Forgiveness

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Heavenly Pilgrim, Mar 23, 2009.

  1. Heavenly Pilgrim

    Heavenly Pilgrim
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    Mr 11:26 But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.

    HP: Here is an interesting verse. How can one be certain they are in compliance to this admonition? What are some evidences that one has truly forgiven another?
     
  2. Agnus_Dei

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    The West is more focused on ‘evidence’, prove this, and explain that. It’s not between me and hundred other people and me kissing someone’s butt, to prove that I’ve forgiven someone. One could easily be blackmailed, imo.

    It’s between me and my Father in Heaven, for God knows our hearts. If I’m wronged in any way, I’m commanded to forgive, yet this doesn’t mean I have to be “best buddies” with the person, only I should have a right heart and truly forgive and forget about the trespass. Yet this doesn’t mean one should wait until the person trespassing you seeks your forgiveness before you forgive.

    In XC
    -
     
  3. billwald

    billwald
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    If you are not angry at the person then you have forgiven him. It is not necessary to tell him that you have forgiven him - not until he repents and asks.
     
  4. JSM17

    JSM17
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    Can true forgiveness happen apart from the other party repenting?

    What is forgiveness when it come to us forgiving someone that has done us wrong?

    Is there a difference between having a heart that wants to forgive and truly being able to forgive someone even if they do not repent?

    Is repentance necessary for forgiveness?

    Does God forgive us apart from repentance, so does God require us to forgive another without repentance when He does require it?

    Just throwing out some thoughts.
     
  5. THEOLDMAN

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    That was what I call..."hardcore". I'll be thinkin' bout that for awhile.
     
  6. Gup20

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    True forgiveness means "Giving up your right for justice".

    Great questions. I recently went through a situation in my marriage where I needed to forgive, and I stumbled over these exact questions.

    Clearly the Bible advocates continuous forgiveness (I think of Jesus telling Peter to forgive 70 x 7 - in other words continually), and I see verses like the one saying that "vengence is the Lord's".

    But then I look at God's example... only those who believe and repent are saved - or forgiven from their sin, right?

    The conclusion I came to was that forgiveness in one's heart should be offered regardless of the repentant state. However, true fellowship with the offending party can't be fully restored until there is repentance. Isn't that God's way? He is willing to forgive all (2 Peter 3:9), but all are not forgiven, and some still bear the consequence of not accepting God's forgiveness and go to hell.

    In the end, it truly does come down to trusting in God and giving up your right to hold a grudge, get even, or remain offended. We have to trust in God's justice as superior to our own justice.

    One final aspect of God's forgiveness is that he remembers the offense no more... he says as far as the east is from the west. As humans, I don't know how we can forget things intentionally, but we can refuse to hold something against another person, or even bring it up again.
     
  7. thegospelgeek

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    Absolutely. Example:Stephen

    Am man is what's in his heart. If you are unable to forgive, your forgivness is only in the mind, not the heart.

    Did the people who stoned Stephen repent? He forgave them.

    No

    According to scripture, yes. Out of time right now, will post scriptures latter unless someone else beats me to it.
     
  8. thegospelgeek

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    More to it than just being, "not angry".
     
  9. Gup20

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    There is one big difference here... Stephen was being persecuted for his faith. (John 15:21-23) But notice Stephen realized this, and realized his relationship to God and to the people persecuting him:

    Act 7:60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep

    He didn't say "Lord I forgive them"... he knew that vengence was the Lord's and so he asked the Lord to forgive them. He was being persecuted for operating in Jesus name... therefore what was being done to him was not being done to him... but to Christ.

    Jhn 15:21 But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.
    22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin.
    23 He that hateth me hateth my Father also.

    I think the question assumes something incorrect. The question assumes that God's forgiveness isn't extended unless there is repentance. I think God is willing that none should perish, but some will choose not to accept forgiveness and perish despite God's will to the contrary.

    God says, "I forgive you, return to fellowship with me". Some do, but some reject it and remain unforgiven. Isn't it a choice he offers for us to make? Don't we choose for ourselves whether to believe in Jesus Christ or not? Doesn't that mean that forgiveness has been extended and it's up to us to accept it?

    So then, we are to forgive and if forgiveness is accepted (repentance), fellowship can be restored. In order to accept forgiveness, you must necessarily acknowledge the validity of the idea that you committed an offense - in other words, you repent.
     
  10. JSM17

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    Luke 17:3-4
    3 Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him.

    4 And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day returns to you, saying, 'I repent,' you shall forgive him."
    NKJV

    I think this sums it up for me.

    I think it is a heart issue we should want to forgive, yet forgiveness is not something that I came up with, the formula is God's plan and idea so what He says about it is what I need to believe.

    I can want to forgive someone and not harbor ill feelings towards the one that has done me wrong, but if God says for true forgiveness to occur their needs to be repentance, then I do not see how by God's plan that there can be true forgiveness without that in which He says constitutes true forgiveness.
     
  11. TCGreek

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    Before my conversion to Christ by faith alone because of grace alone, God related to me as a judge because of my sins.

    But now, God relates to me as a Father because he sees me covered in the blood of his Son.
     
  12. billwald

    billwald
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    And how did your father react when you screwed up? I can remember only three good thumpings from mine and I earned them.
     
  13. Heavenly Pilgrim

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    HP: But He will once again be our Judge and no sin will be covered in which the conditions for forgiveness have not been met. We need to keep short accounts with God concerning sin. We need to examine ourselves, listen to our conscience, to see if we be of the faith. If we desire to have Jesus Christ the Righteous as our final Advocate, our repenting needs to be done in this world, without which the possibility exists that we could indeed found to have been deceived in this world and hopelessly lost in the next. Watch therfore for we know not the day nor the hour our Lord cometh.
     

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