"Entitlement Reform"

Discussion in 'Politics' started by OldRegular, Nov 27, 2012.

  1. OldRegular

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    I don't care much for the term "Entitlement Reform" because it is too frequently associated with welfare. And in some sense it is "Welfare" because the so-called Trust Fund is existent only in the mind of Washington bureaucrats. That money has been spent! SS and Mediscare are indeed Ponzi Schemes.

    Some months ago I contacted my Congressional Delegation via Congress.Org and who knows where my letters went, I suppose the delete key. Nevertheless I did present my ideas for measures I believe must be taken if Mediscare and Social Security continue to exist. I really cannot comment on Medicaid simply because I don't know enough about it!

    First: The age for receiving Social Security and Mediscare must be increased starting immediately. I would suggest increasing the age at which these benefits could be received to 70 over a period of 10 years.

    Second: Means testing must be implemented in both these programs. I understand that these people have contributed to the Social Security and Mediscare programs but????

    *******Any single person with an income exclusive of SS of $100,000 or more should be denied Social Security and Mediscare I would include provision for Mediscare in event of catastrophic illness. I understand that it is more expensive to live in Yankeeland than other places except possibly California but folks can move. We have far more carpet baggers {thems Yankees} down here now than during reconstruction!

    *******Any couple with an income exclusive of SS of $125,000 or more should be denied Social Security and Mediscare. Again provision should be made for catastrophic illness.

    The income mention above is substantially less than in my "deleted" communication to my Congressional delegation but they provide a basis for discussion. I would appreciate everyones thoughts on the above suggestions. It is a fact that something must be done. It is also a fact that Obama and the democrats want to postpone discussion of "Entitlements" until after the Republicans agree to raise taxes.

    When it came to dealing with the Soviet Union Reagan's policy was "Trust but verify". Sadly he did not use the same policy with democrats who promised a 3 for 1 cut in spending for a tax hike. Same thing happened to "Read my lips" George H. W. Bush. So hopefully before republicans agree to any increase in tax revenue it will be tied irrevocably to "Entitlement Reform".
     
  2. billwald

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    I don't like the term "entitlement" because it always refers to government help/benefits for working and poor people but never refers to government help/benefits for rich people.
     
  3. OldRegular

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    That is nonsense. The term "Entitlement" applies to monies received from the government by rich or poor or middle income. I am simply saying that in order to save SS and Mediscare for those who need it the well off and rich can pay their own way.

    Why not say something positive about "Entitlement Reform" unless you are one of the naive who think it can go on forever.
     
  4. Nevada

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    A thought about the safety net:

    India is a place with no social safety net. Poor parents cannot get their children into schools. Families sleep in ditches outside of new car dealerships.

    Americans will never tolerate that. That is one reason I am skeptical of talk from politicians about "entitlements", and "welfare reform".

    Secondly, unemployment is a part of the system, and cannot be done away with, to as great an extent as many would want. The same politicians who talk to voters about halting the movement of dollars from their pockets and into welfare checks, actually know this. They're just talking. In 1996, there was a labor shortage, unemployment was so low. How did the head of the Federal Reserve feel about this good news? Alan Greenspan stated that he wanted unemploymet to rise, because the low level of it would lead to inflation. How? Workers would get cocky and demand more money, and employers would have to practically bid against each other to attract the best workers.

    I once read a statement made by the head of America's Chamber of Commerce, who stated that a society with NO unemployment was not to be desired, as it would lead to too much class consciousness. Interpretation: workers who are cocky.

    So. Beware politicians claiming they will put money into your pockets, by clamping down on cheaters and loafers.

    It's really funny to see Republicans add fuel to the fire they claim to want to put out. Reagan talked about "young bucks" who got welfare and didn't work. Then, he and his fellows made America a place in which no responsible person with foresight would dare bring children into the world. Where to put them? Who cares for them when mama works? Just having one leads to financial ruin, in the form of medical bills. Daddy gets fired for taking time off to run one to the doctor (I know a company that does just that.) The Swedes and Northern Europeans care about their people, and have a safety net and pro-family programs. Americans just wish for a return to "Little Home on the Prarie" days.

    Afterall, the shiftless among us, by definition, are not going to get busy with constructive activity and stop producing large numbers of offspring. As we won't go the way of India and in effect starve them out, by ending every and all social programs, cutting social programs as we have since 1968, say, has had the unexpected effect of leading constructive, responsible, citizens to limit their numbers of children. This is the irony of our times.
     
    #4 Nevada, Nov 28, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 28, 2012
  5. Revmitchell

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    One has nothing to do with the other.

    Again one has nothing to do with the other.


    I once read a statement made by the head of America's Chamber of Commerce, who stated that a society with NO unemployment was not to be desired, as it would lead to too much class consciousness. Interpretation: workers who are cocky.
     
  6. billwald

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    >That is nonsense. The term "Entitlement" applies to monies received from the government by rich or poor or middle income.

    The 15% max capital gains tax is a gift/entitlement mostly to rich people
     
  7. OldRegular

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    What in the world are you smoking?????
     
  8. OldRegular

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    I agree and have said that "Income is Income" and that all income should be taxed at the same rate as "earned income".
     
  9. carpro

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    Social security is not an entitlement.
     
  10. OldRegular

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    I agree and my opening remarks in the OP indicate that. However, it has become an entitlement because there is no "Trust Fund". SS and Mediscare were stupid programs from inception and have gotten worse with time.
     
  11. billwald

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    >Social security is not an entitlement.

    Neither is it an insurance contract or any other kind of contract. What shall we call it?
     
  12. mont974x4

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    Actually it is a contract of sorts. Although very few people alive today were alive when it was first drawn up. The tacit agreement that people would work and pay into the SS pot and when it came time to retire they would get their money back implies a contract. We can see that in court cases where verbal and/or implied agreements have been enforced. What makes SS different than an entitlement is the people are personally invested into it whereas entitlements are more like welfare (read: overt wealth distribution) and the recipients are not required to be invested into it. Granted that SS is a more subtle form of wealth redistribution (you can argue over how covert or overt it is I guess, but that depends on how informed the worker is on the issue).

    Regardless, the country is broke. We cannot have this debt load and say we were not broke. It's time to put every part of the "entitlement" argument on the table and see what can be cut, trimmed, and outright thrown away. Only those with a proven need should get help. It would be nice if we could apply the principals of 1 Tim 5 concerning widows to a national budget.

    All foreign aid must stop. We need an amendment to drop the IRS and current tax code and enact a 15% flat tax on each and every income earner....no loopholes....no deductions....one page annual filing...no excuses.


    And....congress and the president get a 50% pay cut...minimum.
     
  13. Nevada

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    You and I know that "entitlements" are not always the same as, "food stamps" , "AFDC", etc. But, when politicians speak of them to prospective voters, they have the same intent; to portray members of the opposite political party as near thieves, who help the lazy.
     
  14. Nevada

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    In the 1980's, Ronald Reagan got elected by talking about "welfare queens" and "Young bucks". That last phrase he reserved for use in The South, leading some to say he appealed to latent racism. Maybe . .

    Flash forward almost 30 years, and politicians can no longer play that kind of card as much, so they use the term "entitlements", which are indeed often different from flat out welfare. But, the impulse is the same: scapegoat the poor and vulnerable, while giving free reign to the wealthy.

    What is the irony I see? Because of demographics, a Republican has a tough time getting elected nowadays. Irony? Poetic justice?

    America has become a bit of an anti-family society, in large part because family and workplace are at odds (because business has no time for such things, so don't just blame the "gays and feminists") Many Americans commit "genetic suicide" as Pat Robertson told us. Ben Wattenberg called it the "Birth Dearth" and wrote a book by that title. A very recent book by another is:

    http://www.amazon.com/dp/159698273X/?tag=baptis04-20

    Not enough little Republicans being born.
     
    #14 Nevada, Nov 29, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 29, 2012
  15. Revmitchell

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    Good luck with that.:thumbs:
     
  16. OldRegular

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    Sounds like the leftists/democrats!
     
  17. OldRegular

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    Can you provide proof or you just spouting off.


    Thirty states have Republican Governors.

    It ia the abortion celebrating democrats who are anti-family! It is the homosexual celebrating democrats who are anti family!
     
  18. Borneol

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    I think entitlement reform, or an upgrade for our entitlement programs is important. People are living longer these days, and medical costs are higher. As a result not enough money has been paid into Medicaid to support the system as is. Additionally Social Security is now paying out more money than it is taking in. This is a situation that can not last for long.

    Economist Lawrence Kudlow had a mention this morning too about how credit rating agencies are looking for an upgrade to our entitlement programs. With out this, we can expect another credit down grade raising our borrowing costs.

    "GOP Shouldn't Sign Any Deal That Doesn't Include Spending Cuts"

    from his article:

    Read More At IBD: http://news.investors.com/ibd-edito...uctions-not-raise-tax-rates.htm#ixzz2Dq8ie3kj
     
  19. billwald

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    > The tacit agreement that people would work and pay into the SS pot and when it came time to retire they would get their money back implies a contract.

    Seems to me oral contracts disappear when all the parties are dead.
     
  20. OldRegular

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    The Federal Government still exists and the taxpayer is still getting the shaft!
     

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