Is America at war, or not?

Seeing the response of a few of the poster here, does one have to wonder why the US is imploding????

Khrushchev (sp) nailed it when he said, "We will bury you".

He obviously could foresee the inevitable result of liberals getting stronger in the affairs of the USA, when very few citizens could (Myself included for a long time)!

Well, we're seeing the results now, and they ain't good for mainstream Americans.

The misguided average Joes/Janes will wake up one day, but by then it'll be far too late to effect any remedy.

 

I told you already. So, for the fourth time, what about the 1996 indictment?

Why are you so angry at me?

 

You could have said that in the first place.

The reason I'm frustrated is because the principles of American justice are near and dear to me. I plan on going to law school once I finish my B.A. in political science and I don't like seeing the government play games with justice like it did under the Bush admininstration. If they hadn't already been tainted, perhaps military commissions would have been okay. I just think when you try non-state actors in a military commission it's a slippery slope.

 

When someone attends law school they ought to study the original law and the principles behind it instead of the endless stream of corruptions that have come forth at a compounding rate in modern times.

 

These were the reasons President Bush gave in his 11/13/2001 order for the "Detention, Treatment, and Trial of Certain Non-Citizens in the War Against Terrorism":

"Section 1. Findings.
(a) International terrorists, including members of al Qaida, have carried out attacks on United States diplomatic and military personnel and facilities abroad and on citizens and property within the United States on a scale that has created a state of armed conflict that requires the use of the United States Armed Forces.
(b) In light of grave acts of terrorism and threats of terrorism, including the terrorist attacks on September 11, 2001, on the headquarters of the United States Department of Defense in the national capital region, on the World Trade Center in New York, and on civilian aircraft such as in Pennsylvania, I proclaimed a national emergency on September 14, 2001 (Proc. 7463, Declaration of National Emergency by Reason of Certain Terrorist Attacks).
(c) Individuals acting alone and in concert involved in international terrorism possess both the capability and the intention to undertake further terrorist attacks against the United States that, if not detected and prevented, will cause mass deaths, mass injuries, and massive destruction of property, and may place at risk the continuity of the operations of the United States Government.
(d) The ability of the United States to protect the United States and its citizens, and to help its allies and other cooperating nations protect their nations and their citizens, from such further terrorist attacks depends in significant part upon using the United States Armed Forces to identify terrorists and those who support them, to disrupt their activities, and to eliminate their ability to conduct or support such attacks.
(e) To protect the United States and its citizens, and for the effective conduct of military operations and prevention of terrorist attacks, it is necessary for individuals subject to this order pursuant to section 2 hereof to be detained, and, when tried, to be tried for violations of the laws of war and other applicable laws by military tribunals.
(f) Given the danger to the safety of the United States and the nature of
international terrorism, and to the extent provided by and under this order, I find consistent with section 836 of title 10, United States Code, that it is not practicable to apply in military commissions under this order the principles of law and the rules of evidence generally recognized in the trial of criminal cases in the United States district courts.
(g) Having fully considered the magnitude of the potential deaths, injuries, and property destruction that would result from potential acts of terrorism against the United States, and the probability that such acts will occur, I have determined that an extraordinary emergency exists for national defense purposes, that this emergency constitutes an urgent and compelling govern-ment interest, and that issuance of this order is necessary to meet the emergency."

He made perfect sense! Unfortunately, we just couldn't follow through with it.

 

>They do not deserve Constitutional protection!!!

What does "deserve" have to do with applying the Constitution to people who live under the force and control of the US government? What does being born at a specific location have to do with deserving?

>When someone attends law school they ought to study the original law and the principles behind it instead of the endless stream of corruptions that have come forth at a compounding rate in modern times.

The people who wrote the original law wrote it is such a manner that we are to be governed by case law and not by the original law. If they wanted us to be governed by the original law the screwed up and we have to live with it unless there is another Constitutional Convention or another revolution.

 

The most absurd post ever made on this board.............ever

 

Anybody notice a pattern here??:BangHead::sleep:

 

It's called "the rule of law." Try and keep up if you can.

 

This illustrates the problem with today's thinking! The Constitution, by this account, is a document that can be "changed" by the seated government through new laws, rules, or interpretations which establishes new precedence that then leads to further change. It can not - it can only be changed by proper amendment.

 

Think about what you're saying!

Don't forget that Obama is giving away more legal "rights" to enemy terrorists for acts of war than we grant to our own military service members for violations of the UCMJ.

 

Carpro, if you had as much respect for our troops as you try and make everyone believe you wouldn't keeping using them as club to beat up on your opponent whenever a light is shown on the weakness of your position.

What do you know about truth anyway? You hung on every lie the neocons and the Pentagon's "message force multipliers" ever uttered then turned around and repeated their lies as if they were the gospel. Time and time again.

You were lied to then you repeated those lies, over and over. Then whenever it was brought up or someone disagreed you wrapped yourself in the flag and grabbed on to the troops and started swinging them around as if they were some kind of lethal weapon. Talk about disrespect.

You have no room to question my respect for our military people after the way you've used them.

Nation building is not war. Our young men and women shouldn't be led to believe they are fighting for something they are not. And when it is discovered they have been thrown in harms way for a pack of lies . . . the honorable thing to do is tell them the truth and get them out as fast as possible without a pile of guilt being thrown on them for believing in their dishonest leaders.

 

I think the last thing anyone in the service wants to hear is that they're fighting an unjust war, a hopeless war, or following the orders of corrupt leaders. I think they get real sick and tired of hearing that. If it were the truth then so be it because it would do no good to lie to them. But the trouble is that it is not the truth! They deserve to know that they are fighting a just war, that there is success and hope for more of it, and that, by and large, there leaders are honorable and seeking to protect our nation against our enemies. All this talk about "nation building" verses war is meaningless to the man on the ground, in the air, or the sea. To them it's all part of the fight and they see it progress from outright combat, to stability operations, to helping the vanquished restore some order and peacefulness to their society. The hope is - and, sure, it has risks - that history will remember their scarifies favorably and, perhaps, some friends will come forth from where their were once enemies. A warrior that keeps hearing his cause is wrong or foolish will sooner or later, given enough of it, abandon it as discipline of even his immediate leaders begins to fad. We all better hope that doesn't happen to us. We also need temper our criticism of foreign policy to exclude demeaning the adventures to which we commit men and women to die.

 

There's a "fatal error" in your logic.

"Just wars" aren't started with a pack of lies Dragoon. To hear you tell it corrupt politicians and self serving international corporitos should be able to lie to our faces and get a free pass for using our people and trillions in tax dollars to gain power and profit. Just because you say an unjust action is just doesn't make it just . . . no matter how many times you keep "catapulting the propaganda".

Everyone knew the WMD claims were fake.

But then truth and logic doesn't count when our brothers and sisters lives are on the line do they? All that matters is the mission, right or wrong, right?

Turning a blind eye to the crimes of the corrupt who've used our people in order to loot our treasure is less than honorable. No American ever born has a duty to die so the IMF and global corporitos can gain control of foreigner's resources.

Your logic in this subject is in err and it's proving to be fatal to those who you claim to care so deeply for.

 

This is just false. Speech after speech was given on the house floor by both liberals and conservatives for years as to the intelligence reports on WMD's. And we still do not know how much was moved into Syria since we lng announced our going into Iraq before we ever got there.