trouble those who are turning to God from among the Gentiles,


    Acts 23:5
    And Paul said, "I was not aware, brethren, that he was high priest;
    for it is written
    [FONT=&quot], ' YOU SHALL NOT SPEAK EVIL OF A RULER OF YOUR PEOPLE.'"[/FONT]
     

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