Hebrews 6:4-6

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by John3v36, Aug 29, 2002.

  1. John3v36

    John3v36
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    Hebrews 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

    [ August 29, 2002, 01:25 AM: Message edited by: John3v36 ]
     
  2. FearNot

    FearNot
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    What this verse is mentioning is that a belieer can fall into a situation of constant sin, say for example gossip, drinking to excess, etc. We are to approach them as loving brothers or sisters in Christ and speaking to them about this sin, using the biblical example I believe is in Matthew. We are to show them where they are erroring and try to bring them back to a healthy Christ like walk. Urge them to correct their behavior. urge them to repent basically.
     
  3. Uncle AlaGator

    Uncle AlaGator
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    Where at in Matthew, do you know?
     
  4. John3v36

    John3v36
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    How did you get that from Hebrews 6:4-6? :confused:

    Where in Matthew, do you find the example :confused: ?

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  5. Ernie Brazee

    Ernie Brazee
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    Hebrews 6 says nothing about a person being saved it says "enlightened", which simply means they were informed of the truth and knowledge. They then refused to obey the Holy Spirit's call to salvation. Yes, the Bible says my spirit will not always strive with man. It is a dangerous thing for man to reject God's word.

    Genesis 6
    3 And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years.


    God make the rules not man. We may not like what God says, we may think it unfair, but what we think matters not. What God says he has already done. [​IMG]

    [ August 30, 2002, 09:09 AM: Message edited by: Ernie Brazee ]
     
  6. Scott_Bushey

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    Hi Ernie,
    keep in mind, these that were enlightened partook of:
    1) Enlightenment
    2)"Tasted" of the heavenly gift
    3) Partakers of the Holy Ghost
    4) Tasted the good word of God and Powers of the world to come

    * These are believers.........they had repented. The scripture states that they would not be able to be (again) "renewed" unto repentance, implying that they had previously repented.

    From a biblical perspective, it is impossible to lose one's salvation. This is exactly what this scripture is exhorting, as if it were not impossible, one would then *recrucify* the Lord of all creation, over and over again......this is just not possible or true. He died once, and has risen!

    [ August 30, 2002, 09:18 AM: Message edited by: Scott Bushey ]
     
  7. hrhema

    hrhema
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    I have read some commentaries which state that the Book of Hebrews were written to Jewish believers. Therefore Paul was warning the Jews about falling away back into Judaism. This was denying Christ, trampling on his blood and recrucifying him afresh and putting him to shame.

    THose who left Judaism and embraced Christianity often faced horrible exclusion from their families including being disowned. Many would return to Judaism because of this. Many believed this was an insult to Christ. So did those who went back into Judaism after Believing in Christ and denied he was the Messiah, the son of God keep their salvation or lose it?
     
  8. Scott_Bushey

    Scott_Bushey
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    Hrhema,
    We have beat this dead horse before so I will not again take out the switch.........

    John clearly states:
    1 John 2:19
    They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

    Also.........How do you know Paul wrote Hebrews???
    This is not proven. It may be a theory, but it is not a fact. I might add, Paul was sent by Christ to the Gentile nation, not the Jew.

    [ August 30, 2002, 09:40 AM: Message edited by: Scott Bushey ]
     
  9. Scott J

    Scott J
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    Verses 1-3 set the context for this passage. There the author says he wants to leave the discussion of elementary teachings such as repentance, baptism, laying on of hands, and eternal judgment. In verses 4-6, he explains why. For if someone is already saved preaching those things will not be edifying. They cannot be re-saved since that would be equivalent to re-crucifying Christ.

    I personally don't see a strong statement about backsliding nor anything that would prove that you can lose your salvation.

    Two key words in vss. 4-6 limit the application, "impossible" and "if". We know through other scriptures that God's ability to forgive and redeem is not limited so "impossible" makes it clear that the eternal loss of salvation is not the issue. "If" points to a possible situation that is made impossible by directly tying the falling away to crucifying Christ again.
     
  10. John3v36

    John3v36
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    Amen [​IMG]
    Thats a hard verse to get around. [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  11. Graceforever

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    If they fall away from grace, IT IS IMPOSSIBLE for them to repent… Because, you can only be saved by grace…. There’s no other name given where a man must be saved…. If they count the blood of Jesus unworthy to save them, then they are lost…. It is impossible for them to find redemption in any other way… They knew the way of salvation, but they chose not to except it….

    Recently I was listening to an Adrian Rogers sermon…. He was telling of a scientist that admitted that there was no other way that the universe could have been created, except there was a God…. There is no other way, he said, but I reject that there is a God…. This is a man that knows that there is a God, in his mind, but still rejects God in his heart… IMO, that is a prime example of what that verse in Hebrews is speaking of…
     
  12. Graceforever

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    If you take this verse (in Hebrews) to mean that you can lose your eternal salvation…. I’m afraid that according to your belief, you, or no one else can be saved…. If your interpretation is true, if you can fall away, then it is impossible for you to be saved again, because it would mean that Jesus would have to come a second time and shed his blood anew…….. You will probably admit that this isn’t going to happen…. So, you must believe that you would have to live a perfect life in order to be saved….

    Not so folks, Jesus don’t have to be sacrificed once a year, like in the animal sacrifices… He is resting from his finished work of redemption…. It is now up to you to trust in his finished work…. If you don’t trust Jesus’ work on the cross to be powerful enough to save you from your past, present and future sins, then I feel sorry for you… You will have to go by the letter of the law in order for you to be saved, and if you fail in the very least point of the law, you are guilty of the whole law….If you trust in the letter of the law to save you, which is what you are saying, then you have fallen from grace…. Not me, I put my trust in my redeemer… Jesus is my propitiation, my adversary, that will stand in my place on the day of judgement….
     
  13. Terry_Herrington

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    This is, truly, a difficult passage to interpet. I do not have a satifsactory answer to what it means. I do not believe that a Christian can every be lost, so I don't believe this is talking about a true Christian falling away from salvation.

    I, up till now, have belived that it is talking about a person who goes along with the Holy Spirit and then finally rejects Christ's finished work on Calvary, once for all. Now, I am not sure that this is correct.

    It seems to me to be possibly talking about a saved person who falls short of entering into the rest that God has for them. Therefore the works (not for salvation, but because of salvation) that they have done is lost and they can never get the lost opportunities back again.

    Please, don't gang up on me about this. I am not saying that this is absolutely correct, just a theory.

    If I were forced, at this present time, to make a judgment about these difficult verses, I would say that it is referring to a person who falls short of salvation and totally rejects the finished work of our wonderful Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. :D :D :D
     
  14. tyndale1946

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    I think the key to the verse is powers of the world to come. Some would read this and say this is talking about those falling away and losing their Salvation. I agree with what Scott Bushey said also somewhat of what Hrhema said. We must realize that something was going out... The Law Worship and something was coming in... The Grace Dispensation. Remember the admonishion from Paul to the Galatian brethren... Galatians 3:1 O foolish Galatians who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?... Then Paul berates the brethren that have left the faith and had fallen back under the law worship. God soon after ended the law worship and destroyed the temple and everything associated with it. The power of the world to come was the Kingdom of God as Jesus Christ was a type and shadow of the temple and the law worship. Just as John The Baptist declared repent ye for the Kingdom Of Heaven is at hand... If it was at hand it was just around the corner at that time. Since they were believers they only lost the joy of their Salvation... Not their blood bought Salvation!... Brother Glen [​IMG]
     
  15. FearNot

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    Just return to read this thread and found I was asked some questions.

    The text in Matthew is chapter 18:15-20. This text is commonly used for church discipline. The word here for sin is translated one who keeps missing the mark in his reklationship with God. As you read you will see the procedure how it should be done.

    How did I get what I said out of the Heb 6:4-6 text?
    Once a person fully surrenders their life to God, no one can take them away from Him. So if they are in the light and are true believers they cannot all of a sudden be earased from the lamb's book of life. That being known, a believer can still be a sinner, we are all sinners accept Christ. A believer can fall into sin, repeated sin, like I gave the examples of sins one might become prey too. A believer is to live a holy Christ like life. Fellow believers are to help that person see their sin and help lead them back to a healthy walk (Matt. 18:15-20, Matt. 18:12-14, II Cor. 13:1-10, James 5:19-20) Restoration is to be done to help them, not condemn them. Only the Lord can judge/condemn.
     

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