Defining "worship"?

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by MikeS, Nov 24, 2003.

  1. MikeS

    MikeS
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    This is not a trick question. [​IMG] I'm curious how non-Catholics, especially but not exclusively, define the worship due to God alone. What are the key components that distinguish it from any other feeling/behavior?
     
  2. Abiyah

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    Hi! I am not Catholic.

    While feeling certainly often occurs when in
    worship, I don't believe that worship should ever
    depend upon feeling or that one should expect
    feelings when in worship. I believe that worship,
    homage, obeisance are due my God and that I
    must recognize my need to worship Him, no
    matter how I feel.

    I believe that worship is mainly how I live my life.
    Do I live in a way that pleases Him, or am I giving
    in to blatant sin. Do I witness of Him in my life,
    or are people unaware that He is in my life. Do
    my actions, attitudes, interests, words, clothing,
    marriage, etc., indicate that I live a godly or an
    ungodly life.

    Next, I believe that worship is what I do when
    witnessing of Him specifically to others. Am I
    ashamed of Him. Am I intimidated by what I
    claim that I believe. Do I embarrass Him by my
    action/inaction.

    Third, I believe that worship is what I do in the
    congregation. Do I act the same there as I do
    when away from the congregation. Am I a seven-
    days-a-week believer or a weekend warrior for
    my God.

    And fourth, I believe that worship is specific
    praise and honor of my God in the congregation,
    whether in song, in prayer, in attitude, and/or even
    in bodily position.
     
  3. DHK

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    Henry Morris
     
  4. SpiritualMadMan

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    I have heard Worship defined as worth-ship. That is anything we do religiously or secularly that ascribes worth to God is Worship in it's simplest forms.

    Hmm. That means that doing a good job because you are a Christian can be a form of worship...

    As a Charismatic Praise and Worship Leader I would tend to think of worship in different terms than many. [​IMG]

    And, I wouldn't too quickly discount 'emotion' in Worship. After all Joy is an emotion and in His presence is fullness of Joy.

    And, the Lord inhabits the praises of His People. (from: 'The Lord inhabits the Praise of Israel' and 'We are the Israel of God'.)

    {Obviously, *if* God *really* comes on the scene you won't need a Jonathon Edwards to straighten out the deacons! [​IMG] )

    I firmly believe we were created to worship God. Therefore when we do actually worship it provides an emotional release. (For, having done something our innate being is created to do.)

    But, this also has the down-side that a person can enter into an attitude of worship and get that emotional release, walk out of church not having been changed one iota.

    For this reason I consider the normal Charismatic form of 'Worship' dangerous if it is not accompanied by the preaching of the cross and a call to Holy Living.

    My Two Cents.
     
  5. trying2understand

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    Where does this understanding come from?

    What is the root word and from what language is "worship" derived to mean "bow down"?

    Ron [​IMG]
     
  6. SpiritualMadMan

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    OT Search 64 hits
    From

    Genesis 22:5
    Exodus 24:1
    Exodus 34:14
    Total of 52 hits

    Other Hits for Worship:
    From: 1 Kings 12:30 'to Worship before'

    1 hit
    from: Jeremiah 44:19 'to worship' her

    8 hits in Daniel for{quote]H5457 סגד segid seg-eed'(Chaldee); corresponding to H5456: - worship.

    H5456 סגד sâgad saw-gad' A primitive root; to prostrate oneself (in homage): - fall down.[/quote]


    NT: 43 hits Total

    34 hits
    3 hits
    1 hit
    3 hits
    1 hit
    1 hit
    So, the overwhelming evidence is that Worship entails humbling oneself before a more worthy by lowering oneself to the ground. ie., bowing down.

    Seems the thought is carried through in both Hebrew and Greek according to Strong's

    Courtesy of e-Sword
     
  7. Johnv

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    While the use of the word "worship" in the OT refers mostly to bwoing down, or prostrating, before God, we need to bear in mind that the OT view of God was different than the NT view of God. The OT view was that of a sovereign ruler on a throne, who has dictatorial authority over all his subjects. Jesus, however, referrs to God as Father. Hence, worshipping is no longer just a physical act, but a spiritual act. I think we protestants and evangelicals do, unfortunately, downplay the physical aspects of worship, such as kneeling, bowing, and the like (probably because we're overly fearful of being associated with anything remotely catholic). But we need to NOT downplay the SPIRITUAL aspects of worship. If going through the physical motions assists us in that, then we should not be afraid to do so. OTOH, to paraphrase Paul, we should not be judged by our not doing so either.
     
  8. MNJacob

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    I also believe that worship is simply laying yourself down before the Lord, at least figuratively speaking. Many of us confuse praise and worship. Praise is good, great actually, but praise and worship together is better.
     
  9. SpiritualMadMan

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    Bowing Physically as an outward sign of an inward act?

    It is interesting to me that I do not always *feel* madly in love with my wife...

    But, if I start doing the acts of courtship again. My own heart feelings are re-kindled and I *feel* in love again.

    In the same way I have to wonder about when Jesus said
    If this is not what He had in mind.

    To make a long story short far too often we let our feelings lead us and our wills glibly follow follow after.

    When in fact our wills should determine our course based on our knowledge of God. If we *do* right, I've found it doesn't take too very long before my emotions fall into line.

    So, it is that a physical bowing can precede a Spiritual Act of the Heart. And, IMHO, may actually facilitate it.
     
  10. DHK

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    Jesus not once worshiped the Father. Though He was God the Son, he preferred the title "the Son of man," which he uses over 80 times. He never worshiped God, but allowed all to worship Him. And there were many that came and bowed down in front of him, and worshiped him. This is New Testament, not Old. Even Cornelius, a Gentile, did the same to Peter; but Peter rebuked him, for Peter knew that worship belonged only to God and not to man.
    DHK
     
  11. Michael Wrenn

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    DHK and JohnV,

    Excellent!

    JohnV,

    I like the wooden kneelers in Episcopal churches; I wish other churches had them.
     
  12. Johnv

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    One of my friends is an Anglican, and his church has padded kneelers. I don't go to church with him that often, but when I do, I must say, there's something very solemn about kneeling while in prayer mode. Also, the custom is to bow in the direction of the chancel when crossing the center aisle or returning to one's seat. It's quite humbling.
     
  13. Lil Sister

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    Old time Pentecostals and Baptists used to kneel down during prayer. In our fellowship we bow, though we do not kneel. (Some of us with arthritic problems might have trouble getting up again! [​IMG] )
    I would disagree with Mr. Morris when he said singing is not worship. Martin Luther pointed out that singing is prayer, put to music. [At least, it ought to be!]
    Jesus pointed out to the woman at the well (John 4) that we must worship in spirit and in truth. Whole-hearted worship by those relying on Christ alone for salvation; Biblical, humble worship--this is what God seeks.
    Worship must be in agreement with the Scriptures. Reverent. Joyful. Done with a purified heart. Not lifting up oneself or someone else; but lifting up Jesus Christ crucified & risen. This is worship from a pure heart (Psalm 15). Worship in agreement with the Spirit of God--who directs us to Christ, not Himself!
    Emotions should be involved. "Love the Lord your God with all your "heart, soul, mind and strength." Every aspect of us should be immersed in worship.
    Jonathan Edwards, the Puritan who saw God work powerfully in the First Great Awakening, acknowledged that our emotions can and ought to be involved in worship. They should not be what drives or leads us, but they should be fully involved. He had a very balanced approach to the emotions in worship; pointing out that just because someone gets emotional, has physical reactions, gives stirring prayer or praise does not prove they are believers. But that believers should give these, nevertheless. His book speaks to Charismatic and non alike. [​IMG]
     
  14. GraceSaves

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    DHK,

    You once argued with me (at least I believe it was you) that PRAYER is worship. That isn't fitting in with your description at all. It's why you said prayer to the saints was worship, because prayer IS worship.

    You seem to be changing your stance, because what you are describing as worship is totally compatible with the honor and intercession of the saints.

    Granted, by necessity, you will disagree. But that doesn't change your changing definition. ;)
     
  15. BobRyan

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    A. Prayer to the deity -- claiming devotion to them.

    B. Praising them in prayer.

    C. Claiming their "powers and abilities" in prayer.

    D. Songs of praise, meditation upon the deity and adoration - to the deity.

    E. Supposing that the deity can "hear" all people on earth praying to them - at any place and any time.

    F. Bargaining with the deity in prayer - especially arguing your case based on an offer to recruit more devotees to the deity being prayed to..

    G. Building altars to the deity - worshiping at those altars with candles, incense, prayers, songs "to" the deity.

    Dear mariolotry-devotees Does this "ring a Bell" ? How about those that are devoted to St. Jude and promise to recruit even more devotees to St. Jude as a bargaining chip when praying to him.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  16. trying2understand

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    More SDA false witness.

    Come out of that cult!

    Catholics believe and preach "one Diety"; the One True God. Three Persons in One True God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

    The SDA can't all say this though since many deny the Trinity. [​IMG]
     
  17. TP

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    Greetings,

    Central to ALL worship is Sacrifice. A sacrifice must be offered to God. It must be an acceptable sacrifice. Christ is the sacrifice, and we can never forget that this is the CENTER of our worship.
    The Romans, when they arrest Christians, did not say: 'Sing Songs to our gods'. They did not even say 'kneel before our gods'. The Romans said: "Sacrifice to our gods or you will be killed'. Early Christians died because Christ is our only sacrifice.

    peace
     
  18. BobRyan

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    Oops! Did I forget to show what our RC sources say about thier invention to "replace the household dieties with the dead"?

    Here you go...

    So "yes" when they pray to these new dieties that they use in "just the same way" as the pagans pray to their family gods - they are giving them the SAME devotion, prayers, songs, altars, candles, incense, and EVEN borrowing the pagan idea of "recruiting devotees to the family diety" instead of the Apostolic teaching of Paul in 1Cor3 and 4 that refutes that pagan philosophy.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  19. BobRyan

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    As with the Albigenses - the RC policy is to "make stuff up" about those that they oppose - and hope "nobody actually reads" anything but RC propaganda about the RC victims. .. Admittedly it must be a hard "habit" for our RC bretheren to break.

    Notice T2U "still using that tactic"...

    T2U said "
    The SDA can't all say this though since many deny the Trinity. "


    Pretty fascinating study in cutlure and human behavior. Like doctrine and practice -- like member -- at least in the case above posted by T2U.

    "Who said" there is no "benefit" to leaving the doctrines, traditions and practices of the dark ages? T2U is proving that if you don't leave them - you resort to the same tactics.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  20. MikeS

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    Bob,

    Everybody was playing nice and offering sincere comments, until you chimed in. I think your hatred of the Catholic Church is devouring you, inch by inch, day by day. Hope you can reverse your slide before you become a permanent old crank.
     

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