is he Jewish?

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Forever settled in heaven, Jul 26, 2006.

  1. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven
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    check out this picture (for some reason it's not showing even using the image tags):

    http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?blobcol=urlimage&blobheader=image%2Fjpeg&blobkey=id&blobtable=JPImage&blobwhere=1153292003882&cachecontrol=never&ssbinary=true

    given different garb, he might've passed off as Lebanese or Palestinian, no? (perhaps someone w Photoshop ability cld show the contrast of him in a kaffiyeh?)

    was wondering what sets him off as different, "chosen," besides the uniform n insignia?

    is it his faith, possibly?
     
    #1 Forever settled in heaven, Jul 26, 2006
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  2. James_Newman

    James_Newman
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    Genesis 17:10 This is my covenant, which ye shall keep, between me and you and thy seed after thee; Every man child among you shall be circumcised.
     
  3. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven
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    that's true. but i believe most other Semite males (e.g. Muslims) r also circumcised.
     
  4. KenH

    KenH
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    I am Scotch-Irish and I was circumcised.

    I don't understand the point of this thread.
     
  5. pinoybaptist

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    The OP seems to be saying that the Jews are not a chosen people as some here say, and James Newman seems to be saying that the sign of their being chosen is their circumcision.

    I do not agree with Forever Settled's conclusion that circumcision is not a sign exclusive between Jehovah and the nation Israel since Muslims are also circumcised because the Muslims came many, many, many, many years after Abraham, and also, if the other peoples in the Middle East (Jebusites, Amalekites, etc) were circumcised then there would have been no uniqueness to the sign Jehovah chose.

    Having said that, I believe that after the cross, there are no more national chosen people. National Israel is no more a chosen nation today than Borneo is. There is, and has only been, one Israel from the beginning, and that is Spiritual Israel composed of Jew and Gentiles from all nations who were chosen by God as His people from before the foundation of the world.

     
  6. KenH

    KenH
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    Amen and amen.
     
  7. poncho

    poncho
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    Second that.
     
  8. Linda64

    Linda64
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    Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever. (Jeremiah 31:35-36)

    And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me. (Jeremiah 32:40)

    Sure looks like the Lord is speaking of the NATION of Israel here. God does not break His promises. God has NOT forsaken His people. Israel has NOT been replaced by the Church. Church is not even mentioned in the OT.

    LAMED. For ever, O LORD, thy word is settled in heaven. (Psalms 119:89)

    Here is an interesting article-- a Floor Statement by Senator James M. Inhofe (R-OK)--actually there are two Floor Statements--one on December 4, 2001 and March 4, 2002. Here are the links:

    http://www.dunamai.com/articles/Israel/absolute_victory.htm (Dec. 4, 2001)
    http://www.dunamai.com/articles/Israel/peace_in_middle_east.htm (March 4, 2002)
     
  9. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven
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    huh, how did my statement (more like a question) turn into a "conclusion"? :smilewinkgrin:

    my point's that circumcision means nothing if it's not that of the heart--i.e. an acknowledgement of God's provision of the Saviour.

    fr what i've heard, this hasn't been the practice of the Jewish religion, nor have they been too quick to embrace Yahweh Himself, Christ our Lord:

    Professor Israel Shahak quoted by David Duke.

    Moderator note: The quote given by poster has been removed--reason: Quote is from a known member of the Ku Klux Klan and is noted for hatred of Jews and the African-American race.
     
    #9 Forever settled in heaven, Jul 26, 2006
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  10. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven
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    no, there's been no replacement on a permanent basis.

    sure, the original olive branches that have been hacked off sit at the base of the tree, n gentile wild branches currently are being ingrafted in their place.

    but God won't forget His promise--one day ALL Israel will be saved, when the full number of the Gentile church has come in. fr a premill, pretrib perspective, this is after the Gt Commission's run its course n the Millennial Kingdom of Christ on earth is set up. it's then that David's tent will be put up again, n the Branch will reign fr Zion w a rod of iron.

    but until then, Paul (in Romans 11) speaks of a temporary replacement of branches on the tree n is thus able to warn gentile grafts against thumbing their noses at the nation who was rejected for rebellion.
     
  11. Linda64

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    There is no replacement period--Israel was set aside (not replaced) until the "fulness of the Gentiles" has come in---that happens when God has finished "grafting in" the Gentiles --then He will resume His purpose for the Nation of Israel. The "times of the Gentiles" is different than the "fulness of the Gentiles"--the "times of the Gentiles" (Luke 21:25). The "Times of the Gentiles" is the Gentile rule over Jerusalem, which began at the time of the Babylonian captivity in 605 BC and will end at the Second Coming of Christ after the Tribulation.
     
  12. carpro

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    This is way too deep for me.

    I believe the nation of Israel and the Jewish people enjoy no special status in God's kingdom until and unless they have accepted Christ as their savior.

    He is the only way.

    End of story.
     
  13. Forever settled in heaven

    Forever settled in heaven
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    sounds like semantics class to me.

    where do people "set aside" dismembered olive branches?

    does anything get grafted in their place?

    if so, what's the act of grafting something in the place of something "set aside"?

    or are we trying to save Paul fr the charge of "replacement theology"? :D
     
  14. genesis12

    genesis12
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    It's Scots-Irish, Ken. Scots-Irish.

    You go, Linda! Right arm! Farm house!
     
  15. pinoybaptist

    pinoybaptist
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    Oh, okay, I stand corrected. Apologies.
     
  16. pinoybaptist

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    There has never been a replacement, and there never will be, because of the simple reason that there is nothing to replace.
    God's Israel has always been Spiritual Israel, composed of those whose names He wrote in the Lamb's Book of Life, whom the Lamb of Glory redeemed with His blood.

    National Israel's sole purpose in God's economy was that it is through this branch of humanity that the Messiah was to come, and to whom the Scriptures had been delivered out of all the nations of the earth.

    Just as Gentiles were not supposed to boast that God has revealed to them the grace that is in Christ, and not to the nation of Israel, so the Jews were not to boast that they were children of Abraham, since God is able of stones to make children unto Abraham.

    The final analysis is no man can boast. God is Sovereign, and He disposes mercy to whom He wishes to dispose mercy.

    These Scriptures were written for the learning (Romans 15:4)of those who belong to the true kingdom of God, Zion, which is within each and every one of his elect children (Luke 17:21), and Jesus Christ already reigns in Zion.

    When Paul said "All Israel will be saved", he is not referring to those who are of national Israel only, but "all Israel" refers to all who are of the Kingdom of God, Jew or Gentile, and the salvation spoken of is not eternal but timely - salvation from Judaism in the case of Paul's letter's context -which establishes its own righteousness through the law.

    Check out the context of the letter beginning at Chapter 9 through 11.

    The time will be when all who are children of God and chosen in Christ will know of the Savior, and turn to Him, the Living God, from their idols.
     
  17. DHK

    DHK
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    There is a big difference between "setting aside" and "replaced."
    My electric kettle no longer works. It needs to be replaced. It has no more usefulness. Thus the replacement is necessary.

    I have an eight cup coffee maker, but I am the only one that drinks coffee. I am going to buy a two cup coffee maker and set aside the eight cup coffee maker. I will set it aside because I know that it will still be useful in the future (when we have company, etc.) It is set aside because of its value, its usefulness. It is not replaced becasuse it is no longer useful.

    Those that believe in replacement theology say that the church has replaced Israel, and like the broken kettle has no more usefulness in God's sight. God has discarded them completely. This is a heretical theology.

    The Bible says in Romans 11 that God has simply set Israel aside for a short time. They are blinded to the gospel. Some day they "will all be saved," they will look upon him whom they have pierced, and they will mourn." God is not finished with them yet. Like the 8-cup coffee pot, he has simply set them aside for a future time.

    It is not a very adequate illustration, I know. But it shows that there is a difference between setting aside something and replacing something.
    DHK
     
  18. rsr

    rsr
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    Quoting David Duke quoting Israel Shahak does not lend credibility to your cause, no matter its other merits.
     
  19. KenH

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    It can be spelled either way.
     
  20. Pipedude

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    It might be helpful to note that the question "Who is a Jew?" has a long history within the Jewish community. There is no final answer, because every attempt at formulation breaks down under the weight of insurmountable inconsistencies.

    Those of us who are outside the debate are playing with high voltage wires when we grab this issue and pontificate.
     

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