From today's church bulletin....

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by CatholicConvert, Jun 1, 2003.

  1. CatholicConvert

    CatholicConvert
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    1,958
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here is an interesting tidbit:

    INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC IN THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH

    Why we cannot and do not use instruments in Church

    At one time there was no local Church, within the universal Church, which permitted instrumental music within the church building. This was considered to be too worldly for spiritual worship. Such music was associated with the circus, the arena, and the dance hall; hence it was unthinkable for use in the church. The organ was the first instrument to be used in the Western Church. Actually, it was invented by the Byzantines but only used for entertainment purposes. The Byzantine Emperor, Constantine Copronymous, sent an organ with other presents to King Pepin of France in 767 AD, and gradually it began to be used in Western churches. At first it was only used to softly accompany singing, but eventually it came to be played alone, to occupy the minds of those in church.

    In both East and West, church music was written in free rhythm to emphasize the meaning of the liturgical texts. Strictly metered music was only necessary when used for dancing, which requires a steady beat. So when metered music was first introduced into church services, even this caused scandal and was considered too worldly.

    BELOW ARE QUOTATIONS CONCERNING INSTRUMENTAL MUSIC IN CHURCH

    "Musical instruments are not used. The pipe, tabret, and harp here (in Alexandria, Egypt) are associated so intimately with the sensual heathen cults, as well as with the wild revelries and shameless performances of the degenerate theatre and circus, it is easy to understand the prejudices against their use in worship." (St. Augustine, 354 AD)

    "Although the Jews used lifeless instruments, together with dancing and clapping, in their worship, they did so because of their childish spiritual level. We Christians, however, have removed lifeless instruments and other things agreeable to children from our worship, and maintain simply singing." (St. Justin the Martyr, 139 AD)

    "Our Church (i.e., the LATIN Church) does not use musical instruments, such as harps and psalteries, to praise God, lest she revert to the practice of the Jews (meaning less spiritual worship)" (St. Thomas Aquinas 1250 AD).

    What does Benjamin Franklin, a Protestant, say about instruments in Church.

    "Instrumental music is permissable for a church under the following conditions:

    1. When a church has lost the Spirit of Christ.

    2. If a church only intends being fashionable in society, a mere place of amuzements (can anyone say "charismatic worship?" -- my note) and secular entertainment and abandoning the idea of religion and worship.

    3. If a church has within it a large number of dishonest and corrupt men.

    4. If a church has given up all idea of trying to convert the world."

    (Ben Franklin, editor of American Christian Review, 1760)
     
  2. Ps104_33

    Ps104_33
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2001
    Messages:
    4,005
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ed, you probably make a very good point. I have seen more controversy and division in Baptist churches over music that maybe no music is better. Just stick to the preaching of God's Word.
     
  3. Andrey

    Andrey
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2002
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gee, according to scripture, instruments were used in the Old Testament times to worship and praise God.

    According to scripture, instruments are being used in heaven to worship and praise God.

    Also according to scripture, there is nothing said about using instruments during the time of the New Testament.

    Well, two out of three say yes, the other abstains from a vote.

    Take that however you want. If God tells you to not use instruments in your church, DON'T.

    If God tells you to use them in your church, DO!

    <><
     
  4. CatholicConvert

    CatholicConvert
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    1,958
    Likes Received:
    0
    Psalms --

    Hey. If'n you are ever in Harrisburg on a Sunday, let me take you to hear a service done entirely in what is called "Rus plain chant". It is really beautiful and reverent. Some of the parts of the liturgy, like the Lord's Prayer written by the Russian composes Dimitrov, with numerous harmonies and parts, are just heavenly to hear!!

    Just of interest to you, the epistle and the Gospel reading for the day are also chanted, as well as the prayers, Nicene Creed, and the psalms when done as part of the Liturgy.

    This was one thing which very much intrigued me about the Orthodox worship praxis when I was leaving Protestantism. (Remember: I am not Roman rite -- I am Holy Orthodox in communion with Rome) I had always felt that worship should be quiet and reverent. Everything about the conduct of our Liturgy helps remind me that we have come into the presence of the King, who is also our loving Father in Heaven.

    Cordially in Christ,

    Brother Ed
     
  5. CatholicConvert

    CatholicConvert
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2001
    Messages:
    1,958
    Likes Received:
    0
    Andrey --

    I actually omitted some of the quotes for brevity's sake, but what I quoted had a purpose which you missed.

    The whole reason for which instruments were banned from the Early Church was specifically because their use was associated with worldliness and unspiritual activities.

    Kinda like (please excuse the expression) havin' church in a building used for a whorehouse the rest of the week. Just wouldn't be right now, would it?

    And looking at the state of most charismatic assemblies (of which I was a member for 4 years) I would say that entertainment and worldliness have a lot to do with them.

    I think that the point of music in Heaven is well made, however, that is there and here is here. The music in Heaven surely is uncorrupted by worldliness or being used for ignoble purposes. We just cannot say the same about music down here, can we?

    By the way, your last name isn't BERLIN, is it? I used to live in Norfolk a long time ago and knew a Mary Berlin who had a little girl with the same name you have.

    Maybe just a coincidence.

    Cordially in Christ,

    Brother Ed
     
  6. SolaScriptura in 2003

    SolaScriptura in 2003
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    398
    Likes Received:
    0
    CC, In Heb 8:4 the Scripture says that Christ "if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law" and also in Heb 7:14 this is further explained thus "For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Judah; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood." Jesus, although God, observed the silence of the Scriptures as authoritative. That is, that he didn't say "A descendant of Judah can be a priest because the Law doesn't specifically say 'A descendant of Judah shall not be a priest'." Rather, he realized that since Moses did not say they could, they couldn't. Doesn't this shed some light on the argument "God doesn't say 'thou shalt not play an instrument in the assembly,' so we can!"??
     
  7. Eladar

    Eladar
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2001
    Messages:
    3,012
    Likes Received:
    0
    CC,

    Are you sure you're not Church of Christ?
     
  8. faithcontender

    faithcontender
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    May 26, 2003
    Messages:
    395
    Likes Received:
    0
  9. MikeS

    MikeS
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2003
    Messages:
    873
    Likes Received:
    0
    Who does the multi-part music, the congregation or a choir?

    Indeed, Gregorian chant is also supposed to hold pride of place in the Roman rite, as was re-affirmed in Vatican II, but in the "spirit" of V-II, chant was instantly and completely abandoned. (Read on Peter Kreeft's website: God looked down upon the American [Catholic] Church and saw that it suffered no persecution, so He sent it liturgists.) One of the many areas where the clearly-stated guidelines of V-II were hijacked by both well-meaning and ill-meaning vandals, leaving us the four-hymn Mass as a sad substitute. (My wife, a long-time music minister, could talk your ear off about the real-world flaws of the four-hymn Mass!)
     

Share This Page

Loading...