How were people saved in the OT?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by deacon jd, Nov 3, 2006.

  1. deacon jd

    deacon jd
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    I wanted to start a thread on the topic of salvation in the Old Testament. It seems that there are some different views on the topic and I would like to hear from anyone who would like to discuss the subject. I personally believe that there was salvation in the Old Testament by faith in the coming Messiah, but I hear many who say that there wasn't and that Jesus had to go and preach to the souls of the departed Old Testament saints so that they to could be saved, and I have even heard a few people say that the Old Testament saints were saved by keeping the law. I am looking forward to hearing from you on this subject.
     
  2. PASTOR MHG

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    OT saints were saved the same way NT saints are saved.

    They were saved by GRACE through FAITH in the TRUTH that was revealed to them.

    That is not to say that they were saved by grace through faith in the DEATH, BURIAL, and RESURRECTION of Jesus Christ (1 Corinthians 15).
     
  3. Jim1999

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    The Bible is the story of redemption. The Old looks forward to the cross, as shown clearly in Isa and in Job, whilst the Newer believers look back to the cross. It is all in the redeeming work of Christ and the grace of God.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  4. Baptist Believer

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    That's right. Paul explained that we share the faith of Abraham, and he is our model for salvation. He was saved, not because he had the Law of Moses or a lot of information about God, but because he placed his faith in God.

    Exactly.

    Sure they were. They just didn't have all the information yet. Everyone who has been saved has been saved through the provision of God in Christ. Many were saved before the event (as we regard time) and many are being saved now.
     
  5. deacon jd

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    So far we all agree. Isn't it great to discuss a topic on which we all agree!
     
  6. DeeJay

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    For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.”
    Romans 4:3
     
  7. J. Jump

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    I would agree that they were saved by grace through faith. The faith part is what differs from the OT to the NT. I think it is very difficult to build a case that all OT folks were saved based on a looking forward to the cross of Christ however.

    And I would disagree that a NT believer (after the actual death of Christ) is saved by believing in the resurrection. It is only death and shed blood and belief that it was done on your behalf by the Spotless Lamb of God Jesus Christ that results in spiritual salvation.

    Believing in the resurrection is for what happens after spiritual salvation has been given.

    I think the NT (especially the Gospel accounts) would be a lot better understood if folks would realize that those that were being dealt with in the Gospel accounts were saved individuals instead of seeing them as what we were before salvation. But maybe that's another thread :)
     
  8. AntennaFarmer

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    Yes! Faith.

    And

    For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: And though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God: Job 19:25, 26
     
  9. Baptist Believer

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    Yes.

    For the record, I don't believe that. The Old Testament saints trusted God. The New Testament saints also trust God -- and they/we have more information regarding the means that God chose to use.

    Yes.

    Yes.

    Yes.

    We are not saved by a formula, a prayer or a series of actions - we are saved by God, because of His mercy, when we cast our faith on Him. The process is not initiated by us, empowered by us, or sustained by us. It is a work of God in which He allows our cooperation.
     
  10. Jim1999

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    Salvation is progressive, culminated in Christ when we are totally justified. Hence it is the same in the Old Testament,they looked forward to the cross, and we look back at the cross.

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  11. av1611jim

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    JJump says:
    "Believing in the resurrection is for what happens after spiritual salvation has been given"

    I will have to disagree.
    Ro 10:9
    That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

    What do you do with that?
     
  12. J. Jump

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    Great question. Who was the audience in Romans 10? The answer is "saved" folks. So what was Paul getting at by telling saved folks that if they would confess the Lord Jesus with their mouth and believe in their heart that God hath raied him from the dead they would be saved.

    This is a belief in Jesus as the Annointed One . . . the Messiah . . . the King. This is Jesus as the Christ or Lord. This verse speaks to the saving of the soul, which can only happen after spiritual salvation has taken place. Lordship comes after spiritual salvation.

    All the OT pictures that we have of salvation are always and only death and shed blood. It is the same in the NT.

    The disciples didn't even believe in the resurrection until after it happened and the saying of Jesus that He would raise the temple again in three days was brought back to their memory and they understood.

    Spiritual salvation comes when someone has faith in Jesus as the Lamb, not Jesus as the Christ.

    Hope that helps.
     
  13. Soulman

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  14. deacon jd

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    Why do some people believe that Jesus had to go and preach to the Old Testament saints if they were already saved? I have never understood this.
     
  15. Humblesmith

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    It's a speculation on their part. The scripture never clearly says this.
     
  16. Jim1999

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    The resurrection is what makes the sacrifice of blood differ from other sects and Old Testament sacrfices, including lambs and such. The old blood sacrifices were but symbols of things to come. Job, prolly the oldest written book of the Old Testament shows clearly that Job looked forward to the day when His God would stand on the face of the earth and he would see God (the resurrection) in Job's own flesh.

    By faith, Abraham..................

    Cheers,

    Jim
     
  17. Linda64

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    But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. (John 20:31)

    Is Christ divided? If you don't believe that Jesus is the Christ/Messiah (the Annointed One), you have no saving faith--therefore you do not have spiritual salvation.

    Peter's confession in Matthew 16:

    And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. (Matthew 16:16)

    And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. (Matthew 16:17)

    And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. (Matthew 16:18)

    Christ built His Church upon the rock of Peter's testimony that Jesus was the Christ--did He not?

    For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. (Romans 10:13)


    What does calling on the "name of the Lord" mean? To me, it means the Lord Jesus Christ. Salvation is very simple--you, on the other hand, make it complex.

    And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house. (Acts 16:31)
     
  18. J. Jump

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    Well you continue to believe that if you want to. How is believing on the Lamb of God as my Substitute becuase I am a sinner complex? There is nothing complex about that. Believe and you will be saved. That's about as uncomplex as one can make it.

    You and others are the ones that complicate the simple Gospel of grace by trying to add in Lordship. Why not just let the Bible speak for Itself instead of trying to make it say what you want it to say?
     
  19. Linda64

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    The Lord Jesus Christ IS the "Lamb of God which taketh away the sin of the world." What you are saying is that one only gets saved by believing in the "Lamb of God" and NOT Jesus as the Christ. He is Prophet, Priest, and King. Believing on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ is NOT Lordship salvation. However, salvation does not mean that once you are saved you can just continue with the old life and do as you please. (Romans 6:1-2) Salvation brings change--which is only by the power of the Holy Spirit. However, holy living should be a way of life for a saved person--Jesus said:

    If ye love me, keep my commandments. (John 14:15)

     
    #19 Linda64, Nov 4, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 4, 2006
  20. KJVO

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    sorry having trouble posting
     
    #20 KJVO, Nov 5, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 5, 2006

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