Good for Baptist Women; SBC Still Not Listening

Very wise words tempered with genuine humility. Thanks

 

Folks that are equally conservative, equally believing in infallibility of scripture, equally devoted to Christ can fall out in two directions on this.

Some go to scripture to see if women can serve equally with men in the church as pastor. When they read Paul say a woman cannot usurp authority over a man or teach a man and then read the appeal to creation, it seems to them that the answer is no. Fair point.

Others read that same passage and ask those pesky who-what-when-where-why-how questions. They realize that to usurp authority is NOT what politically correct translations appeasing tradition assume. It is NOT "be in authority" but more "run up and grab authority out of the man's hand." They realize that the "who" Paul spoke to were folks coming out of goddess worship, where it was taught THE MEN could not serve equally with women in the temple. Where it was taught that women were created first. Where only the women could teach "with authority."

So they understand that Paul is NOT answering the question "can a woman serve as pastor or teacher equally with men" but rather "can a man serve equally with women in those roles?" They see that answered as of course he can.

Many of them do not see the pastor role as authority, but servanthood. And they do not see it as "usurping" authority for a church to confer authority on a woman.

So for them, their stand for women's ordination is a stand FOR, not against the Bible.

But one thing is for sure--scripture tells us there will be things we will disagree on. It tells us some will be vegetarians for Jesus and some will eat meat. It tells us some will regard every day the same and others will keep holidays. It challenges us to leave the judging up to God, for both on either side are serving Him the best they know how. And it tells us to let each be fully convinced in their own mind and so live, for whatever is not of faith is sin.

So whichever side you fall out on, I support your decision to live accordingly, and trust you will give such grace to those that disagree with you.

Because BOTH sides believe "God said it, I believe it, and that settles it."

 

I'm so happy YOU said this, because that's exactly what you're trying to do.

 

I am siding with the women on this one.

And, noooo, I am not a "liberal" at all. I am Evangelical all the way.


The reason I take this view is because I believe the scriptures support...

Women in ministry
Women in secular leadership
Women in leadership over men
Women evangelists
Women pastors

 

So you don't believe God made man first and gave him headship over the home and spiritual things. God placed on man the responsibilty for the home and spiritual things, God has never changed His mind.

Just because women have gained more and more rights and deservedly so the fact still remains Adam was formed first and given responsibilty for home and the spiritual needs of that family. God the Holy Spirit through Paul commanded a woman not to usurp authority over a man nor to teach a man. Saying it was for just that time is changing nature and changing Gods plan.

 

I disagree. The argument that Paul made was not cultural. As has been pointed out, Paul appealed to God's Word, God's creation and the fall as the reason God had appointed men to serve as Elders and why women cannot teach or have authority over men in the church. The passage is very clear.

The word "discrimination" carries a lot of baggage. It conjures images of injustice and violence. I don't think it is appropriate to compare the issue of women pastors with slavery and the civil rights movement.

The teaching of Jesus Christ, and the bible, have done more to elevate the position of women in the world than any other thing in history, imho.

Clearly, scripture teaches that women have equal standing before God, that they are of equal worth, that they are fellow laborers for the cause of Christ in the world.

Scripture also teaches that God has decreed male leadership within the church. That should not be ignored.

I am a big believer in Christian liberty. I believe Holy Spirit will convict true believers of error and bring them to a knowledge of the truth. I have, myself, experienced the same conviction and changed my mind on a number of issues including women as deacons (favor), the death penalty (against)... and there are several issues I'm still not sure about. Every time I have changed my mind it was based on the clear teaching of scripture.

On this issue, however, I am sure. Scripture is quite clear. The only way avoid obeying it is to dismiss it as culturally centered teaching, imho.

That kind of reasoning leads to all sorts of apostacy coming into the church, including h*mos*xual marriage/pastors who make the same kind of arugments to dismiss the passages concerning their issues. That is why these issues are often linked in those churches.

When we stand before God, it will not matter what position we held in the church. What will matter is our relationship to Him and if we were obedient to His commands... if we were faithful stewards of the gifts He gave to us.

Jesus prayed that those who follow Him would be sanctified (separated) by the truth. He said "your Word is truth". It is the Word of God that separates us from the world. We must be careful what we dismiss as no longer culturally relevant.

peace to youraying:

 

Kudos!!!!!:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

Nodak,

not really.......God said it, that settles it...whether you believe it or not


The scripture is clear. you and jaigner are departing from it ..explaining it away as not valid for today.....but that is error.

 

Amen! :thumbs: