Dr. Doodledigger PHT.

Ding, Ding. Round 1 is over.

You know, God used people like Jonathan Edwards, who was highly educated, and people like DL Moody, who had little education. I know those who preach that if a preacher goes to college he'll 'get the po'r 'o god taught plumb out-a him.' I know others who think a Pastor should have an earned PhD. Both are right. Both are wrong. to answer the OP, yes, people can and do get distracted by degrees. personally, I prefer this to being distracted by poor language skills...
But you can choose your own pastor.

 

Revmitchell,
I have found your posts to be most insightful and agree with you on all that I've read from your posts. Your post here, from my perspective, is that it describes a man that is dedicated to the study of God's Word through much time, prayer, and fasting through tutored assistance. For which I honor you in your endeavor to learn the precepts of God's Word. This is the direction of every called Minister, to be taught regarding God's Word. However, When I find myself in local association with neighboring Churches that have Pastors with degrees from seminaries and colleges, they fail to seek the opinions of those of Pastors of small rural congregations that we have grown up in, and likewise have committed much, much, much, time, prayer and fasting to the study of God's Holy Word outside of tutored studies and halls of learning. Such as only having documents of Ordination and License of our home Church.
Would I seek the halls of academic studies if I had the chance?
At the drop of a hat I would. However, life tends take different directions and I am very happy to serve my little congregation in the best capacity I can and at will of the Holy Spirit.

Blessings

Brother Mel

 

Brother I do not have letters in front of my name and have only served small churches in rural areas to this point. My concern was the belittling of an education and those who respect it by trying to reduce all that work to only a few letters. I was not trying to be all inclusive in my post. But that in no way negates the diligence of those I was not speaking to.

 

Understood, and thanks for the reply.

 

What ever happened to the D.L. Moody's, and Charles Finney's and Ironside's and Torrey's and Spurgeon's and Hyles'and Rice's and Sextons'and Norris' and Graham's and on and on and on.
There still out you just have to find them.If you ever get a chance, listen to evangalist Malcom Ellis, preaches mostly in Texas, careful though he will step all over your toes.

 

You have misunderstood what I said. I was not belittling education at all, or those who have those little letters before or after their name. What I said was that I have not been a witness to people thinking someone was better than someone else because of this education, except maybe that person who has those letters, I have in fact been a witness to that both in the field of ministry and out in the world.

BUT just like I should not belittle all the hard work and hours and hours of study that is required to earn those degrees, you and anyone else should not belittle the commitment of time that is required, the hours upon hours of self study and all the prayer time that it takes someone else who does not have a degree to pastor effectively.

If you read my post again I was not belittling anyone, I said was a degree does not make someone better than someone else.

I agree education and continuing education is important. But what I think the OP was trying to get out was that even today it is God who makes preachers, not seminaries.

:godisgood:

 

Yea... No one has done that especially me. You pulled that out of thin air.

 

Here all the time I was proud of my "THT." Actually, the three letters behind my name that makes me most proud is "dad."

 

I am all for as much education as one can get, and to never stop learning.

That said, way too many self-important preachers tack degrees onto their names when they have only received honorary degrees, never having done the coursework and research to actually earn them. These types are shams!

 

I agree!:thumbs:

 

I understand and agree with the gist of what you said, however, I believe that there are exceptions to most human rules including this one.

I sat under the tutelage of some older, godly, and well-respected men who had PH.D's and D.Mins that were not earned in the classroom, but rather by years of faithful service to the Lord in ministry. I do not begrudge them the honor of calling them 'Doctor'.

Then on the other hand, there are men such as my former pastor who were not yet 30 years of age, who went to a 'college' out west, and because he kissed the great toe of the 'Mannagod' of that ministry, he was awarded a 'doctorate', and returned insisting that he be called 'Doctor' Soandso. I could not and refused to call him 'Doctor', and soon left the church as some other discrepancies in his ministry came to light.

May God grant us the wisdom to give honor where it is due and the courage to stand up for truth where honor is lacking.

 

I forgot to mention... my wife is in fact the proud possessor of a 'PHT' degree. She received it upon my graduation from college. 'PHT' stands for 'Pushing Hubby Through'.

She worked very hard for that designation. I tell folks she is my 'pusher'. :laugh:

 

Amen, brother. I was wondering who would catch what the PHT really is! My wife has several, cause she pushed our son through two degrees and me one! The PHT is actually the degree I honor most, the one with the most prestige! :smilewinkgrin: :thumbs:

 

PhDs and DMins are not honorary degrees given for years of faithful service. Those are DDs (Doctor of Divinity or "Didn't Do It") or LLDs (Doctor of Laws) or there are a few others. The PhD and DMin are earned degrees.

 

Ahh, thanks for correcting me. I should have researched my answer better.:thumbs:

 

You might add that there are several other degrees that are earned, as well, these days, including, among others, Th.D., Ed.D., D.R.E., and some S.T.D.s; depending on the institution. Actually, I believe that institutions in some locales, although I know of none in the United States still award the D.D. as an academic degree.

And actually, a century ago, the D.D. was awarded in the United States as an earned academic degree. My late grandfather, who was a pastor and also an educator in a more limited way than pastor, and whom I barely knew, as he died when I was around 8 years old, according to what I have been told, had earned 5 degrees, including the D.D., but I do not know from where, although he was a graduate of Georgetown College, Southern Seminary, and I believe William Jewell, along the way. When one is reading something from someone from that era, one might keep in mind that the degree may be earned, for whatever that's worth.

I have previously posted that I wish to be spared from the "fake doctors" and learn from and be taught by those who are the real thing. I have included a list of some doctors all of whom have long gone to glory, with the passing of Dr. Sightler the last, whom I consider 'the real thing', including, among others, Baptists such as John Gill, J. L. Dagg, John A. Broaddus, P. H. Mell, Basil Manly, Sr., B. H. Carroll, George W. Truett, Oliver B. Greene, Richard Furman, and Harold Sightler, and the non-Baptists including H. A. Ironside, Bob Jones, Sr., C. I. Scofield, and Wilbur M. Smith. I could add many more, but surely one can see my point with these fourteen of varied abilities and achievements

Now that group of 14 is what I consider the real thing!

Teachers and Educatiors, Pastors, Evangelists, Baptist and other Christian leaders, Professors, Radio Evangelists, Authors, Theologians, what have you! Among them, one presided over the SBC for 18 years, and several were involved in the founding of, or founded and/or headed at least a dozen schools including SBTS, SWBTS, BJU, Mercer, Univ. of AL, Univ. of GA (two of them turned down seven Presidencies, including Baylor, Georgetown (KY), and Wake Forest), and some of them turned down large influential pastorates, as they served God where they were, well over the years, IMO.

It might be of some interest to note that these fourteen had, at the most, 5 academic degrees among them that were fully and completely earned, an one awarded when the recipient was 6 weeks short of completion of class work (B. H. Carroll, who entered the Army of the CSA, and fought until its surrender.) All of them had the D.D. conferred on them. I'd suggest that they were a worthy group, personally, and were indeed "The Real Thing"!

I do like the line that today, the DD stands for "Didn't Do It" in a lot of instances. You are definitely correct, unfortunately, in too many instances.

However, sometimes it stands for "Did Do it".

Ed

Ed Sutton, B.A., N.D.