Is The Church Guilty Of Putting...

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by TCGreek, Mar 25, 2008.

  1. TCGreek

    TCGreek
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    Is the Church guilty of putting Eschatology, the study of Last Things, on the back burner?

    I brought this matter up for a reason: not a few Christians are content in slighting the End Times. They say, "Whatever happens, happens!" Or, "Just make sure that you're prepared to meet your God!"

    Does Scripture invite us to pay closer attention to the End Times? I certainly think so.

    "11 Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives 12 as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat. 13 But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, where righteousness dwells" (2 Pet 3:11-13, TNIV, emphasis mine).
     
  2. skypair

    skypair
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    TC,

    You are absolutely correct!! I am currently reading Dave Hunt's book JUDGMENT DAY! and whereas I wouldn't recommend it and whereas it is filled with Islamic hatred of Israel chapters (my blood literally boils!), it still is very necessary. Israel exists right now as a nation again for a purpose! In fact, it is an extreme foreboding of things to come!

    I would have everyone consider first what a miracle Israel's revival is! Until 1948 there was not one Christian religion that believed, aside from faith in the Bible, that this was going to happen. And ever since then, Jerusalem has been a "hot potato!" Even Israel wouldn't take it in 1967! Yet that is where the tribulation temple is to be built!

    Do y'all see the last church -- Laodicea? Man, I'm starting to get convicted on this one! Materially I look at my life and (I was praying this last night), I have need of nothing. Yet I don't trust anyone nor even God if I gave it all up (thinking of the church in Acts 2:45). Would you? This is such a crass generation, is it not? TC, we are closer then we think!

    How many prophecies do you see "coming to a head" now?

    skypair
     
    #2 skypair, Mar 25, 2008
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  3. Tom Butler

    Tom Butler
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    Interest in the end times seems to run in cycles. For those old enough to remember, Hal Lindsey's "Late, Great, Planet Earth" triggered an enormous interest. Copycat books flew off the presses, mostly from the dispensational point of view, to be snapped up quickly. Movies came out (Remember "Thief in the Night"?) and there was a prophecy conference on every corner, and rapture songs were big hits.

    One's view of eschatology was often a test of fellowship. If you weren't pre-trib you were a flaming liberal and might not be saved. Post-tribbers, mid-tribbers and A-mils were heretics.

    We were convinced that the rapture was coming in a week or two. When it didn't happen, and time contined to pass without it, interest began to wane.

    There has been a recent flurry of interest in the wake of the "Left Behind" books and movies and the instability in the Middle East, but I don't detect that there much serious study of the end-time events, or much serious teaching about them. Maybe some major upheaval there will stir wide-spread interest again.
     
  4. Palatka51

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    As long as there is an interest in the end times there is a good chance that it will not happen so soon.

    2 Peter 3:3&4
    3Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
    4And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

    Just something to think about.
     
  5. TCGreek

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    There's a difference, my friend. Those were false teachers and they were scoffers.

    May I remind of Paul's Aramaic--Marana tha.
     
  6. webdog

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    We definately don't teach enough on the end times...and Heaven. Randy Alcorn's book Heaven was the first time I actually pondered what Heaven will be like! Amazing! You would think believers who have eternal life would like to know how it will come about and what it will be like.

    IMO, John MacArthur has a solid understanding of eschatology (even though his soteriology is a little off :))
     
  7. TCGreek

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    Dave Hunt, I don't know what to think of that fellow. Is he helpful?

    I am reading Pentecost's Things To Come. Have you read that one?

    Today's church, the church @ Laodicea? I don't know.
     
  8. TCGreek

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    I have a friend who has read Alcorn's Heaven, but doesn't think much of it. I haven't read it; so I don't know.

    Just this week I was listening to MacArthur on the End Times: Why Every Self-professing Calvinist should be a Premillennialist?

    Webdog, even you might find it worthwhile.
     
  9. webdog

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    Did he say why? I'm coming to find out many believers have a gnostic view of what Heaven will be like...and many of the visuals put forth by Alcorn from Scripture turn that whole strumming harps on a cloud mentality upside down.
    I believe I have heard it, and you are corrct, it is worthwhile. His exegesis on Revelation is one of the best I have seen.
     
  10. webdog

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    stupid double post...
     
  11. TCGreek

    TCGreek
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    Well, he found it too speculative. He thought Alcorn took too much of a creative approach. I'll try to read it this year.

    The Bible doesn't say a whole lot about heaven, either. So I don't know what to expect from Alcorn's book.

    Are you referring to his book Because The Time Is Near? I have both his study Bible and whole commentary on the Bible, so I never bothered to get that one.
     
    #11 TCGreek, Mar 26, 2008
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  12. webdog

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    I read the book, and while some things may be speculative...other things are dead on, IMO, things I never thought about before (cities, cultures, nature, etc.). I'll have to re-read it soon...it's been a while.

    The Revelation study I'm thinking of is just a chapter by chapter exegesis of Revelation. I think it is found on his site...as I read it online (and his study Bible).
     
  13. LeBuick

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    I will admit TC, I don't deal with it much at all. I know it's my weakest area yet one we should all desire. Even when I preach from Rev or Daniel I tend to stay on the surface and not draw many finite conclusions because I really don't know.

    How about you? Do you deal with it much?
     
  14. TCGreek

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    Well, on Wednesday night at church, I'm teaching Revelation. My primary text has been that of prof. Grant Osborne in the Baker series, published in 2000. He leaves no stone undisturbed.

    Then I've been following an outline by Dan B. Wallace of DTS. click here.
     
  15. TCGreek

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    Are you finding Dave Hunt helpful?

    Well, we just have to wait and see how all things are going to unravel.

    But I'll be careful not to get on the planning committee. I've read and heard of too many failures.
     
  16. Allan

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    I believe this to be a growing truth in our churches today.
    In all that we do it should be done becauase of 1) Him and what He has done, and 2) He soon return - what He will do.

    We as believers are to keep both before us at all times. Even coming together (assembling) aught to be done in light of the fact He is returning (Heb 10:25)

    I think the church either puts to much emphasis on one side or the other. On the one side they will most often focus on Christ and what He has done (doctrine) and there is nothing inherently wrong with that except for it's tendency to slight Eschatology.

    But on the other side some focus more on His return (prophesy) many times to the detriment of proper doctrine.

    I think a balanced understanding will keep a church from a not caring attitude (so-to-speak) an from falling away from biblical doctrine. That we will stay the course knowing in whom we have beleived and that His return is soon. And at His return He might find us faithful and good stewards who excitedly awaited their masters return. Did not Jesus say "when the Son of Man returns, will he find faith in the earth?"
     
    #16 Allan, Mar 26, 2008
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  17. Crabtownboy

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    Personally, I think many spend far too much time on 'end times' and not enough on the 'here and now.' We need to be out and doing.
     
  18. D28guy

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    TCGreek,

    Many times...yes. Very much so.

    Thats a shame.

    I do as well.

    Grace and peace,

    Mike
     
  19. Tom Bryant

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    Part of the problem with preaching about eschatology is that we do fail to teach it the same way we would teach any other doctrine. In most doctrines we go from verse to verse and build it precept on precept. But with eschatology, we tend to go from verse to newspaper headline in an attempt to show that it could happen today.

    While it could happen today, Paul seemed to think that it would happen in his life time: "Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together..." So we ought to teach it, but we ought to teach it systematically.

    While I am at it, another pet peeve of mine about preaching about last things is that we preach it without regards to what it ought to change in our lives. The Biblical authors always said that if we have this hope we ought to to pure. If we have this hope, we ought to be steadfast in our labor for the Lord. The fact that Jesus would come is not to puff up our heads but to send us out to serve Him more faithfully.

    HERE ENDETH THE RANT... :laugh:
     
  20. Palatka51

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    Thanks TC;

    I got to thinking about this post, after the fact, late last night. As it was in the days of Noah It took him 100 years to build the ark. I can see him on a hill sawing and hammering, framing and measuring, painting with pitch and hinging the door. Mean while he is drawing a crowd of scoffers and for those 100 years he endured it. As the flood neared, the scoffers and false teachers grew. That is what Peter is referring to here.

    Again, much thanks to you my brother but I had already been moved in my spirit as to the true context of 2 Peter 3:3&4. I just did not have the time to post a retraction until this morning.

    Blessings

    Mel
     
    #20 Palatka51, Mar 26, 2008
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