Is Warren an ecumenicalist?

If I'm praying, I'm not speaking to Arabs.

We're talking about the Inaugural prayer. He was speaking to God but it was a U.S. gov't ceremony for Americans and English is generally speaking our language.

 

I understand what you are saying, but I do not believe tha RW's prayer or the prayer of any others in these situations is simply a prayer in the sense that you and I mean prayer. If we really thought it was Mr. Warren praying for Mr. Obama the we would not be debating if it was appropriate or not. Any invocation or benediction is not just a prayer but also by the nature of it, includes communication to others in attendance. We may not like it, we might not even agree with it, but that's the way it is.

Do you ever have someone open a church service in prayer and they pray in silence? Not to say it never happens but it would be a rare occurance.

 

I am sure it is different in different languages...

JEsus is not even the name given to him.. it is the translated word from Greek..

Jesus is the Greek equivelant to Yeshua...

Joseph and Mary called him Yeshua... which is Hebrew.

It would be interesting to hear from JoJ to see how the Japanese translate Jesus.

And as for hispanics.. our state convention is doing a hispanic ministry, and I will call him Heysus... That is his name in Spanish.

 

An ivocation is still praying to God. I think using the English name for Jesus is sufficient in that situation. We are in the U.S. and English is what we speak, at least at national official functions.

Any opening prayers I've heard in church, and I've been asked to pray the opening prayer once in a while in my SS class, are always addressed to the Lord. There's no issue here of addressing people.

 

I know Jesus is not the Greek or Hebrew name, but since English is my native tongue, I'll use "Jesus." Just as English is our national tongue, "Jesus" is just fine. Imo, using the Koranic name for Jesus is misleading and possibly confusing.

Perhaps you have not the experience I've had of Christians in evangelical circles arguing with me that good Muslims go to heaven.

 

God has been using pastor Warren to reach more people than all his critics combined.

 

Maybe, maybe not, but that's not the issue.

One of the things I really was upset about as a new believer was all the sacred cows in the church. If someone gives a public prayer and brings it up on the BB, I'll give my views just like everyone else.

You were not around then I don't think, but earlier a lot of threads came up on RW related to PDL and I defended him even though there is a lot in that book I didn't like. I thought some parts were very good. People have called him a New Ager and I've defended him against that.

 

YOu are probably right.. I have yet to run into a evangelical Christian that argues that good Muslims go to Heaven.

Yes, I use "Jesus".. normally, but when speaking to my Spanish Speaking Friends, I use "Heysus".. Especially since some of them don't know much English.

I have also talked to Muslims.. I didn't know the proper name for Jesus in Arabic.. but I have used "Jesus", and they understood.

I still think RW was driving home the point that he can pray in Jesus' name anytime he wants too. and atheists were not going to stop him...

He not only prayed in HIS name in English... but in the other languages also to drive home the point! There was no mistaking, no matter what language a person speaks, who RW was praying to.

I'm surprised, some here haven't condemned him for speaking in tongues. :laugh:

 

Marcia, yes, I missed that.

I've picked my fights with pastor Warren. For example, I thought that his sales pitch on Fox News was reckless, but once I read his The Purpose of Christmas, I thought that he had gotten the Message right.

But he does provoke us...

 

I also address any public prayer to God, as did RW. However, when you or I do a public prayer you are also aware that others are listening. Agreed? Therefore the public prayer will be different than a private prayer. I took RW's use of the multiple names for Christ as a way of saying "Look how many ways I can pray in Jesus name" to those who want to stop us from doing so. I just don't see anything wrong with that.

 

Yep, this it well said.:applause:

Sooner or later we all have to look around and see how the Gospel is being spread in our midst. Seems to me that Pastor Warren is leveraging his God given influence to attempt to reach as many people as possible in his lifetime. So the only question I have for his detractors is: what are you doing to make disciples in your life and sphere of influence?

 

Yes, I am aware others are listening. I still see no reason to use a name other than Jesus. Perhaps if one were praying in a place with Messianic Jews, one might say "Yeshua." But that would be for believers. I see no reason to change the way I say Jesus otherwise if I'm praying in English in the U.S.

I am not really as bothered with this part -- I think it's a minor point - as I am with MLK and the "cloud of witnesses" in heaven cheering Obama's inauguration or presidency.

 

Thanks for your acknowledgement!

I want to go on record with that - I have defended RW in the past on the BB against some very strong attacks. However, I still disagree with other things he's said or done, sometimes strongly. I think I try to be fair.

But I don't like it when celebrity Christians are untouchable.

 

Marcia, you are fair!

 

Go to my website and see.

How many believers were talking to Wiccans 10 years ago and since? How many Christians have done outreaches at Marilyn Manson concerts to the teens attending? Answering emails from unsaved people who don't like churches and don't attend them but have questions? Urged Christians to welcome people coming to church with purple hair and piercings (this was in the mid and late 90s)? Sat on a sidewalk and chatted with a teen selling hallucigens? Gone into a witchcraft store and engaged in a 45 min. discussion with the owner and a customer about Jesus? Are discipling an ex-Wiccan and a former follower of mediums who did spirit contact? I could go on, but you get the idea and there is not enough room here anyway.

You and others have no idea what I or others on the BB may be doing in our lives for the Lord. I have been in full time ministry going on 11 years and if you count the years doing it part-time - going on 15 years.

So I think the urgings that Christians here who criticize someone (as you put it 'detractors') need to go out and preach the gospel or disciple people needs to be addressed only to those that you know are not doing this. I am not going to be reprimanded wrongly.

 

How did Christ do it?

 

Thank you, Tim! :wavey: