Has anyone as of yet compiled an exhaustive list of diff. between the 1611/1769?

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Spoudazo, Mar 21, 2005.

  1. Spoudazo

    Spoudazo
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2005
    Messages:
    500
    Likes Received:
    0
    It would be very time consuming indeed, but might would be helpful to some of our bretheren who misapply inerrancy [​IMG]
     
  2. robycop3

    robycop3
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2000
    Messages:
    7,573
    Likes Received:
    10
    Logos 1560 is working on it.
     
  3. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/Ed.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,715
    Likes Received:
    0
    Yes.
    One could probably search this forum
    including the archives and find many
    of the variants.

    BTW, there is variants among the KJV1769s as well
    as among the KJV1611s [​IMG]
     
  4. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/Ed.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,715
    Likes Received:
    0
    Consider this list of variants among the
    KJV1769s:

    http://www.biblebelievers.com/believers-org/counterfeit-kjv.html

    Believers Beware of Counterfeit King James Bibles

    QUICK CHECK LIST WHEN BUYING A KING JAMES BIBLE

    Scripture Reference
    The Real Bible
    Counterfeit

    GENESIS 1:1
    heaven
    heavens

    GENESIS 1:2
    Capital S (Spirit)
    lower case s (spirit)

    GENESIS 8:1
    asswaged
    assuaged

    GENESIS 11:3
    throughly
    thoroughly

    GENESIS 11:3
    morter
    mortar

    GENESIS 12:1
    shew
    show

    GENESIS 21:26
    to day
    today

    GENESIS 23:8
    intreat
    entreat

    GENESIS 24:57
    enquire
    inquire

    GENESIS 30:37
    chesnut
    chestnut

    GENESIS 31:42
    labour
    labor

    GENESIS 41:38
    Capital S (Spirit)
    lower case s (spirit)

    EXODUS 8:23
    to morrow
    tomorrow

    EXODUS 24:6
    basons
    basins

    EXODUS 25:30
    shewbread
    showbread

    EXODUS 25:30
    alway
    always

    LEVITICUS 25:9
    jubile
    jubilee

    NUMBERS 10:25
    rereward
    rearward

    NUMBERS 22:26
    further
    farther

    1 SAMUEL 18:6
    musick
    music

    PSALMS 149:6
    twoedged
    two-edged

    ISAIAH 59:17
    cloke
    cloak

    MATTHEW 1:19
    publick
    public

    MATTHEW 4:1
    Capital S (Spirit)
    lower case s (spirit)

    LUKE 2:11
    Saviour
    Savior

    PHILIPPIANS 3:17
    ensample
    example

    1 TIMOTHY 6:20
    so called
    so-called

    JAMES 4:14
    vapour
    vapor
     
  5. David J

    David J
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 21, 2004
    Messages:
    796
    Likes Received:
    0
    LOL! I say beware anything other than the AV1611!
     
  6. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards
    Expand Collapse
    <img src=/Ed.gif>

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    15,715
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Geneva Bible is the only TRUE ENGLISH
    BIBLE [​IMG]
    Psa 12:6-7 (Geneva Bible 1567):
    The wordes of the Lord are pure wordes, as the siluer, tried in a fornace of earth, fined seuen folde.
    7 Thou wilt keepe them, O Lord: thou wilt preserue him from this generation for euer.

    Oops, maybe the "HIM" doesn't refer to
    the "wordes of the Lord"?
     
  7. Logos1560

    Logos1560
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,127
    Likes Received:
    2
    I presently have a list of 1880 numbered differences between the 1611 edition of the KJV and the present Oxford KJV edition in the Scofield Reference Bible. My numbered list is of "changes of sound" like those that D. A. Waite claimed to list. His list included only 421 differences.

    I also include in my list several other interesting differences that I did not number such as some printing errors "aud" for "and", some examples of "Spirit" verses "spirit," "God" verses "GOD," "LORD" verses "Lord," "blew" for "blue," "pray" for "prey," "fouler" for "fowler," etc.

    I include in my list some examples of change of spelling of proper names that likely changed the sound, but I did not count them in my count:
    "Rehu" for "Reu," "Bilham" for "Bilhan," "Geshan" for "Gesham," etc.

    I did count a few differences in proper names.
    Waite in his count had included the change of "Zoar" to "Jezoar" (1 Chron. 4:7) and the change of "Apollo" to "Apollos" (1 Cor. 1:12)
    although he missed some of the times it was changed. Some examples of changes in proper names I counted were the change of "Marie" to "Mary" several times, the change of "Jehoash" to "Joash" (2 Kings 12:19-20), the change of "Joakim" to "Jehoiakim" (1 Chron. 3:15-16),
    and "Beth-leem" to "Beth-lehem" (Micah 5:2).
     
  8. Logos1560

    Logos1560
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,127
    Likes Received:
    2
    Here are some books that list many of the differences:

    D. A. Waite has a booklet that lists the 421 changes of sound that he found.

    F. H. A. Scrivener's book THE AUTHORIZED EDITION OF THE ENGLISH BIBLE (1611), ITS SUBSEQUENT REPRINTS AND MODERN REPRESENTATIVES has a long list in his appendixes A and C, and more are referred to in the text of his book.

    The new 2005 book entitled A TEXTUAL HISTORY OF THE KING JAMES BIBLE by David Norton is said to be based on "study of roughly 1,550 significant variations" [that includes 376 in the Apocrypha]
    (p. 30). Norton's book has an Appendix 1 that lists "Printer's errors in the first edition"
    (6 pages), Appendix 2 lists "First and second edition variations" (7 pages), appendix 4 is a "selective collation of the 1613 folio with the first and second editions," appendix 5 "a selective collation of the 1617 folio with the first and second editions," and appendix 8 with "Variant readings in the KJB text" (pp. 198-355)
     
  9. Dr. Bob

    Dr. Bob
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2000
    Messages:
    29,402
    Likes Received:
    12
    Beware the AV1611, too!!

    I John 5:12 AV1611"Hee that hath the Sonne, hath life; and hee that hath not the Sonne, hath not life."

    I John 5:12 KJV1769 "He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life."

    Or maybe it WASN'T the AV1611 that took away the deity of Christ; maybe it was the KJV that added and expansion of piety.
     
  10. Spoudazo

    Spoudazo
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2005
    Messages:
    500
    Likes Received:
    0
    Logos, can you email that list to me, or should I just get it from that 2005 book you mentioned you think? [​IMG] Thanks [​IMG]
     
  11. Logos1560

    Logos1560
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,127
    Likes Received:
    2
    Spoudazo, my file with the list has 39 pages.
    If I sent it, it would have to be as an attached file. If you will send me a pm that has your email address, I will send you an email with that
    file atttached.
     
  12. rsr

    rsr
    Expand Collapse
    <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    10,073
    Likes Received:
    101
  13. Keith M

    Keith M
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2002
    Messages:
    2,024
    Likes Received:
    0
    For anyone interested in seeing the differences for yourself, you can do a parallel comparison at the StudyLight.org web site.
     
  14. Logos1560

    Logos1560
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,127
    Likes Received:
    2
    If someone wants to do their own comparison, here are some suggestions for starting places.

    You can make use of the list of differences/changes found in Scrivener's
    book THE AUTHORIZED EDITION OF THE ENGLISH BIBLE
    or the list in David Norton's A TEXTUAL HISTORY OF THE KING JAMES BIBLE.

    Another suggestion is to compare a regular Strong's CONCORDANCE with THE STRONGEST STRONG'S
    that is based on the 1873 Cambridge edition of the KJV edited by Scrivener. Since Scrivener went back to many 1611 renderings, a comparison of THE STRONGEST STRONG'S with other Strong's
    will point out a number of changes. If you look
    up the verses in any STRONG'S for the word "than,"
    you will find "then" in the 1611 at all these verses.

    It is a good ideal to make use of the searchable
    online 1611 edition.

    If you try only to compare the two editions side by side, looking back and forward you will likely overlook a good number of the actual differences.
     
  15. Logos1560

    Logos1560
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2004
    Messages:
    3,127
    Likes Received:
    2
    In his 1985 booklet AV1611 COMPARED TO TODAY'S KJV, D. A. Waite wrote that he "tried to record them all" (p. 4). He did acknowledge that he "might have missed a place or two throughout the course of the Bible" (p. 4).

    Waite recommend to others that use his count when he wrote: "You tell them about the mere 136 changes of substance plus 285 minor changes of form only. Argue them down" (DEFENDING THE KJB, p. 244).

    David Cloud wrote that "Dr. Donald Waite has published an exhaustive comparison of the 1611 edition of the King James Bible and the modern editions of the King James Bible" (EXAMINING "THE KING JAMES ONLY CONTROVERSY", p. 73). Cloud claimed that Waite "has tallied and categorized every change and has shown us exactly what the differences are" (p. 73).

    Actually, Waite compared only one modern edition (the Oxford edition in the Scofield Reference Bible) to the 1611. Waite did not compare all the varying present-day editions of the KJV. In addition, Waite failed by a big margin to tally every change.
     

Share This Page

Loading...