Final Authority and Final Canonization

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by makahiya117, Mar 22, 2013.

  1. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    I wish to present my theory of final authority and final canonization,
    not to doubtful disputation, envy, strive or contention
    but in sincerity and love.

    KJV Romans 14:1 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye,
    but not to doubtful disputations.

    KJV Philippians 1:15-17
    15 Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife . . .
    16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely . . .
    17 But the other of love . . .
     
  2. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    Academic Theology

    Historically and logically, Theology is the master university science.
    Academic Theology was central in the development of higher education
    at Paris, Oxford, Cambridge, Harvard, Yale and Princeton.

    The central critical issue in academic theology is final authority.

    KJV 1 Corinthians 15:3-4
    3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received,
    how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
    4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day
    according to the scriptures.
     
  3. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    Purified Text Theory and Record Theory

    #1. You cannot honestly state you have scripture if you believe
    only the original manuscripts were given by inspiration of God.
    There are no original manuscripts.
    KJV But have renounced the hidden things of dishonesty,
    not walking in craftiness,nor handling the word of God deceitfully;
    but by manifestation of the truth commendingourselves
    to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

    #2. You cannot honestly say "the bible" or "all bibles"
    are given by inspiration of God.
    There are over 400 (Christian, Catholic, Cult) Greek, Syrian,
    Latin, German, English, French, Spanish, etc. bibles
    which do not match in content, volume or doctrine.

    #3. You cannot honestly say "the Greek N.T." or "all N.T. Greek texts"
    are given by inspiration of God.
    There are over 24 reconstructed (Christian, Catholic, Cult) Greek N.T. texts
    which do not match in content, volume or doctrine.

    #4. All KJV Holy Bibles are editions of the 1611 KJV first edition.
    The human finger prints (typographical errors, spelling errors,
    missing words, etc.) further document the testaments and covenants (records) between God and man. While the 1769 KJV Holy Bible standardized spelling, corrected printer’s errors and is the select text today, the text of the AV 1611 KJV first edition remains the principal canon authority of Holy Scripture. There were no manuscript revisions
    of the 1611 KJV until the 1881 RV (Revised Version), only spelling, measurements and punctuation editions.
    KJV For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God:
    but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

    #5. God's words were given by inspiration of God.
    KJV All scripture is given by inspiration of God,
    and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction,
    for instruction in righteousness:

    #6. God predestined certain individuals to record the words of God.
    KJV Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God,
    according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,
    KJV Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called:
    and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified,
    them he also glorified.
    KJV According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation
    of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

    #7. God providentially preserved and canonized
    the words of scripture.
    KJV The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace
    of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD,
    thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.
    KJV Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,

    #8. Inspiration, predestination, providence and preservation continued throughout final canonization (books and words)
    and publication of scripture.
    KJV For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me;
    and they have received them, and have known surely that I came
    out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.
    KJV Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away.

    #9. The words of the AV 1611 KJV Holy Bible
    were divinely transmitted, infallible, infinite and eternal.
    KJV Now unto the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only wise God,
    be honour and glory for ever and ever. Amen.

    #10. KJV Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.
    The Record Theory independently answers the questions of final authority
    and final canonization (books and words). The dynamic Purified Text Theory supports the Record Theory, demonstrated categorically
    and conclusively in the manuscript evidence, bible canonization,
    bible doctrine, billions of bibles and computational linguistics.
     
  4. Logos1560

    Logos1560
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    In what language or languages were the words that proceeded from the mouth of God and that were given by inspiration of God to the prophets and apostles?
     
  5. Logos1560

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    Are you in effect questioning the honesty of the translators of the KJV?

    In their preface to the 1611, the KJV translators wrote: "No cause therefore why the word translated should be denied to be the word, or forbidden to be current, notwithstanding that some imperfections and blemishes may be noted in the setting forth of it. For what ever was perfect under the sun, where apostles or apostolike men, that is, men endured with an extraordinary measure of God's Spirit, and priviledged with the priviledge of infallibility, had not their hand?
     
  6. Van

    Van
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    Asserting the KJV is the Holy Bible, and all other English translations are not is without merit.

    Only the original manuscripts were inspired by God. To the extent copies reflect the original message, they are trustworthy and reliable.
    While we can find differences, the main message has not been corrupted. God is creator. We were made sinners. Nothing we can do merits salvation from God's wrath toward our sin debt. God provided a means of redemption, Jesus who became or propitiation or means of salvation. Whoever believes in His, as determined by God who knows our heart, shall not perish but have eternal life. We are to be ambassadors of Christ, not book salesmen for an outdated and corrupted translation.
     
  7. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    I am not a KJV Only or an Original Only.

    I believe all scripture is given by inspiration of God.

    KJV All scripture is given by inspiration of God,
    and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction,
    for instruction in righteousness:

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    Please state you theory of final authority and final canonization.

    -------------------------------------------------------------

    1 Peter 3:15
    15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts:
    and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you
    a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:
     
  8. Yeshua1

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    The Apsotolic writers, and those in the OT ONLY were inspired by god to give usrevelation in their books, for the Holy Spirit allowed them to write things down as they chose to, but superindent it so that what was put down was perfect in all details, regarding doctrines/historical facts etc!

    ONLY they were inspired revealtion from God, but God also did watch over the word to make sure we were able to make hebrew/greek texts that essential reflect those originals, so the KJV and MV translated off them are infallible, the word of God to us in english today!
     
  9. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    Thank you for your reply.

    I think the N.T. is scripture given by inspiration of God.

    Several N.T. verses claim inspiration especially the Book of Revelation.

    I don't have a bible with me, sorry, I will look the verses up later.

    Additionally, since there are no original manuscripts,

    then technically we do not have exact scripture, only reconstructed texts.

    There are over 24 reconstructed N.T. Greek texts which do not match

    in content, volume and doctrine.
     
  10. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1
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    the reliable greek NT verify the accuracy of the originals, as they are extremely close to them, and among the used Greek texts by scholars, HIGH degree of agreement between them, and NO doctrines are affected/changed regardless which one used to translate off from!
     
  11. franklinmonroe

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    Welcome. However, since you have dropped in with such bold statements I will reserve my right to see if your sincerity is still around in a couple of years.
     
  12. Logos1560

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    What is your definition of KJV-only?

    What other English translation do you accept as being the word of God in the same sense or way that you would claim for the KJV?
     
  13. Logos1560

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    Are you suggesting that editors of later KJV editions did not consult the preserved Scriptures in the original languages in making corrections to the errors in the 1611 edition and in later editions of the KJV including errors in the 1769 Oxford, in making corrections to the inconsistent use of italics in the 1611, etc.?

    Perhaps you are uninformed or misinformed since there were manuscript revisions of the 1611 KJV before the 1881 RV. Are you unaware of John Wesley's 1755 English Bible? Are you unaware of the 1842 revision of the KJV by Bible-believing Baptists and other believers? Are you unaware of the 1866 American Bible Union Version?

    Are you unaware of a 1841 edition of the AV that made 20,000 emendations to it?
    The Holy Bible containing the Authorized Version of the Old and New Testaments with many Emendations. London, 1841.
     
  14. jonathan.borland

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    The beauty of the canon is that this grouping of books, the origin of which is not testified by anyone, dominated the ms tradition no matter who opposed what books were included in it. Who had the power to pull this off, and where? The Holy Spirit's fingerprints are all over this! My votes for key players/places are, John, Timothy, Luke, Ephesus.
     
    #14 jonathan.borland, Mar 23, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 23, 2013
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1
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    Are you saying that we NOT in the canon the right books, some were not inspired, or that the canon should not have been closed to just those 66 books?
     
  16. jonathan.borland

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    No. I believe every word as preserved in most Greek nt mss is the inspired word of God. Where one ms is faulty, the rest are pure.

    As to the formation of the canon, I don't hold that it was the result of a slow process of trial and error over hundreds of years. Fathers argued over what had already been decided long before.
     
  17. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    Here are two categorical and conclusive texts which clearly state God
    gave us the words of the book Revelation of Jesus Christ.

    Revelation1:1-3
    1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:
    2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ,
    and of all things that he saw.
    3 Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy,
    and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

    Revelation 22:18-19
    18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
    19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out ofthe holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
     
  18. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    Thank you for your reply.

    Please list the mauscript revisions of the 1611 KJV before the 1881 RV.
     
  19. makahiya117

    makahiya117
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    While some may define "KJV Only" as the only bible

    which should be used today,

    my definition of KJV Only is only the KJV is scripture.


    I am not a KJV Only or an Original Only.

    I believe all scripture is given by inspiration of God.

    KJV All scripture is given by inspiration of God,
    and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction,
    for instruction in righteousness:

    ------------------------------------------------------

    Holy Bibles

    Syrian Line of Bibles

    Acts 11: 26 . . . the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.

    O.T. Original Autographs 1500 B.C. - 389

    O.T. Hebrew Manuscripts 1500 - 300

    N.T. Original Autographs 40 A.D. - 90

    N.T. Greek Manuscripts 100 - 200

    N.T. Syrian Manuscripts 100 - 200

    N.T. Latin Manuscripts 100 - 200

    N.T. Receptus Greek Uncial Manuscripts 200 - 900

    N.T. Receptus Greek Cursive Manuscripts 800 - 1500

    Gothic Bible of Ulfilas 310

    Latin Bibles of the Waldensian 1100

    Latin Bibles of the Albigenes 1300

    Wycliffe Bible 1362

    Latin Bibles of the Lollards 1382

    Erasmus N.T. Greek Text 1516

    Luther German Bible 1522

    Colinaeus N.T. Greek Text 1534

    Stephanus N.T. Greek Text 1546

    Tyndale Bible 1522

    Coverdale Bible 1535

    Great Bible 1539

    Geneva Bible 1560

    Bishops Bible 1568

    Beza N.T. Greek Text 1598

    Nuremberg Polyglot Bible 1599

    Authorized King James Bible 1611

    --------------------------------

    While the entire line of scripture are records,
    the outstanding record of scripture and the scripture of final authority
    is the published text and form of the AV 1611 KJV Holy Bible first edition.

    KJV Holy Bibles are the most published, read and loved bibles of all time.

    KJV Holy Bibles are the most published, read and loved books of all time.
     
  20. Logos1560

    Logos1560
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    Can you name and identify any one Greek manuscript that agrees 100% with the KJV?

    Are you unaware of the fact that the KJV has some readings that are not found in the majority of the manuscripts on which the Textus Receptus was based and even readings found in no Greek NT manuscript?

    Dean John William Burgon actually supported revision of the Textus Receptus and KJV (The Revision Revised, pp. 21, 107, 114, 224, 236, 269). For example, Dean Burgon wrote: "Again and again we shall have occasion to point out that the Textus Receptus needs correction" (p. 21). Burgon wrote: “That some corrections of the Text were necessary, we are well aware” (p. 224, footnote 1). Burgon asserted that “the accumulated evidence of the last two centuries has enabled us to correct it [the Textus Receptus] with confidence in hundreds of places” (Treatise on the Pastoral Office, p. 69). In his introduction to Burgon’s book, Edward Miller wrote: “In the Text left behind by Dean Burgon, about 150 corrections have been suggested by him in St. Matthew‘s Gospel alone“ (Traditional Text of the Holy Gospels, p. 5). Burgon and Miller advocated “the Traditional Text,“ not the Textus Receptus (p. 5). Burgon as edited by Miller asserted: “I am not defending the ‘Textus Receptus’” (p. 15). Burgon added: “That it is without authority to bind, nay, that it calls for skillful revision in every part, is freely admitted. I do not believe it to be absolutely identical with the true Traditional Text” (p. 15). Edward Miller suggested that the Traditional Text advocated by Dean Burgon would differ “in many passages” from the Textus Receptus (p. 96).
     

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