Hebrews 6:4-6?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by robycop3, Nov 12, 2006.

  1. robycop3

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    Hebrews 6:4It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, 5who have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age, 6if they fall away, to be brought back to repentance, becauseto their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.

    Do YOU believe these verses as written, that they tell us that it's possible to lose salvation by rejecting Christ after having come to Him? Or is there another meaning?

    It appears V 5-6 are describing a Christian.
     
  2. gb93433

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    The history behind that passage is that they were a group of people vacillating back and forth between Judaism and Christianity. They were immature.
     
  3. drfuss

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    The verse means it is possible for the Hebrew Christains to forfeit (not lose) their salvation by deciding to stop trusting Christ as savior and go back to trusting in Judism.
     
  4. annsni

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    I've understood it as someone who has changed their life to live as a Christian but did not truly give their life over to Christ. Note the words "enlightened" (their minds opened to the truth), "tasted the heavenly gift" (tasting doesn't mean fully consuming - they only had a taste of it), "shared in the Holy Spirit" (doesn't say 'filled with the Holy Spirit'), and "tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the coming age" (again, tasting, not consuming). It seems like someone who 'dabbles' in God and does not become a new creation.

    Ann
     
  5. LeBuick

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    I primarily believe Paul is saying that everyone in the Church isn't saved. Specifically he was addressing the Jewish tendancy to bring Judiasm into Christianity. It was as if they reached out one hand to Jesus but kept hold to Judiasm with the other hand. On one hand they wanted to believe in salvation by faith but with the other hand, to be safe, we better kill some sheep and bulls.

    So as you watch Paul come into this verse, he first let's us know Christ is the High Priest (somewhere around 4:14). He then talks about the monistry of our high priest. Now he is approaching the subject of you can't straddle the fence, you either put all your trust and hope in our high priest or you continue with the high priest of the Jews.

    In the first century there were Pagan's who tasted Christianity and returned to Paganism. Today there are those who tast Christianity and return to their previous unbelief...

    I don't believe this passage is spicifially speaking of back sliders, but people who have tried or tasted christianity but decided it was not enough, not true or tried to make Christianity into something other than Christ intended. It is not that they can't be restored, I believe Paul is saying they won't be restored because they have chosen to harden their hearts against Christ. It is not impossible for God to forgive them; rather, it is impossible for them to be forgiven because they won't repent of their sins, take God at his word, or totally commit to Christ.
     
    #5 LeBuick, Nov 12, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 12, 2006
  6. KJVO

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    That verse applies to the tribulation, It is not in any way to us today.
    Simple.. Just like God wanted it. Easy to understand
     
  7. Amy.G

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    Huh? :confused:
     
  8. KJVO

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    Hebrews 6:4-6

    Amy,
    The Books of the Bible from Hebrews ( notice the name ) to Jude are written FOR those that are left behind after the rapture. We are to read and learn from these books but doctrinally it is not meant FOR us no more than applying Levitical law to the believer today. To apply these TO us today will keep you confused about your Bible.

    For instance all the lost people I know will confess that Jesus is the Son of God,are they saved?

    1 John 4:15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God
    dwelleth in him, and he in God.
     
    #8 KJVO, Nov 12, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 12, 2006
  9. LeBuick

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    John is not discussing salvation. God is with them but not as their savior but as something they have knowldge of.

    Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
     
  10. KJVO

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    Not wanting to hi jack this thread but he does not say God is with them but God is in them.
     
  11. LeBuick

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    Point taken...
     
  12. annsni

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    And you learned this from where???? Do you have any proof of this?

    Ann
     
  13. KJVO

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    Hebrews 6:4-6

    Just reading my Bible, Who is speaking and who they are talking to.

    There are way to many contridictions in the New Test. to say all of it was written to us. Jesus spoke in the Gospels to the Jews about preparing for the Kingdom of Heaven coming shortly , which they rejected and the message in the Pauline epistles contradicts many of His teachings to them while Hebrews to Jude does not. It is back to how it was before they rejected Him.
    I have to go and eat supper with my inlaws now wont be back probably until tomorrow night after work.
    I am not wanting to take over this thread that is SOOO rude. Please feel free tp email me if you need more.
    Hugh (KJVO)
     
  14. Ed Edwards

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  15. Ed Edwards

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    OSAS Proof Text

    The example of Reducto-absurdem (RA) in Hebrews 6:4-6:

    Heb 6:4-6 (KJV1611 Edition):
    For it is impossible for

    those who were once inlightned,
    and haue tasted of the heauenly gift,
    and were made partakers of the holy Ghost,
    5 And haue tasted the good word of God,
    and the powers of the world to come;

    6 If they shall fall away,
    to renue them againe vnto repentance:

    seeing they crucifie to themselues the Sonne of God afresh,
    and put him to an open shame.

    INTRODUCITON TO THE R/A,
    STATEMENT OF INTENTION:
    For it is impossible for

    THE TRUE PROPOSITIONS (STATEMENTS):
    those who were once inlightned,
    and haue tasted of the heauenly gift,
    and were made partakers of the holy Ghost,
    5 And haue tasted the good word of God,
    and the powers of the world to come;

    THE PROPOSITION (STATEMENT) TO BE PROVED FALSE:
    6 If they shall fall away, to renue them againe vnto repentance:

    THE THEN PORTION (THE CONCLUSION)
    THAT LOGICALLY FOLLOWS THOSE IF PROPOSITIONS:
    seeing they crucifie to themselues the Sonne of God afresh,
    and put him to an open shame.


    THE MISSING PARTS OF THE ARGUMENT:

    Of course, it is obsurd that Jesus will not be crucified
    again nor shamed. So the proposition to be proved
    false:
    6 If they shall fall away, to renue them againe vnto repentance:
    has been proved, the saved cannot fall away from salvation.

    However, I note about 1/3 of the New Testament is advice on
    how to live like a Christ-one, act like a Christ-one, talk
    like a Christ-one, be a Christ-one. So let us encourage one another
    to walk like a Christian, talk like a Christian, hope like a Christian.
     
  16. Brother Bob

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    Just showing how impossible it is to fall from Grace.
     
  17. annsni

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    If you get a chance, can you post any of the contradictions? I see so much written in the letters for believers here and now and I don't think that the idea of these books being written for the end times has been a widespread belief. Atleast in all my years, and my DH's studies, we've never seen it. If you'd like, we can start another thread.
     
  18. Ed Edwards

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    Amen, Brother Brother Bob -- Preach it! :thumbs:
     
  19. LeBuick

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    Sorry Ed and all, without thinking I resurrected the old thread. It had my blood boiling especially with the long hypothosis of JArthor... Now that was a big IF.
     
  20. KJVO

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    Hebrews 6:4-6


    Ok give me a while to get them up, I do not type well so I am going to do it on another document then copy and paste the list here. I will email you then ok?
     

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