independent baptist

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by FearNot, Apr 10, 2003.

  1. FearNot

    FearNot
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    I would like some independent baptist to please tell me what the main doctrines of your church are. If possible how you might be different from a normal conservative SBC church. Thanks.
     
  2. Preacher Nathan Knight

    Preacher Nathan Knight
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    We believe in many of the same doctines as conservative southern baptists. Here are our core beliefs:

    1 The Trinity
    2 Plan of Salvation (Gospel)
    3 Virgin Birth
    4 Security of the believer
    5 Water Baptism (symbolic of the resurrection)
    6 That the Word of God is perfect and infallible (we use KJV)
    7 We believe that the local church is to be self-governing.
    8 Missions
    9 Men are called to preach/pastor
    10 Fundamental principles

    There are many more but it would take forever to list them. I hope this is a help.
     
  3. All about Grace

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    Trying to pin down what "Independent Baptists" believe is a difficult task. They are an extremely splintered group that vary from the Tom Neals of the world to the Jerry Falwells (who actually made some ties to the SBC in recent years) to the Bob Jonesits to the Pensacola groupies to the Sword of the Lord people to the Hylesites. Each of these groups bring their own preferences to the table and are known to be very divisive over the non-essentials.

    One of the primary criticisms of some IFBers regarding the SBC is actually what may prevent the SBC from falling prey to similar splinterings: denominational structure & cooperative missions.

    At the root level of both groups, you will discover the basic few fundamentals of the faith but once you leave that terrain you are travelling where few dare to tread.
     
  4. go2church

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    Just for the record Southern Baptist churches (which there are not really any of) are independent baptists.
     
  5. mark

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    Baptist by definition are independent, however, Independent Baptists are not a splintered group, because they (we) are not a group. Many IBCs are similiar because they tend to be conservative in theology, but not all.
     
  6. All about Grace

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    IBs are not a splintered group? [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Having been an active part of both worlds, I can tell you I was far more involved in a group mentality in the IFB world than in the SBC. Define the word group as you desire, but IBs are as splintered as they come.
     
  7. Haruo

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    Curious. What do you mean be this? In what sense are Southern Baptist churches "independent baptists"? Isn't the disinclination to "Convention" involvement the hallmark of "independent baptists"? And in what sense are there "not really any" Southern Baptist churches? Are you saying all true Baptist churches are located outside the Southern US? Or what? I am genuinely uncertain how to take what you typed.

    Haruo
     
  8. Baptist Bible Believer

    Baptist Bible Believer
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    AN AFFIRMATION OF THE BIBLICAL FAITH OF BAPTISTS

    Ten to twelve thousand Christians from several thousand Bible-believing separatist Baptist churches assembled the int Fundamental Baptist Congress of North America in the Temple Baptist Church, Detroit, Michigan, September 30 through October 3, 1963, join in the affirmation that:

    1. We believe in the verbal, plenary inspiration of the Bible as originally written, as the inerrant, infallible and authoritative Word of God.

    2. We believe in one God who is the Creator and Sovereign Ruler of the universe who exists in three persons, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, and that He is an infinite God of Holiness and righteousness, as well as of love and grace.

    3. We believe in the doctrine of total depravity of all men born of Adam, and in the eternal condemnation and suffering of all such men who are not born again through personal faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.

    4. We believe that our Lord Jesus Christ is eternally very God of very God, and that He was made flesh through the virgin birth.

    5. We believe that Christ bore our sins in His own body on the tree, and died, having voluntarily offered Himself unto God as a vicarious, substitutionary sacrifice for us.

    6. We believe that His body was raised from the dead, and that He ascended to the right hand of the Father where He is the one and only Mediator between us and God, our all-sufficient High Priest, Advocate and Intercessor, and that He is coming again in power and great glory.

    7. We believe that the divine commission requires that we preach the Gospel in all the world, and that we baptize those who believe, and establish New Testament churches constituted only of born again persons, and teach them to be obedient to all the counsel of God. We believe that this can be accomplished only under the enablement of the Holy Spirit.

    8. We believe the other great distinctive Biblical doctrines historically held by Baptists, such as the separation of church and state, the priesthood of all believers, the purity of the church, the autonomy of the local church under the sovereign headship of Christ, the Biblical offices of pastors and deacons, baptism by immersion of believers in water, and the symbolism of the ordinances which are baptism and the Lord's supper.

    9. We believe that the Word of God forbids us to have spiritual fellowship with unbelievers, and to participate in organizations that permit the presence of modernism and modernists, such as the National Council of the Churches of Christ in the United States, the Canadian Council of Churches, The World Council of Churches, the Baptist World Alliance, and other such groups which tolerate liberal theology.

    10. We believe that the prophetic scriptures predict a great apostasy which will culminate in an anti-biblical one-world church. Therefore we are unalterably opposed to the present ecumenical movement which is building such a church and is fostered by both the World Council of Churches -- including Eastern Orthodoxy -- and the Vatican.

    The Congresses do not represent a continuing organization but are sponsored by a committee consisting of representative leavers from Bible-believing Baptist groups in North America. The current committee includes Dr. Joseph M. Stowell, Dr. A. V. Henderson, Dr. Harry Love, Dr. Monroe Parker and Rev. W. P. Bauman, cochairmen. Rev. Joseph Wade is the secretary and Dr. Chester J. McCullough is the treasurer. Other committee members are: Dr. Bryce Augsburger; Dr. R.E.J. Brackston; Dr. David A. Cavin; Dr. R. M. Cedarholm; Dr. David L. Cummins; Dr. Truman Dollar; Dr. W.E. Dowell; Rev. Lee Fick; Dr. Bob Gray; Dr. Eric T. Gurr; Dr. J. Don Jennings; Dr. E.S. Kerr; Dr. Harry Love; Rev. Joseph F. MacMullen; Dr. Monroe Parker; Dr. John Rawlings; Dr. Mitch Seidler; Rev. Harold Sightler; Rev. John Waters; Dr. Archer Weniger and Dr. Wendell Zimmerman.
     
  9. swaimj

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    Hey Baptist Bible Believer, thanks for your post. What is the source of your information for this? I have never heard of this congress but would like to find out more about it and if they ever met again.
     
  10. KPBAP

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    I think the comment about SBC being independent means SBC (individually) chose to affiliate or not to. I have viewed some IBC websites that state they use the KJV 1611 only.....well maybe the REVISED 1611. Most people could not read or understand the KJV 1611. Nelson publishers released a printing of the KJV 1611 some years back. Churches should be more honest in stating that maybe it is the 1951-52 revised version of the KJV 1611.
     
  11. Baptist Bible Believer

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    It is from the Foreward of an out-of-print book called the "Biblical Faith of Baptists" - a compendium of subjects dealing with the beliefs and teaching of independent Baptists.
     
  12. rsr

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    Haruo, I think what go2church means is that churches, as such, are not "members" of the SBC. Churches "cooperate" with the SBC and thus are entitled to send messengers to the annual convention, if they so desire.
     
  13. Tim Wright

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    Independent Baptist Churches
    Are not Governed by another Church Such as a mother church
    We believe that only Are Lord And God Should guide the church through His word
    Not some comity that tells Churches what they should teach or preach on cretin dates and times

    DOCTRINAL STATEMENTS
    Set forth in the Word of God to be believed and practiced by members
    Of local New Testament Baptist Churches.

    Article I --- The Doctrine of the Scriptures
    We Believe in the Scriptures of the Old and New Testaments as Verbally inspired by God; and inerrant in the original Writings; and that they are of supreme and final authority in Faith and Life.

    Article II --- The Doctrine of God
    We believe in one God, Eternal , Omnipotent , Omniscient , and Omnipresent, manifesting Himself in three persons --- Father, Son, And Holy Spirit --- One in nature, attributes, power, and glory.

    Article III --- The Doctrine of Jesus Christ
    We believe that the Lord Jesus Christ was begotten by the Holy Spirit,
    Born of the Virgin Mary, and that He is true God, and true man.

    Article IV --- The Doctrine of the Holy Spirit
    We believe that the Holy Spirit is a Divine person, the administrator of the Godhead, convincing of Sin, revealing Christ, teaching truth, restraining of evil, energizing believers in prayer, worship, and service; and is ever present in the believer as comforter and helper.

    Article V --- The Doctrine Concerning Man
    We believe that man was created in the image of God , that he sinned , and thereby incurred , not only physical death , but also spiritual death, which is separation from God. And , that all human beings are born with a sinful nature; and in the case of those who reach moral responsibility, become sinners in thought , word , and deed.

    Article VI --- The Doctrine of Salvation
    We believe that the Lord Jesus Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; as a representatative and substitutionary sacrifice and rose again for our justification; and that all who believe in Him are justified on the ground of His shed blood and are saved by Grace through faith, wholly apart from human merit and works.
    [​IMG] Tim W
     
  14. swaimj

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    Thanks BBB, I'm gonna check & see if I can find it.
     
  15. TomVols

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    Having been a former IFB and now a SB, there would be little doctrinal differences, save for most IFBs being adamantly KJVO and dispensational(Though some SB churches are, too). SBs are autonomous, as are IFBs. The main difference is in cooperation for missions and evangelism. SBs do more of this than IFBs.
     
  16. Daniel David

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    More missions or more evangelism? Or both?

    You forgot, more teaching and less hype.
     
  17. go2church

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    All Southern Baptist churches are independent and CHOOSE to be apart of what the SBC is doing through their gifts to the Cooperative Program (Missions Giving). Outside of that they are free to do as they wish. Example: In the state I live in a church only has to give $250 a year to the convention to be considered in good standing with the Southern Baptist Convention. What ministries we do other then this are up to us. We can even give our money and not go to meetings, or the convention and still be in good standing.

    The Southern Baptist have no members. All people in the convention are members of LOCAL churches and cooperate with the Southern Baptist Convention. You can be an employee but you can't be a member. Now some churches have a clause that they will always remain tied to the SBC, but that is a local church matter.

    Hope this helps
     
  18. Dr. Bob

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    So let me get this straight (I'm not buying the semantic game here). There is no "membership" requirement, doctrinal requirement, sign-on-the-dotted-line for my church to be SBC?

    As long as I give $250 to the Cooperative Program, I am a full-fledged member?

    Or is it the opposite. I'm NOT a member of the SBC at all because there really are no SBC churches. Just churches that support the Cooperative Program?

    I'm missing something here. Big time. Trying to look at this logically.

    If John Doe is a member of XYZ Baptist Church and XYZ Baptist church is a member of the Southern Baptist Convention, then John Doe is a Southern Baptist, right?
     
  19. go2church

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    Yes, in the state I live in that is the case. Although it is understood that you agree with either the 1963 or 2000 BF&M, you don't have to sign anything and no one checks. In this state (New Mexico) we have Hyles type and CBF types. in fact an American Baptist Church just joined.

    Some states, Florida as an example I believe requires you to affirm the 2000 BF&M. Which takes us back to the whole independent thing. The state conventions are independent, the associations are independent and the churches that make up these are independent. The connection is missions support

    Technically (sematics if you wish) there are not any SBC churches, we cooperate together in support of missions as independent churches. This as become cloudy in the recent past with the changes in the convention, which emphasize the convention more then the local church. But it still stands that to have any position in the assocation, convention (state or national) you must be a member of a local baptist church in support of the Co-op Program
     
  20. go2church

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    This might help explain better what I am trying to explain.

    The Baptist Convention of New Mexico
    Bylaws
    As amended October 24, 2000


    Article One: Autonomy and Cooperation
    The Baptist Convention of New Mexico (the or this Convention) recognizes and shall steadfastly honor and respect the autonomy and independence of each church. This Convention, while seeking fellowship with all Baptist bodies which share the Conventions purposes, shall be independent and sovereign in its own sphere and shall never attempt to exercise any authority over any other Baptist body, church association, convention or auxiliary body.

    Article Two: Seating of Messengers
    Section 2. As an autonomous Baptist group, the Convention reserves the right to determine what constitutes a cooperating Baptist Church. Churches shall be considered in friendly cooperation who are sympathetic with the purpose and work of this Convention, having demonstrated cooperation by contributing a minimum of $250 to Cooperative Program through the BSNM during the twelve months immediately prior to the call to order of the annual or special meeting of the Convention. The faith and practices of each cooperating church, in the opinion of the Convention session, shall not be in conflict with Scripture. The Convention in session shall be the final judge of the qualifications of its members.
     

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