Hypothetical Situation

I don't know if you read my posts on the subject of church discipline, but no one is suggesting what you are saying here.

 

Hello Joe,

Thanks for your kind words. No I am not a pastor. I have been a Christian for about 32 years and I have the privilege of having both a Bible College undergraduate degree in Biblical Studies and the History of Ideas (double major), and a seminary education from Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary. Now I am working, searching, and waiting to see what kind of ministry position the Lord has in store for me.

 

You miss the point of church discipline completely. Every step of the church discipline process as outlined in Matt. 18:15-20 is designed to reconcile the sinning brother or sister first to Christ and then to His church. The goal is always to reconcile and restore right relationship. The goal is not to "drive away people with sin in their lives." No one has suggested such a thing. However, the Scripture is clear that if there comes a point at the final stage of the church discipline process where the erring brother or sister has repeatedly refused to listen, repent, and reconcile the church is to consider that person as an unbeliever.

Are unbelievers not welcomed into the church to hear the gospel? I certainly was an unbeliever all those years ago when I heard a preacher preach the gospel at church and realized that I needed Christ as my Savior.

When the church treats a person who has been through church discipline (and refused to listen, repent, and reconcile) as an unbeliever we can no longer allow them to take communion and we remove their name from the church roll (gasp), we still share the gospel with them and minister to them just as we would any other unsaved person. Again, even at this point the goal is to see the person reconciled to Christ by the power of the gospel and restored to church membership. So I am not sure where you got the idea that the Scripture (Matt. 18:15-20) or I are talking about "driving people away."

Now the person who has gone through the church discipline process and remains unrepentant may chose to leave (not come around the church anymore). That is their choice. However, it would be untrue to say that the church "drove them away." Their sin led them astray and away and they willingly followed rather than listen, repent, and reconcile.

 

I think a better wording would have been "From a human perspective she thought that she finally had to look elsewhere for support and comfort.

Quote:
Mat 5:27 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:
Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.

He described a higher standard than the OT standard. Has anyone here looked at another woman/man and lusted after them? I have. So those of us who have done this are in the same position as this woman.

Perhaps I should say that those of us who have merely lusted in our hearts have broken Christ's commandment as much as this woman had broken it. That's how I interpret this verse. I find it difficult to interpret it otherwise.

The law is not of tantamount concern. Abiding in Christ which requires repentance of our sins is the most important thing.

I agree. Jhn 8:11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.


My take is that this woman needs some Christian and Christian counsel, not a trial by her peers.

Basically, yes I am saying that the previous posts emphasize her guilt. Go back and read them and I think you'll agree that there's not a lot of forgiveness or support shown.

She needs a friend who can accept her as she is and help her heal from her failed marriage.

I'm simply saying that real people in really difficult human situations need Christian support, perhaps from her pastor. I certainly won't argue with her need for repentance or salvation as the case might be.

Agreed. I'm not really talking about waiting for healing. I'm talking about support in going through this process. Jesus is our best friend but a fellow Christian friend can also help quite a bit.

 

I'm not sure if you are talking about superwoman8977 or her friend from church that is going through a divorce and is pregnant with another man's child. One thing I would point out here is that I (we) can not forgive either one of these ladies. They have not sinned against me (us). Therefore, they have no need to seek forgiveness from me (us) and I (we) have nothing to forgive them for doing. As I pointed out in my posts they need to repair their relationship with Christ, obey His word, and be reconciled to Him. The most supportive thing any of us can do for them here is give them godly biblical Christian counsel, speak the truth in love by pointing out where we see error, and call them to repentance and reconciliation with the Lord.

As far as helping the "hypothetical" lady none of us are in any position to do so. First, she is not here posting in person (the information we have is coming second hand through superwoman8977). Second, she needs a mature Christian lady (or group of ladies) from her church to counsel and guide her back into right relationship with the Lord. Third, this same lady (or group of ladies and a pastor) need to help her understand the biblical call for her to be willing to reconcile with her husband (even under the current circumstances) if he will repent of his adultery and be reconciled to her (Matt. 18:15-20). If he refuses then she would be free to divorce him due to his adultery and abandonment (Matt. 5:31-32, 19:9; and 1 Cor 7:13-15).

Agreed. However, I would counsel her pastor to make sure that he always has his wife or some other mature believer present. We would not want to have this hurting, confused lady mistaking his display of Christian love and compassion for something it is not and then something inappropriate happening.

Agreed too.:thumbs:

 

Here is a good article of Church Discipline:

http://www.baptistpress.com/bpnews.asp?id=28404

(Just ignore the odd and out of place reference to the Founders in the middle of the article.)