Is Repentance Necessary For Salvation?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Linda64, Feb 20, 2007.

  1. Linda64

    Linda64
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    This is part of an article by John R. Rice: What Must I Do To Be Saved?

    WHAT ABOUT REPENTANCE?

    Does not the Bible say that we must repent? Yes, the Bible plainly says that "God ... commandeth all men every where to repent" (Acts 17:30), and again, "Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish" (Luke 13:3, 5). This was the preaching of John the Baptist, of Jesus, of Peter and of Paul, that men should repent. And certainly repentance is God's plan of salvation. The trouble here, however, is that men misunderstand what repentance means, and there has grown up an idea that repentance means a period of weeping and mourning over sin, or sorrow for sins. This idea comes from the Douay Version of the Bible which instead of "repent" says "do penance." So the place of inquiry, where people should be taught the plan of salvation from the Bible, in revival meetings, became "the mourner's bench" and thousands of people have been taught that God would not hear their prayer nor forgive their sins until they went through a process of sorrow and mourning over their sins!

    Do not misunderstand me. God is anxious for you to have a penitent, broken heart over your sins. You have gone away from God. You have trampled under foot the blood of Jesus Christ, wasted years of your life which you can never live over again. You have served your father, the Devil. There is plenty for you to weep over, and I am not surprised if you feel deep shame and sorrow in your heart that you have so mistreated the God who made you and the Saviour who died for you. I am not surprised if you cannot keep back the tears! But what I want you to know is that tears or no tears, however much sorrow you may have in your heart, or not have, those things do not save you.

    You ought to be sorry for your sins and ashamed of them. "Godly sorrow worketh repentance" (2 Cor. 7:10)--the right kind of sorrow leads to immediate repentance, but mourning is not itself repentance.

    "Could my tears forever flow,
    Could my zeal no respite know,
    These for sin cold not atone;
    Thou must save, and Thou alone."

    To repent literally means to have a change of mind or spirit toward God and toward sin. It means to turn from your sins, earnestly, with all your heart, and trust in Jesus Christ to save you. You can see, then, how the man who believes in Christ repents and the man who repents believes in Christ. The jailer repented when he turned from sin to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.

    http://www.wayoflife.org/whatmust.htm

    Biblical repentance means much more than just remorse--true biblical repentance results in a change of life. The topic of our sermon this morning was: "What does it take for someone to confess 'I have sinned'." There were four men mentioned in today's message that said 'I have sinned'--Pharoah (Exodus 9:27; 10:16); Achan (Joshua 7:20); King Saul (1 Samuel 15:24,30; 26:31); and Judas Iscariat (Matthew 27:4). Of those four, I think Achan was the only one who was truly repentant---but that might be questionable. The other three were simply remorseful--it wasn't godly sorrow (2 Cor. 7:10-11). Just would like your thoughts on this topic.

    _________________
    "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose."
    ....Jim Elliott
     
  2. AAA

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    God will not save anyone that has not repented....If God has not worked repentence within thier heart, then that is a sure sign that GOD has NOT regenerated that person and therefore that person is forever lost, unless GOD saves that person by HIS GRACE with the shed BLOOD of Jesus and the power of the Holy Spirit..........

    We can NOT earn our salvation through repentence.........Eph 2:8-9, and Titus 3:5...

    :godisgood:
     
  3. Tom Butler

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    In Acts 2, Peter's response to those who asked "what shall we do" was--Repent.
    The Lord saved 3,000.

    In Acts 17, at the end of Paul's sermon on Mars Hill, his exhortation to his listeners was--Repent. Some of them were saved.

    Repentance and faith are two sides of the same coin.

    Faith without repentance--isn't.
     
  4. Linda64

    Linda64
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    Quote by B.H. Carroll:

    When a sinner repents and turns from his/her sins and turns to God, there will be a change in behaviour. If a person says "I am saved" and has no desire for the things of God, then I would question the sincerity of that person's profession of faith. I was married to one of those persons for almost 20 years until he drank himself to death.
     
  5. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    And yet there are many who claim to be a "christian" because they simply follow Jesus. When you ask them about the cross, the blood or repentence they will tell you that it isnt necesary to focus on those things. Brian McLaren calls anyone who focuses on the cross as blood thirsty. This ideology is prevelant in the world but specifically in the EC movement.

    Unless we kneel before the cross of Christ we shall never see the kingdom of God. To say that all we have to do is simply "follow Jesus" sounds good but his a half truth and a false gospel.
     
  6. IfbReformer

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    If someone has no change in them, no desire for the things of the Lord and simply clings to a time when they said a prayer or walked an aisle there is good reason for that person to doubt their salvation.

    However there is a flip side to that, if the person has seen some change in their life, and they do have a desire to please the Lord, but still have some giants in their life they have not allowed God to give them the victory over, this person has every reason to believe they are saved.

    It our belief on Christ and the resulting change(no matter how big or small) and that desire, that provides us with the confidence we have before God that we are saved. Do not misunderstand me, we are not saved by our works, neither do our works necessarily prove our salvation - it is what is in our heart, the Holy Spirit of God that is our guarentee of salvation, and only we as individuals know if we have the Spirit of God in us or not.

    Yes many times we fail God, we may even deny him with our mouth in a moment of fear or anger, but deep in our hearts we never loose that belief and desire if we are truly his.

    Repentance is the flip side of belief. In the scriptures Repentance is dependant upon its context. It is not always about turning from sin. More often it is about chaning our mind about who we are as a sinner and trusting in Christ as our Lord and Savior.

    Here are some brief examples:

    This last example is a one in which repentance is used in conjunction with sin:

    IFBReformer
     
    #6 IfbReformer, Feb 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 21, 2007
  7. Lacy Evans

    Lacy Evans
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    Are you talking about repentance from sin (ie. You have to quit sinning before you can be saved)? Because that doctrine makes salvation absolutely impossible. No one can stop sinning without the indwelling Holy Spirit. You must be saved before you have the Holy Ghost to empower you to quit sinning.

    Or are you talking about repentance from dead works? (You must turn from trusting in your own goodness) If it's this one then the answer is yes.


    Also, are you talking about the eternal salvation of the spirit that an unbeliever needs, or the temporal salvation (from chastening and temporal destruction) of the soul that a believer needs to work out with fear and trembling?
     
  8. Linda64

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    Did you not read the entire OP? Here is what John R. Rice says:
    There are many unsaved people who stop smoking, drinking, etc. You don't need the Holy Spirit to do these things. And simply stopping these things, does not save you. Repentance is a turning from sin (admitting to God that you are a sinner) and turning to God, which results in a change of life.

    Repentance from dead works has nothing to do with repentance unto life/salvation. (2 Cor. 7:10-11) There is only ONE salvation--the salvation of the soul--there is NO temporal salvation. There is NO Protestant Purgatory found in the Bible--no temporal destruction!! We are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise until the day of redemption:

    In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise, Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory. (Ephesians 1:13-14)

    The Philippian jailor had a repentant heart when he asked Paul & Silas "What must I do to be saved?" Repentance is implied here.

    You have yet to give scriptural proof of temporal salvation and temporal destruction. That doctrine reeks of the Roman Catholic heresy of Purgatory.
     
  9. Lacy Evans

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    It's curious you accuse me of Roman Catholic leanings when your OP is designed to prove their very view of salvation.

    Do you or do you not agree with those two ststements?

    Lacy
     
  10. ituttut

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  11. StraightAndNarrow

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    What did Jesus say to the rich young ruler concerning his salvation? You have your answer.
     
  12. Linda64

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    Why would I agree with the statements of the Council of Trent? I disagree with the RCC--it is a false church which leads thousands to eternal damnation in the Lake of Fire. We are not talking about "justification by faith" here. We are discussing your doctrine of "temporal" salvation, punishment and destruction (how is one "temporally" destroyed anyway?), which does reek of the RCC heresy of Purgatory. The RCC does not believe that the blood of Jesus was sufficient to "purge" us from all our sin, so therefore, one must spend time in a "temporal" place called purgatory and get "purged" for the uncovered sins, for an indefinite amount of time. Protestant Purgatory gives them 1,000 years to get "purged".

    Re-read the fiirst paragraph of my OP for why repentance is being misunderstood as "works".
    The Douay Version is the Catholic version--VERY different from the KJV.

    Check out this Catholic site for more insight into the RCC heresy of Purgatory:

    http://www.scripturecatholic.com/purgatory.html

    The RCC teaches alot about "temporal" salvation and punishment.
     
  13. Brother Bob

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    Will not be nothing temporal about the punishment or eternal life with the exception of the soul going to hell of the wicked until judgement day and then both death and hell will be cast into a lake of fire and brimstone. I don't think they will even get any relief then.
     
  14. Lacy Evans

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    When I posted here the first time and mentioned a temporal punishment, I was not necessarily talking about in the next life (although you are correct that I believe that.)

    The soul (seat of emotions) can be destroyed in this life (mental illness), If you continue in sin, God can turn you over to a reprobate mind (an unbeliever is already reprobate). God might also destroy your flesh. If he does, it will be temporal because you will rise again.

    By not sinning and being obedient you can be "saved" from chastening.

    he told Saved individuals in Acts 2:38 to repent and be baptised (an act of obedience) for the remission of sins. this was not so they could be "saved" again in an eternal sense. they needed to be obedient followers of Christ and getting saved doesn't make you a follower. Following Christ makes you a follower. Getting saved gives you the power to "repent."

    Lacy
     
  15. Lacy Evans

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    "If anyone says that justifying faith is nothing else than confidence in divine mercy, which remits sins for Christ's sake, or that it is this confidence alone that justifies us, LET HIM BE ANATHEMA"

    This statement! Are you sure you disagree with it?

    Because I do.

    Faith plus nothing!

    We are saved by nothing else than confidence in divine mercy, which remits sins for Christ's sake, or that it is this confidence alone that justifies us.

    Not Faith plus quit sinning.
    Not faith plus obedience.
    Not faith plus saying a prayer.
    Not faith plus walking an isle.
    Not faith plus an emotional experience.
    Not faith plus asking Jesus "into your heart".
    Not faith plus "repentance" (if by repentance you mean anything else than repenting from trusting in anything but the blood of Christ to save me.)

    Faith alone! I am (to the RCC) ANATHEMA!

    Are you?

    Lacy
     
  16. Brother Bob

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    All of this is because Adam sinned and brought it upon us. Jesus is our way to overcome it.

    I believe the soul is much more than that. Who are all those souls under the altar of God.

    Yes, but not from "mental illness", physical death.
    If the unbeliever is already a reprobate then how can he ever be saved for the reprobate will believe a lie and be damned, unless I am mistaken.

    Rom 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

    2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness

    I believe the two scriptures are talking about the same things.
     
    #16 Brother Bob, Feb 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 21, 2007
  17. His Blood Spoke My Name

    His Blood Spoke My Name
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    It is more than faith, Lacy. Calling on the name of the Lord (prayer), Confession with the tongue (admitting you have sinned), Repenting (turning from sin to God)... all these are necessary for Salvation.

    How can one say one has faith in Christ when one refuses to turn from sin? ONe is loving another master which the Word says one cannot do.

    If you love Christ, you are going to hate sin. You are going to repent of being the sinner that you are. Everything that opposes that which is the Word of God will be the very thing you abhor the most.

    Including false doctrines such as The born again Child of God spending 1000 years in outer darkness or hell to be purged. It is not in Scripture, so the Child of God should not even entertain such thoughts.
     
  18. ituttut

    ituttut
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    Excellent.

    The RCC and many others are standing on the foundation that James is on.
    James 2:22-24, "Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
    23. And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
    24. Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only." These folks are looking for the "Kingdom to come", and after we are taken at the rapture, they will really begin in earnest to say that prayer they pray over, and over, and over, with their "hail Mary's". They will be praying the Lord's Prayer for real that Jesus told His Apostles to pray, for unbeknownst to them, and most today in Christendom, this is the prayer for the Jew in the Tribulation period.

    We stand on that other foundation. Roman 3:26-30, "To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.
    27. Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
    28. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
    29. Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
    30. Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.”

    We are not to try and come as those "circumcised in the flesh".
     
  19. Linda64

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    What do you mean, am I sure I disagree with it? Is it because I believe that one must repent from sin and turn to God for salvation that you ask? Repentance is NOT a work. Unless you confess (agree with God) to God that you are a sinner in need of a Saviour and then turn from sin and turn to God, you have NO salvation. God gives the sinner repentance and faith. I repeat, REPENTANCE IS NOT A WORK!
    We are saved by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone. Works FOLLOW faith. (James 2:20-26, taken in context)

    "Not Faith plus quit sinning." Romans 6:1-2 explains your first statement on faith. It follows Romans 5, the great chapter on "justification by faith".


    "Not faith plus obedience." Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. (John 14:23)


    "Not faith plus saying a prayer." Confess your faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much. (James 5:16)

    Pray without ceasing. (1 Thessalonians 5:17)

    Watch and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak. (Matthew 26:41)

    "Not faith plus walking an isle. (do you mean aisle?); Not faith plus an emotional experience.; (faith is not an emotional experience); Not faith plus asking Jesus "into your heart". (faith is the belief in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross of Calvary for your sins)

    "Not faith plus "repentance" (if by repentance you mean anything else than repenting from trusting in anything but the blood of Christ to save me.)" Trusting in the blood of Christ to save you is "confessing to God that you are a sinner in need of a Saviour, and turning from sin and turning to God" (repentance)

    "Faith alone! I am (to the RCC) ANATHEMA! Are you?" By faith alone, do you mean trusting that the shed blood of Christ on the cross of Calvary was sufficient to save us from ALL sin? The RCC does not believe this--that is why they had to make up a heresy called "Purgatory" The teaching of a "temporal" punishment (as the RCC teaches) and sending the Christian to hell for 1,000 years, is NOT trusting in the finished work of Christ on the cross of Calvary, (that His shed blood is sufficient to forgive, cleanse & purify the believer from all sin).


     
    #19 Linda64, Feb 21, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2007
  20. ituttut

    ituttut
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    I believe you are agreeing with Lacy. I hope so.
     

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