For the Guys and Gals who know Greek

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by percho, May 23, 2012.

  1. percho

    percho
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    Help me out with my below understanding, whether right of wrong.


    Gal. 3:22-25 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. But before the faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterward be revealed. Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster unto (the seed of the promise V19) Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after that the faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

    Is the above not the exact description of? ----- εἰς ὑπακοὴν πίστεως For obedience of faith - interlinear

    before the faith came
    after the faith did come
    the faith, afterward revealed
    by faith of Jesus Christ

    Gal 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

    Did they receive the Spirit because of the faith above that they heard about?

    Gal 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through the faith. (of Jesus Christ after it was revealed)
    Romans 16:25,26 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience of faith, to all nations, having been made known.

    Do not those say the exact same thing?


    Is there anything in the Greek that would hinder my above understanding of : the faith?

    In the Greek not in the traditional understanding?

    A little more about the faith that was to come and has come. Take those in Hebrews 11 who died in faith. Did they die before the faith came per Gal. 3:23? If the answer is yes, would not that not also say Paul put this verse as he did? Rom.3:29,30 [Is he] the God of the Jews only? [is he] not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also: Seeing one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, (to come) and uncircumcision through the faith. (that did come)
     
  2. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1
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    There was faith before 'the faith", so would by necessity mean something other then faith as OT would know it...

    Say this as indicating when the object of the faith, yeshua Himself came, THAT would usher in THE faith, which was faith in him as Messiah of God, and THAT faith in THAT person is what the law leads us too!
     
  3. Greektim

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    You are entering into a humongous debate in the exegetical and theological world. I would recommend reading NT Wright on this, but that might be considered the unpardonable sin by some :D
     
  4. Yeshua1

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    As long as he does not try to reinvent new meanings/understanding, should be OK!
     
  5. percho

    percho
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    Does NTW believe there has been misunderstanding and that there needs to be new understanding/meaning?

    I would say of course. And from what little I read,"The Shape of Justification."
    I think he is also wrong for he assigns, "the faith." to mankind instead of to a man, The Christ.

    Think about it. As far as man is concerned he is either of the old creation, the old man, in the first man Adam or he is of the new creation, the new man, in the last Adam who was born of Mary, of the old man, Jesus the Christ who by the resurrection from the dead became the new creation.

    Through the faith of the sinless Jesus the Christ of the old man, Adam, however made to be sin for us; By grace God the Father raised him from the dead, thus a new creation of the Son of Man through the Son of God and through which we can become the sons of God in the image of the new man Jesus the Christ.

    This promise,"In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;" was not made before time began, for sinful man but was made for one who would be with out sin, without spot or blemish, "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world," (before time began). Jesus died and except for the Grace of God the Father would be dead today, had the Father not raised him from the dead.

    By Grace through the Faith is salvation available for man who has lived and died under the old creation.

    That is the reason I asked for the Greek Guys to confirm or not my understanding in the OP.
     
  6. humblethinker

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    Very nice OP Percho. I look forward to learning something in this thread...
     
  7. Yeshua1

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    Paul calls Jesus the "second Adam", and just as Adam stands in place for/of sinners born after him, jesus stood for'f the saints in him before God! jesus passed the testing Adam failed, and hos obedience brought salvation and eternal life to the many!

    its NOT faith per sayhere, but the faith as in the Gospel and new Covenant relationship God has now established for us by Christ death and resurrection!
     
  8. percho

    percho
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    How did his obedience bring salvation and eternal life?

    Is salvation something different from eternal life or are they one and the same?
     
  9. HankD

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    Cause (salvation) and effect (eternal life)?

    HankD
     
  10. Yeshua1

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    Jesus obeying FULLY the law as God requires it to be kept enabled/allowed God to accept his death on the Cross as a sacrifice to atone on behalf of our sins....

    salvation is the process/event that Goes does to us that brings to us Eternal life!
     
  11. percho

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    I'm going to tell you what Goes does.

    Jesus Christ who knew no sin was made sin for us. That sin separated Jesus from God his Father, yet Jesus by obedience of faith was obedient unto death even the death of the cross. For obedience of faith, God the Father exercised grace toward Jesus who was separated from him because of our sin, in raising Jesus who was dead as a doornail from the dead. Regeneration by being the firstborn from the dead. The regenerated Jesus received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit Acts 2:33 the renewing of the Holy Spirit Titus 3:5

    Then and only then could the Holy Spirit of promise be given to us. Acts 2:33 Titus 3:6 which sanctifies (sets us apart) for salvation, that is to follow Jesus in the regeneration when he the Son of Man shall sit on the throne of his glory.

    Matt, 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

    That is what Goes does.
     

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