I Peter 1:5

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salamander, Mar 22, 2007.

  1. Salamander

    Salamander
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    1Pe 1:5Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time.

    I never got a straight answer from the "dodge baller", maybe he won't bring his ball with him in this discussion.

    Whose faith is it we're kept by?
     
  2. James_Newman

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    I would say it is speaking of the faith of the believer. My question would be, what is the salvation Peter is referring to?
     
  3. Salamander

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    The final salvation of the believer when he has received his glorified body.

    Our faith has its instability in that it is effected by our feelings.
     
  4. Brother Bob

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    Unstable faith with "complete knowledge", yikes!!!

    Jam 1:6But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.

    Hbr 10:23Let us hold fast the profession of [our] faith without wavering; (for he [is] faithful that promised;)
     
    #4 Brother Bob, Mar 22, 2007
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  5. Rex77

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    Ga 2:16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

    Php 3:9 And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:

     
  6. Helen

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    Please notice how many times faith is preceded by the word "through." We are saved BY grace THROUGH faith, etc. When it is preceded by 'by', it appears to have the similar meaning of 'by way of.'

    Faith -- our faith in Christ -- is the road, if you will, by which God's grace travels. For some people their faith may still be a wilderness track, while for others it has been improved to the point of being a paved street, but nevertheless, it is through, or by way of, that faith that we receive God's grace as believers.
     
  7. Brother Bob

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    Yea, I don't think Christ would need faith in Himself. It is through "our" faith that we receive Grace. When you see face to face, then faith is no longer needed and I am sure the Lord can see himself. I always have wondered about that one.
     
    #7 Brother Bob, Mar 23, 2007
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  8. EdSutton

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    Did'ja notice that there is no (real) question as to the Greek text?

    Through (δια) faith in/of Christ (πιστεως χριστου )? Virtually every translation in the last 100 years, including the "less than stellar" paraphrase, render the genitive usage here, as "faith in Christ". This is consistent with the renderings of Gal. 2:16, as "faith in Christ". I agree that the NKJV, which is the usual Bible version that I use, has it right, but the other reading (faith of Christ) is just as permissible, linguistically. I Peter 1:5 means, therefore, exactly what is appears to mean.
    And the "salvation", here spoken of (as James_Newman pointed out and asked about), is not the salvation that I have already experienced - "we have been saved" (from sin's penalty), but of a yet future salvation - "we shall be saved" (from sin's presence) in glory. That is the salvation yet to be revealed. And as we say, here in the hills of KY, that salvation is "ready, willing, and waiting!"

    Ed
     
    #8 EdSutton, Mar 23, 2007
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  9. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    The mistake happening here is a compartmentalizing of salvation. There is not a linguistic or logical a reason to separate the current state of salvation ie the promise, from the future state of salvation ie complete glorification. They are all one in the same.
     
  10. Salamander

    Salamander
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    I suppose you'd condemn John the Baptist too.
     
  11. Salamander

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    Of course you think that, but again you fail miserably in Bible doctrine.

    The Lord is never required to have faith in Himself, He is God.

    What so many fail to see is that God is faithful and just. He is the Faithful Witness. His faith in the fact that all who will come to Him according to the Gospel of Jesus Christ will give Him Glory.

    It is too common a mistake to make "faith" solely belief, it goes much farther.

    It is His faith imparted to sinners that allows them to come to repentence.

    You dogmatical calvinists ought to be ashamed of yourselves to think it is our faith that brings us to Christ!:tonofbricks:
     
  12. tinytim

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    Surely you are not suggesting that Bob is a Calvinist.... Now that would be something!

    Bob is soooo not a calvinist.
     
  13. Amy.G

    Amy.G
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    No calvinist here.

    Romans 4
    5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness
     
  14. Salamander

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    Rom 4:3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
    Rom 4:4Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

    Rom 4:5¶But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

    I think you might have things a little confused here, it is faith in the Redemptive Work on Calvary that saves the soul from sin, but the righteousness of Christ only comes through the Blood of Christ.

    Abraham's faith only allowed him to enter Paradise, not Heaven.

    Are some somehow suggesting that God can only save those whose faith never wavers?
     
  15. Salamander

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    personal attack edited
     
    #15 Salamander, Mar 23, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 28, 2007
  16. EdSutton

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    While I agree that our future salvation is just as certain, as the present posession, they are logically not the same in time, or experience. Eph. 2:8 says "By grace you are (Lit. have been) saved through faith..." That verse is in the perfect tense, and is a past and current salvation, if you will, humanly speaking. The verse in question (I Pet. 1:5) speaks of a yet future salvation. They are simply not 'received', or even revealed, at the same time.

    Ed
     
  17. EdSutton

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    I am not one of those 'dogmatical calvinists (sic)' by any strtetch, and I believe we 'come to Christ' solely by believe/faith with "no additional baggage". And as I have said over and over that "repentance is the 'flip-side' of faith", as it were, it sounds as if you are the one who is the "dogmatic calvinist (sic)", here, for your statement about "imparted faith" is directly out of the Calvinistic (although not Calvin, himself, necessarily) playbook.

    Ed
     
  18. EdSutton

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    Amen, Amy.G!

    Ed
     
  19. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    We must be careful to take the passage in its context. Siping v. 5 out of the chapter and defining salvation is a mistake. look at v. 3. "hath begotten us again" Which speaks to "now", "unto a living hope" , "reserved in heaven" "kept by the power of God" the word kept in the greek gives the word pitcure of making a depsit in the bank before something happens to it which supports the "living hope" that we have. Peter is taling about a hope that is secure and incorruptable.

    The salvation we now have is in reality only a promise of the future which will be revealed at God's appointed time. There are not two salvations such as an immediate salvation and a future salvation. There is one death and one salvation for Christ died but once which was sufficient for eternity.
     
  20. Salamander

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    Nope, straight out of The Book.

    It is His Faith that will guarentee/ secure us who come to Him, not ours.

    True, it is by our faith we come to Christ, but only due to His faith imparted to us.

    Calvin wasn't wrong about everything, neither are calvinists.

    Don't confuse faith with simple belief.
     

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